# Moto: Loathesome Pustule **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [June 22, 2005, 3:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moto-loathesome-pustule/309370 "2005-06-22T15:02:32Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2005, 3:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moto-loathesome-pustule/309370/1 "2005-06-22T15:02:32Z")
Man, do you ever _suck_! > **[An excellent argument explaining Bush's drive to war](https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=322131)** > > This is the most compelling and the most deeply disturbing argument for the real reason George took us to war that I have read. Securing oil? Just a bonus. Avenging Daddy? I don’t really think so. But this is exxtremely logical, and supported by... Wherein I expressed my concerns as to the extent of Israeli influence on American foreign policy. Valid concerns, in my estimation. Point of clarification: I admire the state of Israel, if a collective fact can be admired in the same way as a person of character can be admired. Her tenacity against all odds, her resilience and sheer cussedness all speak well of her. The religious persuasion of the majority of her citizens is of zero consequence to that estimation, I admire the Japanese and have no opinion regarding Shinto or Buddhism. If I were to criticize America’s alliance with Japan, would that make me anti-Buddhist? Of course not, and no one here would be foolish enough to suggest such a thing. Put simply, I am not now, nor ever have been, anti-Semitic. It distresses me greatly to have to make such a statement, I regard it as a given. I shouldn’t even have to say such a thing, any more than I should have to confirm that I am not a child molestor. But **Moto** has made it necessary. > [@The Aforementioned Loathesome Pustule](#): > > …When you blame stuff on the Jews, you’re in such fun company. This is nothing but a thinly veiled accusation of anti-Semitism. No substance is offered, no argument made to the points raised, nothing but a cowardly _ad hominem_ attempt to Durbinize a political opponent. Unable to confront my opinions directly, he goes for the backstab. Called on it by **ETF** , he cannot muster any defense, can only repeat and underline a libel, a slur, and a lie. It is degrading to even have to defend oneself against such. As it happens, I do, in fact, believe that America has invested far too much in Israel. I come by that opinion honestly, and despite my stated and sincere admiration for that state. I should be entirely free to make such an assessment and profer such an opinion without having to defend myself from a reprehensible character assassin. I am comforted that no one who knows me will credit such a slur for an instant. As for the rest, _feh!_, as we say in Lubbock. **Moto** , I squeeze a pimple on my nutsack and produce more integrity and character than you have displayed here. If you have the capacity for shame, now is the time to use it. ---
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2005, 3:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moto-loathesome-pustule/309370/2 "2005-06-22T15:04:43Z")
I didn’t think you were anti-Semitic. But I think you did commit a Volvo fallacy. ---
**Author:** ![Mtgman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b5a626/32.png) [@Mtgman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mtgman)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2005, 3:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moto-loathesome-pustule/309370/3 "2005-06-22T15:10:18Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > as we say in Lubbock Lubbock! Ok, here is the important question. Have you ever been a student at Texas Tech? Because being a Red Raider or not is far more important than being an anti-semite or not. Enjoy, Steven ---
**Author:** ![Sophistry\_and\_Illusion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b3f665/32.png) [@Sophistry\_and\_Illusion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sophistry_and_Illusion)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2005, 3:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moto-loathesome-pustule/309370/4 "2005-06-22T15:14:40Z")
I’m with \*\*elucidator \*\* on this one. Even if you leave in the sentence about the connection between Israel and certain strands of Protestant Christianity, s/he still hasn’t said anything that could be remotely construed as anti-Semitic. Throwing around accusations of anti-Semitism at people who criticize Israel is extremely weak (let’s all get out our dictionaries and look up ‘ad hominem’); but unfortunately, it is a strategy that still works in some circles. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Moto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9de0a6/32.png) [@Mr.Moto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Moto)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2005, 3:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moto-loathesome-pustule/309370/5 "2005-06-22T15:14:58Z")
Sorry. Allow me to clarify. I do not think you are necessarily anti-semitic. I do, though, think you peddle strange conpiracy theories that are shared by rabid Jew haters. And your musings about end-time theology and its impact on our foreign policy is indeed a strange conspiracy theory. It’s nutbar stuff, and puts you in with some low disgusting creatures. Explore it all you want to, but I do reserve the right to call it what it is. ---
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2005, 3:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moto-loathesome-pustule/309370/6 "2005-06-22T15:18:40Z")
Luc, would you say that the Christians you cited are anti-Semitic? ---
**Author:** ![Sophistry\_and\_Illusion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b3f665/32.png) [@Sophistry\_and\_Illusion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sophistry_and_Illusion)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2005, 3:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moto-loathesome-pustule/309370/7 "2005-06-22T15:20:53Z")
> [@Mr. Moto](#): > > Sorry. Allow me to clarify. > > I do not think you are necessarily anti-semitic. I do, though, think you peddle strange conpiracy theories that are shared by rabid Jew haters. > > And your musings about end-time theology and its impact on our foreign policy is indeed a strange conspiracy theory. It’s nutbar stuff, and puts you in with some low disgusting creatures. > > Explore it all you want to, but I do reserve the right to call it what it is. I respectfully disagree. (Are we allowed to respectfully disagree in the Pit, or do we have to call the person we are disagreeing with a hamster-cramming goat felcher?) Anyhow, it is a fact that in many parts of the US, Protestant Christians of a fairly conservative character have a great deal of influence in politics, and politicians cross them at their peril. It is also a fact that such Christians take a great interest in the welfare of the State of Israel (you don’t ever hear them calling Saudi Arabia ‘The Holy Land.’) Politicians from many states therefore realize that it is not in their political interest to take a hard line with Israel. All of this is factual. None of it is conspiracy theory. ---
**Author:** ![NurseCarmen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/5daacb/32.png) [@NurseCarmen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NurseCarmen)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2005, 3:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moto-loathesome-pustule/309370/8 "2005-06-22T15:25:00Z")
Huh. Answering an accusation of using a Circumstantial Ad Hominem with… A Circumstantial Ad Hominem! Novel approach! ---
**Author:** ![Sophistry\_and\_Illusion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b3f665/32.png) [@Sophistry\_and\_Illusion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sophistry_and_Illusion)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2005, 3:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moto-loathesome-pustule/309370/9 "2005-06-22T15:29:50Z")
> [@NurseCarmen](#): > > Huh. Answering an accusation of using a Circumstantial Ad Hominem with… > A Circumstantial Ad Hominem! > > Novel approach! Meh…I’ll be good and not defend myself so we can return to our regularly-scheduled Pitting. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2005, 3:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moto-loathesome-pustule/309370/10 "2005-06-22T15:31:50Z")
> [@Sophistry and Illusion](#): > > Meh…I’ll be good and not defend myself so we can return to our regularly-scheduled Pitting. I believe **NurseCarmen** was responding to **Mr. Moto’s** post up above yours. I think you’re in the clear. ---
**Author:** ![Squink](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5e925/32.png) [@Squink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Squink)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2005, 3:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moto-loathesome-pustule/309370/11 "2005-06-22T15:31:57Z")
> [@Mr. Moto](#): > > I do, though, think you peddle strange conpiracy theories You do know Franklin’s been indicted, don’t you? [http://web.israelinsider.com/Articles/Politics/5806.htm](http://web.israelinsider.com/Articles/Politics/5806.htm) ---
**Author:** ![Gorsnak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gorsnak/32/7587_2.png) [@Gorsnak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gorsnak)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2005, 3:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moto-loathesome-pustule/309370/12 "2005-06-22T15:34:15Z")
> [@Mr. Moto](#): > > Sorry. Allow me to clarify. > > I do not think you are necessarily anti-semitic. I do, though, think you peddle strange conpiracy theories that are shared by rabid Jew haters. > > And your musings about end-time theology and its impact on our foreign policy is indeed a strange conspiracy theory. It’s nutbar stuff, and puts you in with some low disgusting creatures. > > Explore it all you want to, but I do reserve the right to call it what it is. This is complete bullshit coming from the guy who is continuing to criticize Durbin for pointing out (entirely truthfully, if not in a particularly constructive fashion) that the descriptions of abuses at Guantanamo put one in mind of various nasty regimes. This statement, “you peddle strange conspiracy theories that are shared by rabid Jew haters” is, even if true, a comparison of precisely the same sort that you so decried when Durbin made it. I conclude that you are nothing but a base hypocrite. ---
**Author:** ![NurseCarmen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/5daacb/32.png) [@NurseCarmen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NurseCarmen)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2005, 3:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moto-loathesome-pustule/309370/13 "2005-06-22T15:34:36Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > I believe **NurseCarmen** was responding to **Mr. Moto’s** post up above yours. I think you’re in the clear. Yep. Thanks JayJay. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2005, 3:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moto-loathesome-pustule/309370/14 "2005-06-22T15:36:55Z")
> [@Mtgman](#): > > Lubbock! Ok, here is the important question. Have you ever been a student at Texas Tech? Because being a Red Raider or not is far more important than being an anti-semite or not… As a native of Waco (quiet little town, you never heard of it, nothing ever happens there…) my loyalty is sealed to the feared and dreaded Baylor Bears Q: Why does Texas A&M schedule games with Baylor? A: Because Aggies are too stupid to practice with tackling dummys. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2005, 3:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moto-loathesome-pustule/309370/15 "2005-06-22T15:45:39Z")
> [@Liberal](#): > > Luc, would you say that the Christians you cited are anti-Semitic? In an odd way, yes. Not directly, almost innocently, but they make an ancient and worthy tradition little more than bit players on their stage, in support of a theology that is more Steven King than Francis of Assisi. ---
**Author:** ![Scott\_Plaid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/258eb7/32.png) [@Scott\_Plaid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scott_Plaid)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2005, 3:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moto-loathesome-pustule/309370/16 "2005-06-22T15:55:50Z")
**elucidator** , you posted Israel, and a likely sounding possibility into a thread. It was not in anyway the same thing as the conspiracy screed I often see. However, it did mention the idea of the least bit negative about something. Thus, I suspect Moto’s brain inserted the often seen screed in place of of your actual words, inside his head. I often see this happening with republicans. For example, Durbin didn’t say “Bush is a nazi”, he said some much more nuanced, which had an actual point to it. However, I see pub responding to his statement **as if** he said “Bush is a nazi”. Pity them, for they only have slots in their head to insert agreement, not actual weighing of issues. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2005, 4:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moto-loathesome-pustule/309370/17 "2005-06-22T16:00:09Z")
> [@Mr. Moto](#): > > Sorry. Allow me to clarify. > > I do not think you are necessarily anti-semitic. I do, though, think you peddle strange conpiracy theories that are shared by rabid Jew haters. > > And your musings about end-time theology and its impact on our foreign policy is indeed a strange conspiracy theory. It’s nutbar stuff, and puts you in with some low disgusting creatures. > > Explore it all you want to, but I do reserve the right to call it what it is. What utter, self-serving, mealy mouthed rot! “Clarify”, my ass, you ain’t “clarifying” shit, you’re just trying to dress up your slur in a nice costume, hoping it will be mistaken for a reasonable opinion. In case you haven’t noticed, you’re not fooling anybody. You made no attempt to substantiate any of this, even when challenged to do so, politely and with considerable decorum by **ETF**. No pretense of argument was made, merely a repitition of the same disgraceful libel. You have every right to “call it what it is”, no reservations required. What you don’t have the right to do is to backstab a political opponent you do not otherwise have the wit or substance to tangle with. Only the first word has any resemblance to truth, a “sorry” sumbitch is exactly what you have made yourself. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2005, 4:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moto-loathesome-pustule/309370/18 "2005-06-22T16:12:25Z")
> [@Mr. Moto](#): > > Sorry. Allow me to clarify. > > I do not think you are necessarily anti-semitic. So you think he’s _possibly_ anti-semitic? > [@](#): > > I do, though, think you peddle strange conpiracy theories that are shared by rabid Jew haters. > And your musings about end-time theology and its impact on our foreign policy is indeed a strange conspiracy theory. It’s nutbar stuff, and puts you in with some low disgusting creatures. > > Explore it all you want to, but I do reserve the right to call it what it is. [/quote] There’s nothing “strange” or conspiratorial about the fact that Israel plays a major role in a lot of nutball endtimes fantasies. They think that Israel has to be restored to its Biblical boundaries and that the Temple has to be rebuilt before Jesus can come. A lot of “Left Behind” types support Israel and oppose a Palestinian state for that very reason and they’ll tell you so. They also think that whatever Jews survive Armageddon will be converted to Christianity. They do NOT believe that Jews can go to Heaven as unconverted Jews. The people who believe in this sort of rubbish have a lot of political clout these days and politicians are forced to pander to them. They do indeed have an arguably disproportiate influence on US policy _vis-avis_ Israel. It has long been a part of Neocon philosophy that the US should establish a puppet “democracy” in the Middle East which could also provide the US with a military base. Iraq was considered the ideal spot. We also know without question that it was Bush’s intention to invade Iraq from day one, and the religious right’s support of Israel is not an unreasonable or “anti-semitic” motive - or at least partial motive- to postulate about. I would have thought it beneath you to go to the “Jew hater” card. Maybe you should reconsider the wisdom of it. People might mistake you for a chickenshit, cheap shot artist. ---
**Author:** ![EddyTeddyFreddy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eddyteddyfreddy/32/18796_2.png) [@EddyTeddyFreddy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EddyTeddyFreddy)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2005, 4:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moto-loathesome-pustule/309370/19 "2005-06-22T16:14:13Z")
I will say here what the rules of GD forbade there: **Mr. Moto** , you are a despicable cur. ---
**Author:** ![Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hentor_the_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2005, 4:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moto-loathesome-pustule/309370/20 "2005-06-22T16:16:47Z")
For whatever reason, **Mr. Moto** lately has turned off his brain. I can only assume that he’s going through a tough time, yet also continuing to post. My best guess is that this is the early stages of Cognitive Dissonance remission. **elucidator** , during this time, like withdrawal from other substances, the conservative who has suckled at the teat of Rove for years will experience the shakes (noticed mostly around the knees) and the DTs. He or she will experience a counterintuitive spurt of more extreme nonsensical oppositional partisan bullshit as a part of the personality battles to maintain control that is slipping away. It is a delicate time, during which he may relapse quite easily. It surely must be an exhausting process. Give him time and lots of cold compresses. When CD goes into remission, it’s a real bitch. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moto-loathesome-pustule/309370.md?page=2)