# Movies that praise "settling" and "knowing your place" **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [August 18, 2013, 6:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-that-praise-settling-and-knowing-your-place/666544 "2013-08-18T06:11:51Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Skara\_Brae](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f0a364/32.png) [@Skara\_Brae](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skara_Brae)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2013, 7:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-that-praise-settling-and-knowing-your-place/666544/61 "2013-08-19T19:54:41Z")
> [@Cayuga](#): > > Sorry. Thanks for the correction. > > But the movie promotes the idea that rich people should stay with rich people and working-class people should stay with working-class people, no? I sure remember being surprised by that the last time I saw it. > > (i.e., Tracy remarrying Dex and Mike staying with photog gal is presented as the right thing to do, not as any sort of tragic circumstance.) Not to belabor this movie, but I don’t think that’s quite the idea the movie is promoting. Tracy remarried Dex because she realizes that 1. He’s still in love with her and 2. She’s a better woman with him that she would be with George or Mike. The movie does make a point about working class, but I am not sure it means they should always stay in the same class. Tracy offers to let Mike live in her summer cottage so he would have more time to write and he turns her down flatly, saying the time artists relied on patrons was long past. He didn’t want to be dependent on her. ---
**Author:** ![smokey78](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/82dd89/32.png) [@smokey78](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smokey78)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2013, 9:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-that-praise-settling-and-knowing-your-place/666544/62 "2013-08-19T21:23:21Z")
I’m reminded of the opposite of knowing your place from all ironies, an Edith Wharton novel: The Buccaneers…where readers were surprised of the UnWharton-like ending. The protagonist decides she’s better off leaving England instead of dutifully sticking w/her first husband and runs off with the first guy she actually preferred to South Africa. What is most convenient (well in the film that I saw not sure if the book did it) was first husband killing himself? I also thought of the book, She’s Come Undone. Where the main character accepts her fate and even accepts she’s too poor to make changes about her fate. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2013, 12:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-that-praise-settling-and-knowing-your-place/666544/63 "2013-08-20T00:07:24Z")
How about _God’s Step Children_, which is the movie you watch if you think _Imitation of Life_ had just too happy an ending. ---
**Author:** ![friedo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/8edcca/32.png) [@friedo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/friedo)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2013, 12:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-that-praise-settling-and-knowing-your-place/666544/64 "2013-08-20T00:27:31Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > But Dante had been trying his entire adult life to stop being a clerk. But it kept dragging him back. He finally gave up and just submitted. He bought the Quick Stop and now he’ll never leave it. > > Why should this be seen as a victory? Dante was always miserable being a clerk. Why would anyone expect him to suddenly be happy about spending the rest of his life working behind a counter? Because now he doesn’t have to show up when he’s not supposed to be there. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2013, 1:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-that-praise-settling-and-knowing-your-place/666544/65 "2013-08-20T01:43:59Z")
There’s NEEDFUL THINGS, where Max von Sydow tempts a string of small-town New Englanders with stuff they’d do anything to get; Ed Harris proves to be the one man who can stop that ruinous spiral of _make-a-deal-with-the-devil_ folly, as helpfully foreshadowed when first he meets the villain of the piece: "So, what can I sell you, Sheriff? “Me? Nothing. I got everything I need, thanks.” ---
**Author:** ![Werekoala](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/7993a0/32.png) [@Werekoala](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Werekoala)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2013, 1:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-that-praise-settling-and-knowing-your-place/666544/66 "2013-08-20T01:56:17Z")
**Gone With the Wind**? **Moby Dick**? ---
**Author:** ![zamboniracer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e9a140/32.png) [@zamboniracer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zamboniracer)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2013, 2:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-that-praise-settling-and-knowing-your-place/666544/67 "2013-08-20T02:38:56Z")
> [@Unauthorized\_Cinnamon](#): > > I have to confess, I really like it when a story goes in this direction. My therapist once suggested I watch _Rudy_, as an inspiration for dedication and belief in one’s self. I just couldn’t get past the question, “What would he have done if he didn’t get into Notre Dame?” The two reasonable answers seem to me to be “Kill himself” or “Live in disillusioned misery for the rest of his life,” not “Bounce back and enjoy his life as it is.” The whole, “You can be anything if you only try hard enough and believe!” schtick is pretty misleading, IMHO. The real message of\* Rudy\* is that if you really, really, really, really, really, really, make a pest of yourself, people will give you a chance just so as to get you to stop pestering you. This technique works both for big-time college football programs, and for Hollywood studies who you can really, really, really, really, really, really pester to make a big budget movie about your 30 seconds of playing time at said big time college football program. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2013, 3:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-that-praise-settling-and-knowing-your-place/666544/68 "2013-08-20T03:19:36Z")
> [@friedo](#): > > Because now he doesn’t have to show up when he’s not supposed to be there. Really? You figure he doesn’t need to care anymore now that the business is in his name? All he’s done by buying the store is cut off his chances of ever escaping the job he’s always hated. ---
**Author:** ![friedo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/8edcca/32.png) [@friedo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/friedo)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2013, 4:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-that-praise-settling-and-knowing-your-place/666544/69 "2013-08-20T04:25:46Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > Really? You figure he doesn’t need to care anymore now that the business is in his name? All he’s done by buying the store is cut off his chances of ever escaping the job he’s always hated. You are aware these films are _comedies_, right? ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2013, 4:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-that-praise-settling-and-knowing-your-place/666544/70 "2013-08-20T04:33:20Z")
> [@friedo](#): > > You are aware these films are _comedies_, right? So? Are you saying a comedy can’t have a story? ---
**Author:** ![Wendell\_Wagner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/8491ac/32.png) [@Wendell\_Wagner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wendell_Wagner)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2013, 7:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-that-praise-settling-and-knowing-your-place/666544/71 "2013-08-20T07:57:48Z")
Why do you think that Dante would have been happier marrying Emma, moving to Florida, and taking the job managing the carwash that his father-in-law owned? I thought it was made clear that this wasn’t his dream but Emma’s. She had decided that he wasn’t the sort of man she had planned to marry, so she would make him that sort of man. She had planned to marry one of the popular, successful guys that she had dated since high school who would graduate from college, maybe go to business school for an M.B.A., and work his way up to a high-level job at a big corporation. After dating and getting dumped by a string of such guys, she found herself in her thirties dating a guy who had dropped out of college and whose jobs consisted of things like convenience store clerk and fast food restaurant cashier. She decided that she would marry him and move back to Florida so he could take over management of her father’s carwash. She would stay home and have kids while he spent sixteen hours a day slowly building up the business into a nationwide chain of carwashes. He would have to continue to do that until the point that he died of a heart attack from the stress just before retiring. She would then be a rich widow. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2013, 9:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-that-praise-settling-and-knowing-your-place/666544/72 "2013-08-20T09:05:26Z")
> [@Wendell\_Wagner](#): > > Why do you think that Dante would have been happier marrying Emma, moving to Florida, and taking the job managing the carwash that his father-in-law owned? I thought it was made clear that this wasn’t his dream but Emma’s. She had decided that he wasn’t the sort of man she had planned to marry, so she would make him that sort of man. She had planned to marry one of the popular, successful guys that she had dated since high school who would graduate from college, maybe go to business school for an M.B.A., and work his way up to a high-level job at a big corporation. After dating and getting dumped by a string of such guys, she found herself in her thirties dating a guy who had dropped out of college and whose jobs consisted of things like convenience store clerk and fast food restaurant cashier. She decided that she would marry him and move back to Florida so he could take over management of her father’s carwash. She would stay home and have kids while he spent sixteen hours a day slowly building up the business into a nationwide chain of carwashes. He would have to continue to do that until the point that he died of a heart attack from the stress just before retiring. She would then be a rich widow. He might have hated living in Florida and managing a car wash. Who knows? Maybe he never had a chance of escaping. But at least he had the hope that escape was possible. The movie was watching that hope being crushed. We know he hates being a clerk. That was the main theme of his life. He spent years trying to escape. And it’s not like he had some epiphany at the end of the movie where he suddenly decided being a clerk was okay. No, he just gave up and accepted it was his fate. Do you remember the last scene of the movie? Dante’s back in the Quick Stop. The movie turns to black and white and he’s serving the same customers he was serving twelve years earlier (literally, it’s the same actors). Dante says to Randall: _“Today is the first day of the rest of our lives.”_ Soul Asylum begins playing on the soundtrack: _They say misery loves company/We could start a company and make misery/Frustrated Incorporated_. Seriously, you think this is a happy ending? Do you need to have a literal sign saying “Abandon All Hope”? This is Dante in Hell finally realizing his damnation is eternal. ---
**Author:** ![Push\_You\_Down](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/push_you_down/32/9095_2.png) [@Push\_You\_Down](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Push_You_Down)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2013, 9:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-that-praise-settling-and-knowing-your-place/666544/73 "2013-08-20T09:19:53Z")
But it’s his CHOICE. That’s the big deal. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2013, 1:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-that-praise-settling-and-knowing-your-place/666544/74 "2013-08-20T13:05:45Z")
> [@Push\_You\_Down](#): > > Shrek–if you are ugly only another ugly person will love. I’m not sure Fiona really settles in that sense (and in no way does Shrek settle). She only settles in that she has to learn to accept her “ugly” form. And, anyways, the real broken Aesop is that people should stick with their own kind. Remember, Donkey’s romance with the Dragon is just played for laughs. > [@Push\_You\_Down](#): > > But it’s his CHOICE. That’s the big deal. And he chose to settle. In the end, staying in the shop was his best choice. He can’t escape, because that’s literally the best life has to offer. The only reason it doesn’t fit this thread is that this isn’t presented as a good thing. ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2013, 1:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-that-praise-settling-and-knowing-your-place/666544/75 "2013-08-20T13:26:58Z")
> [@zamboniracer](#): > > The real message of\* Rudy\* is that if you really, really, really, really, really, really, make a pest of yourself, people will give you a chance just so as to get you to stop pestering you. This technique works both for big-time college football programs, and for Hollywood studies who you can really, really, really, really, really, really pester to make a big budget movie about your 30 seconds of playing time at said big time college football program. Yeah, I’ve always been frustrated with Rudy; the movie basically says that "Yes, you can be a loser with a pipe dream, but if you hang around long enough and be pathetic enough, someone will eventually throw you a worthless bone and let you play for one play at the end of a total blowout. Then, people will somehow confuse this wretched loserdom with some kind of story about hope and determination, and make a movie about it. There’s nothing inspirational about that movie; it’s like when they let the special needs kid play or elect them homecoming king or queen, except that this Rudy asshole should have known better, being ostensibly not mentally disabled, but apparently pathetic and without shame. That movie is an example of a movie that SHOULD have been about settling or “knowing your place”. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2013, 1:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-that-praise-settling-and-knowing-your-place/666544/76 "2013-08-20T13:46:47Z")
I think we can count X-MEN: THE LAST STAND, where the mutant superheroes are offered the chance to give up their powers and lead normal lives; most of them say _‘no’_ and keep fighting the good fight; one of them says _‘yeah, okay, sounds cool, sign me up,’_ and honestly doesn’t seem to regret a thing at the end of the movie, where she’s just enjoying a little quiet time with her boyfriend. (The upcoming movie will probably have her go off in a different direction, but as of right now it seems to fit.) ---
**Author:** ![storyteller0910](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecae2f/32.png) [@storyteller0910](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/storyteller0910)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2013, 7:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-that-praise-settling-and-knowing-your-place/666544/77 "2013-08-20T19:47:56Z")
> [@WhyNot](#): > > Disney’s Beauty and the Beast. It pained me terribly when it was pointed out the me, because it’s my favorite Disney film, but it’s true. Belle sings her first song about how she wants “adventure in the great wide somewhere” inspired by her books, and then she ends up sitting around in a castle with a great library…but very little adventure. Apparently the adventure of finding her Twoo Wuv was all the adventure she needed, and now she can settle down with a new stack of books. I think this is making a lot of assumptions about what happens after the credits roll. These are two young people, newly married, with a giant army of loyal friends and retainers and essentially limitless wealth. The Prince, we know, has been stuck in his castle for ages, and Belle has always longed to see and do great things. I see no in-text reason to believe that they followed up their grand and happy wedding by locking themselves into the castle and doing nothing new for the rest of their lives. Why wouldn’t they head out and see the world, together? Why should we view Belle’s marriage to the Prince as her endgame, just because it’s the last part of her story that we actually _see_? I think there’s no reason not to believe that their adventures started, rather than ended, at the wedding. ---
**Author:** ![tullsterx](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e9bcb4/32.png) [@tullsterx](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tullsterx)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2013, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-that-praise-settling-and-knowing-your-place/666544/78 "2013-08-20T19:50:22Z")
Office Space ---
**Author:** ![Inner\_Stickler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inner_stickler/32/318_2.png) [@Inner\_Stickler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inner_Stickler)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2013, 7:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-that-praise-settling-and-knowing-your-place/666544/79 "2013-08-20T19:58:57Z")
> [@storyteller0910](#): > > I see no in-text reason to believe that they followed up their grand and happy wedding by locking themselves into the castle and doing nothing new for the rest of their lives. Why wouldn’t they head out and see the world, together? Why should we view Belle’s marriage to the Prince as her endgame, just because it’s the last part of her story that we actually _see_? I think there’s no reason not to believe that their adventures started, rather than ended, at the wedding. I suspect whynot and the unnamed commenter are being a tad blase about a well-known story. I’m fairly certain if any of us were unceremoniously dumped in a derelict castle with sentient housewares and a raving manbeast, we’d damn well consider those months an adventure. Especially if we add in the shitty sequel with the jealous lover organ and almost drowning. Adventure doesn’t just mean running around dropping rings in things or bullying dragons. ---
**Author:** ![Reno\_Nevada](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/6f9a4e/32.png) [@Reno\_Nevada](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Reno_Nevada)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2013, 8:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-that-praise-settling-and-knowing-your-place/666544/80 "2013-08-20T20:11:50Z")
> [@DoctorJ](#): > > _The Devil Wears Prada_. Moral: if you can get a huge boost to your career by working a tough job for difficult people and eating shit for a year, but you don’t get to spend as much time with your boyfriend as he’d like or you occasionally have to cancel dinner with your friends, it’s absolutely not worth it. I think there is a subtle difference between the moral _You should settle for what you can get_ and the moral _You should go after what is important to you, not what other people tell you should be important to you_. However, I have never seen _The Devil Wears Prada_. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-that-praise-settling-and-knowing-your-place/666544.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-that-praise-settling-and-knowing-your-place/666544.md?page=5)