# Movies that set up and defy cliches (boxed spoilers) **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [April 17, 2005, 2:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-that-set-up-and-defy-cliches-boxed-spoilers/299712 "2005-04-17T02:35:34Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Kaspar\_Hauser](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/b3f665/32.png) [@Kaspar\_Hauser](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kaspar_Hauser)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2005, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-that-set-up-and-defy-cliches-boxed-spoilers/299712/21 "2005-04-18T17:11:55Z")
> [@KJ](#): > > In the DVD for the movie “Dodge Ball” you can see the original ending they shot, which was for the team to go all the way to the end, have a stereotypical climactic game against the opposing team, and then lose at the last second. Then it fades out and the credits start rolling. Kind of anticlimactic, but funny. I’m pretty sure that was a joke specifically for the DVD. ---
**Author:** ![cmkeller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cmkeller/32/118_2.png) [@cmkeller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cmkeller)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2005, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-that-set-up-and-defy-cliches-boxed-spoilers/299712/22 "2005-04-18T17:20:49Z")
Ethilrist: > [@](#): > > In Ghostbusters, the geek (Rick Moranis’s character) gets the girl. My wife laughed for a week. No he doesn’t. Maybe he sort of “gets her” while they’re both possessed, but by the end of the movie, she’s with Bill Murray, and he’s alone and totally befuddled. ---
**Author:** ![RikWriter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/49beb7/32.png) [@RikWriter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RikWriter)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2005, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-that-set-up-and-defy-cliches-boxed-spoilers/299712/23 "2005-04-18T17:52:59Z")
> [@bouv](#): > > And right before that, when the learn from the kids how to stop the bomb: > > “Push the big red button.” > > “That’s it?” > > “Yeah, why?” > > “There’s usually more to it than that.” IIRC, his line was “I just thought there would be more to it than that.” ---
**Author:** ![mbh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a6a055/32.png) [@mbh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mbh)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2005, 5:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-that-set-up-and-defy-cliches-boxed-spoilers/299712/24 "2005-04-18T17:58:44Z")
_Pulp Fiction_. In every scene, Tarantino starts setting up a situation you’ve seen a million times before, in a million other movies. And just as you get to the point where you think you know exactly what is going to happen next, he goes off on a bizarre tangent. ---
**Author:** ![Baker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/bb73d2/32.png) [@Baker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baker)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2005, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-that-set-up-and-defy-cliches-boxed-spoilers/299712/25 "2005-04-18T19:50:27Z")
And it was a blue button! (nyuk, nyuk) ---
**Author:** ![Silentgoldfish](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e36b37/32.png) [@Silentgoldfish](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Silentgoldfish)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2005, 10:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-that-set-up-and-defy-cliches-boxed-spoilers/299712/26 "2005-04-18T22:38:25Z")
> [@cmkeller](#): > > Ethilrist: > > No he doesn’t. Maybe he sort of “gets her” while they’re both possessed, but by the end of the movie, she’s with Bill Murray, and he’s alone and totally befuddled. **Ghostbusters 2**. ---
**Author:** ![Leaper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/4bbf92/32.png) [@Leaper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaper)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2005, 11:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-that-set-up-and-defy-cliches-boxed-spoilers/299712/27 "2005-04-18T23:27:03Z")
> [@furt](#): > > No Way Out > > Kevin Costner is a Cold War Navy commander investigating the death of a woman who may have been involved with a Russian spy. As it turns out, she was also the Secretary of Defense’s mistress, and it appears the “Russian Spy” may be red herring. The catch is that Costner also had had a fling with her, and the race is on to prove that the Sec Defense is the killer before he himself is implicated. > > He succeeds, but in the end, the SecDef finds another scapegoat, and Costner walks away disgustedly … > > and into a safehouse, where he is debriefed … in Russian. I’m still confused. How does Kevin Costner keep getting work??? ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2005, 11:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-that-set-up-and-defy-cliches-boxed-spoilers/299712/28 "2005-04-18T23:46:43Z")
And of course there’s _Raiders of the Lost Ark_. Set upon by a band of sword-wielding assassins, Indy heroicly fights them off. But then their leader comes forward: a head taller than Indy, whirling two scimitars like they weigh nothing. What does Indy do? You can practically see the phrase “Aww, F\*\*\* this!” cross his features, and he pulls out his revolver and plugs the guy. ---
**Author:** ![Sir\_Dirx](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b77776/32.png) [@Sir\_Dirx](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sir_Dirx)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2005, 3:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-that-set-up-and-defy-cliches-boxed-spoilers/299712/29 "2005-04-19T03:42:26Z")
I don’ think that wasn’t the original plan, though. As I’ve heard it: Harrison Ford was feeling pretty lousy that day of shooting (I think he was on the tail end of being sick). He was supposed to use his whip to snatch the guy’s sword, but after a whole bunch of takes it just wouldn’t work. Ford then jokingly commented something to the effect of “Why can’t I just take out my gun and shoot him?” Everybody loved it, and so they used it. I love the scene in _Temple of Doom_ where, in a similar situation, he cockily tries to do the same thing, then realizes he doesn’t have his gun and panics. ---
**Author:** ![Achren](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/898d66/32.png) [@Achren](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Achren)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2005, 3:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-that-set-up-and-defy-cliches-boxed-spoilers/299712/30 "2005-04-19T03:51:53Z")
> [@Stranger On A Train](#): > > …There was a great film, [Vozvrashcheniye](http://imdb.com/title/tt0376968/?fr=c2l0ZT1kZnxteD0yMHxsbT01MDB8dHQ9b258ZmI9dXxwbj0wfHE9dGhlIHJldHVybnxodG1sPTF8bm09b24_;fc=1;ft=22;fm=1) (The Return), about two sons whose missing father shows up one day and takes them on a “fishing trip” to a remote island. The film keeps setting up things that you think are going to be resolved in one way and then goes an entirely different (and more plausible, or at least less contrived) way with them. Nobody saw this thing, but I think it was one of the best movies released in the US last year… > > Stranger I saw it! At first I wasn’t sure I liked it, now I’m looking at buying it. Nothing happens quite like you think it will. ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2005, 7:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-that-set-up-and-defy-cliches-boxed-spoilers/299712/31 "2005-04-19T07:03:18Z")
> [@Achren](#): > > I saw it! At first I wasn’t sure I liked it, now I’m looking at buying it. Nothing happens quite like you think it will. You and I must be the only ones. Roger Ebert didn’t even include it in his Overlooked Film Festival (jerk!) I love the way they keep showing the boat at the shore, unanchored or tied down, and you expect it to drift away and leave them stranded. And the ending, where the boat sinks, taking both the father and the chest he retrieved, the contents of which the audience doesn’t know and the existance of which the boys aren’t even aware, down to the depths, presumably never to be retrieved. Trivia note (sad): the boy who played the older brother (not the one that looked like a Russian clone of Haley Joel Osment) later drowned in that same lake. Stranger ---
**Author:** ![Myron\_Van\_Horowitzski](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9de053/32.png) [@Myron\_Van\_Horowitzski](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Myron_Van_Horowitzski)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2005, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-that-set-up-and-defy-cliches-boxed-spoilers/299712/32 "2005-04-19T18:57:43Z")
> [@Lumpy](#): > > And of course there’s _Raiders of the Lost Ark_. Set upon by a band of sword-wielding assassins, Indy heroicly fights them off. But then their leader comes forward: a head taller than Indy, whirling two scimitars like they weigh nothing. What does Indy do? You can practically see the phrase “Aww, F\*\*\* this!” cross his features, and he pulls out his revolver and plugs the guy. There was also where he swings on vine to presumable safety and bellyflops in the water, and my favorite, knocking out the soldier and stealing his uniform… and the uniform doesn’t fit. ---
**Author:** ![Morbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/morbo/32/389_2.png) [@Morbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morbo)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2005, 7:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-that-set-up-and-defy-cliches-boxed-spoilers/299712/33 "2005-04-19T19:12:24Z")
> [@Sir Dirx](#): > > I love the scene in _Temple of Doom_ where, in a similar situation, he cockily tries to do the same thing, then realizes he doesn’t have his gun and panics. The best part being that ToD was a prequel, so he hadn’t yet experienced the similar situation. For the OP, I will bring up **Event Horizon**. It was most definitely a very average movie, but I was impressed that the order in which the crewmembers started dying was directly inverse to Hollywood convention: not only do all the more famous actors die first, but the two least recognizable actors survive - the pretty woman and the young cocky black guy. And the hero and hero-turned-bad-guy both die. ---
**Author:** ![Earthworm\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f07891/32.png) [@Earthworm\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Earthworm_Jim)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2005, 7:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-that-set-up-and-defy-cliches-boxed-spoilers/299712/34 "2005-04-19T19:22:41Z")
> [@Dooku](#): > > The best part being that ToD was a prequel, so he hadn’t yet experienced the similar situation. What?? ---
**Author:** ![Morbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/morbo/32/389_2.png) [@Morbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morbo)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2005, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-that-set-up-and-defy-cliches-boxed-spoilers/299712/35 "2005-04-19T19:43:05Z")
> [@Earthworm Jim](#): > > What?? **Temple of Doom** was a prequel to **Raiders of the Lost Ark**. It was set a year earlier. The date in the caption of the opening scene in **Raiders** is “South America, 1936.” The date in the caption of the opening scene in **Temple of Doom** is “Shanghai, 1935.” So when Indy gets that smug look on his face and knowingly reaches for his gun only to discover it empty, he should have no knowledge of doing that same thing in **Raiders** , since it hadn’t happened yet. ---
**Author:** ![Tracy\_Lord](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ec9cab/32.png) [@Tracy\_Lord](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tracy_Lord)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2005, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-that-set-up-and-defy-cliches-boxed-spoilers/299712/36 "2005-04-19T19:46:02Z")
> [@Earthworm Jim](#): > > What?? Chronologically, in the Indiana Jones timeline, the events of _Temple of Doom_ came before the events of _Raiders of the Lost Ark_. So, the implication is that that’s Indy’s default move when faced with a flashy sparring partner. 🙂 Indiana Jones is full of silly, fun little nods like that. Like in _Last Crusade_, when the two Joneses are tied to the chair, Indy comes up with the plan to burn through the ropes, Dr. Jones Sr. goes through several contortions to retrieve a lighter from Indy’s pocket, lights it – and drops it on the floor, setting the room on fire. HEE! ---
**Author:** ![Tracy\_Lord](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ec9cab/32.png) [@Tracy\_Lord](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tracy_Lord)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2005, 7:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-that-set-up-and-defy-cliches-boxed-spoilers/299712/37 "2005-04-19T19:47:16Z")
It’s like deja vu all over again! ---
**Author:** ![Finagle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/b19c9b/32.png) [@Finagle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Finagle)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2005, 8:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-that-set-up-and-defy-cliches-boxed-spoilers/299712/38 "2005-04-19T20:56:13Z")
I can think of at least one. In the Mask, the sweet, red-haired, reporter turns out to be bad, and the trollopy nightclub singer turns out to be the good girl. And, maybe in Romancing the Stone, when Kathleen Turner flings her hidden knife at the bad guy and he blocks it with a piece of wood. ---
**Author:** ![zamboniracer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e9a140/32.png) [@zamboniracer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zamboniracer)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2005, 9:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-that-set-up-and-defy-cliches-boxed-spoilers/299712/39 "2005-04-19T21:30:52Z")
> [@Finagle](#): > > I can think of at least one. In the Mask, the sweet, red-haired, reporter turns out to be bad, and the trollopy nightclub singer turns out to be the good girl. > > And, maybe in Romancing the Stone, when Kathleen Turner flings her hidden knife at the bad guy and he blocks it with a piece of wood. What made that _Romancing the Stone_ bit so good was that it put a nice twist on a similar scene that had been shown early in the movie drawn from Turner/Joan Wilder’s imagination as she wrote. From that same movie, I loved the bit where our heroes came upon a Columbian drug lord’s house and the drug lord turned out to read romance novels to his men on Saturdays. I loved that movie but I’m not going to put a 20 year old movie into a spoiler box. ---
**Author:** ![Prancer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/8dc957/32.png) [@Prancer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Prancer)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2005, 10:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-that-set-up-and-defy-cliches-boxed-spoilers/299712/40 "2005-04-19T22:25:59Z")
“My Bet Friend’s Wedding” actually did end with Julia Roberts’ character stopping the wedding at first. The studio tested it and the test audiences indicated they’d rather have the husband & wife to-be stay together. “While You Were Sleeping” is one of my favorites because it defies romantic comedy cliches while still managing to be a romantic comedy. At one point Lucy’s acceptance into the family of the coma-guy everyone thinks she’s engaged to hinges upon her being able to correctly identify which testicle he’d lost in a basketball game. She guessed correctly, fyi. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-that-set-up-and-defy-cliches-boxed-spoilers/299712.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-that-set-up-and-defy-cliches-boxed-spoilers/299712.md?page=3)