# Movies where pilots change planes mid-flight **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [April 2, 2013, 3:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-where-pilots-change-planes-mid-flight/654592 "2013-04-02T03:29:38Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2013, 12:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-where-pilots-change-planes-mid-flight/654592/21 "2013-04-03T00:20:43Z")
> [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > I remember “Black Sheep Squadron” on TV also used a lot of stock WWII footage. Usually they managed to keep the planes as Corsairs, because they were so iconic and different in design that the audience would notice instantly. About the only episode of that series that I caught was the one where the Marines were competing with the Army Air Forces for the privilege of shooting down Yamamoto. Apparently there was some difficulty in getting footage of P-38s (the planes the AAF pilots actually flew on the raid), so they substituted film of P-51Ds instead. At that point in the war (April of '43), the AAF would have given anything to have had Mustangs assigned to the Pacific theater (and the D model didn’t enter service until mid-1944). If I’m not mistaken, the Devastator was only used in the Battle of the Coral Sea and at Midway, with disastrous results. As a result, the remaining examples of the type were withdrawn from service. This is why I’m surprised that there’s any actual combat footage for them. I remember lots of inconsistent shots of different planes in _Midway_, but no Devastators. ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2013, 12:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-where-pilots-change-planes-mid-flight/654592/22 "2013-04-03T00:38:31Z")
> [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > Yeah, most of this stuff happened during the era of those big cheesy WWII ‘epics’ like Midway, where historical footage was used for financial reasons. There’s only so much quality footage around, and so you have to go with whatever planes were in them. Two images are stuck in my mind forever: the formation of F6F Hellcats in John Wayne’s _Flying Leathernecks_ all bearing post-1947 national insignia, and the launch of the Grumman Trader/Tracker (also with post-1947 insignia) from the angled deck of the carrier in _The Wackiest Ship in the Army._ Also, the squadron of AD Skyraiders flying over the battleships in _The Longest Day._ I remember reading somewhere that that footage was actually shot during the landings at Inchon in 1950; at any rate, it sure wasn’t filmed at Normandy. ---
**Author:** ![Battle\_Pope](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/4bbf92/32.png) [@Battle\_Pope](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Battle_Pope)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2013, 12:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-where-pilots-change-planes-mid-flight/654592/23 "2013-04-03T00:55:16Z")
You also get this in a lot of the cheaper 1950’s sci-fi/creature flicks. The ending of _Tarantula_ [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1\_lA7HNmfxc](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1_lA7HNmfxc) (with a very young Clint Eastwood in the cockpit!). F-84’s (from the _Thunderbirds_ no less) become F-80’s and then turn back into F-84’s. Trying to remember the film, it could have been _Fiend Without a Face_ or even _Earth vs The Flying Saucers_, but I once saw an F-86 –\> F-84 –\> F-89 –\> F-86 progression 😃 One of the reasons I love those old films is they do have a lot of footage of the 1950’s fighters in action. ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2013, 1:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-where-pilots-change-planes-mid-flight/654592/24 "2013-04-03T01:13:20Z")
> [@terentii](#): > > … > Also, the squadron of AD Skyraiders flying over the battleships in _The Longest Day._ I remember reading somewhere that that footage was actually shot during the landings at Inchon in 1950; at any rate, it sure wasn’t filmed at Normandy. Forgot to mention they also threw in a couple of Skyraiders in Flat Top. ---
**Author:** ![Richard\_Pearse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/richard_pearse/32/13144_2.png) [@Richard\_Pearse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Richard_Pearse)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2013, 2:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-where-pilots-change-planes-mid-flight/654592/25 "2013-04-03T02:06:32Z")
> [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > I remember “Black Sheep Squadron” on TV also used a lot of stock WWII footage. Usually they managed to keep the planes as Corsairs, because they were so iconic and different in design that the audience would notice instantly. But the Japanese planes would sometimes be Zeroes, then Kates, then something else. Whatever footage was available. And as I recall, some of the Japanese planes were just AT-6 Texans in Japanese paint. There were a number of T-6 Texans modified to look like Zeros for _Tora! Tora! Tora!_. If the same aircraft were used for _Black Sheep Squadron_ then it wasn’t just a different paint job you were seeing. Changes included a three bladed prop in place of the original two blades, some modifications to the fairings at the bottom of the rudder, and a single place canopy replicating the look of the Zero canopy. The result isn’t too bad although the Zero was much more delicate looking than a Texan can ever hope to be. > **[File:Mitsubishi A6M Zero Replica.jpg](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Mitsubishi_A6M_Zero_Replica.jpg)** > > Original file (1,600 × 1,066 pixels, file size: 252 KB, MIME type: image/jpeg) > Click on a date/time to view the file as it appeared at that time. > You cannot overwrite this file. The following 3 pages use this file: ---
**Author:** ![Gagundathar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a183cd/32.png) [@Gagundathar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gagundathar)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2013, 2:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-where-pilots-change-planes-mid-flight/654592/26 "2013-04-03T02:09:23Z")
> [@detop](#): > > I don’t recall seeing **any Avengers** in that movie but I do recall seeing Devastators as torpedo bombers (historical role) and dive bombers. Really? Are you sure that Captain Steve Rogers wasn’t there? ---
**Author:** ![Battle\_Pope](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/4bbf92/32.png) [@Battle\_Pope](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Battle_Pope)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2013, 2:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-where-pilots-change-planes-mid-flight/654592/27 "2013-04-03T02:12:10Z")
Charlton Heston played ‘Captain Matt Garth’. That close enough? 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2013, 2:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-where-pilots-change-planes-mid-flight/654592/28 "2013-04-03T02:12:50Z")
> [@Richard\_Pearse](#): > > The result isn’t too bad although the Zero was much more delicate looking than a Texan can ever hope to be. > > [File:Mitsubishi A6M Zero Replica.jpg - Wikipedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Mitsubishi_A6M_Zero_Replica.jpg) The wingtips are also completely the wrong shape. ☹ ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2013, 3:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-where-pilots-change-planes-mid-flight/654592/29 "2013-04-03T03:41:37Z")
> [@Richard\_Pearse](#): > > There were a number of T-6 Texans modified to look like Zeros for _Tora! Tora! Tora!_. If the same aircraft were used for _Black Sheep Squadron_ then it wasn’t just a different paint job you were seeing. Changes included a three bladed prop in place of the original two blades, some modifications to the fairings at the bottom of the rudder, and a single place canopy replicating the look of the Zero canopy. The result isn’t too bad although the Zero was much more delicate looking than a Texan can ever hope to be. > > [File:Mitsubishi A6M Zero Replica.jpg - Wikipedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Mitsubishi_A6M_Zero_Replica.jpg) Very cool info. Thanks. ---
**Author:** ![Richard\_Pearse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/richard_pearse/32/13144_2.png) [@Richard\_Pearse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Richard_Pearse)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2013, 4:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-where-pilots-change-planes-mid-flight/654592/30 "2013-04-03T04:25:38Z")
> [@terentii](#): > > The wingtips are also completely the wrong shape. ☹ It’s not mentioned in that Wikipedia photo caption but I think there was a wing tip fairing modification made to round off the fairly square Texan wing tips. The whole wing shape is wrong though and it only improved the overall look slightly. A Texan and a Texan/Zero replica shared space in a hangar I used to work in, so I’ve had a good look around both aircraft, albeit over 13 years ago. Ultimately it’s a matter of money. Texans are plentiful and relatively cheap, Zeros aren’t. ---
**Author:** ![Zebra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/c0e974/32.png) [@Zebra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zebra)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2013, 4:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-where-pilots-change-planes-mid-flight/654592/31 "2013-04-03T04:42:27Z")
Black Sheep Squadron was pretty much like Battlestar Galatica from the same time period. The same footage for every dogfight re-used each week. At least BSG kept their ships right, ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2013, 5:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-where-pilots-change-planes-mid-flight/654592/32 "2013-04-03T05:58:53Z")
Can anyone think of any movies that got the aviation stuff right? Older movies had to make do with whatever footage they could, or disguise plentiful planes (like Texans) as something else. But even something like _Top Gun_, with access to all the money and planes they could want, gets things wrong. There’s a scene in _Close Encounters of the Third Kind_ that’s well done. An air traffic controller is talking to a couple pilots when there’s an unknown radar contact near them. The words and the cadence sounded like the filmmakers had put in the effort to get it right. ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2013, 12:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-where-pilots-change-planes-mid-flight/654592/33 "2013-04-03T12:19:09Z")
Just watched another terrible military movie called Tactical Assault. It must have been shot mostly on some former Soviet or client airbase, as the Americans were always walking around Mig 29s and Mil helicopters. They got the “action” sequences a little better – for them they showed F-16s. ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2013, 12:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-where-pilots-change-planes-mid-flight/654592/34 "2013-04-03T12:30:44Z")
As far as movies that got it right, IIRC _Twelve O’clock High_ did a good job. Of course it was also one of the ones with easier choices, just showing scenes of B-17s cruising along with German fighters swooping in. I think the worst they did was show gun camera from fighters chasing and shooting down other fighters when they were portraying gunners shooting at incoming fighters. That is another almost universal mistake – I guess there’s not a whole lot of genuine footage from B-17 gunners’ perspective. ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2013, 12:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-where-pilots-change-planes-mid-flight/654592/35 "2013-04-03T12:40:54Z")
Another that did a better than average job is _Hot Shots_. Yeah, they had those goofy little planes doing all that impossible stuff, but at least they always had the same planes, and the enemy planes didn’t change either. ---
**Author:** ![detop](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/bcef8e/32.png) [@detop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/detop)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2013, 12:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-where-pilots-change-planes-mid-flight/654592/36 "2013-04-03T12:44:14Z")
> [@terentii](#): > > Footage of Devastators in battle exists?!? :eek: I need to watch _Midway_ again. It’s not footage of Devastators in battle. Actually I think they used real Devastators as props for the movie. The flying scenes are in colour, not colourized. I remember watching _Midway_ in the theaters when it came out and not liking it very much. I watched it again a couple of weeks ago on Netflix and it wasn’t as bad as I remembered. I think the reason I disliked it the first time, might have been because of the sound (it used the same gimmick as _Earthquake_). ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2013, 2:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-where-pilots-change-planes-mid-flight/654592/37 "2013-04-03T14:03:28Z")
> [@Boyo\_Jim](#): > > That is another almost universal mistake – I guess there’s not a whole lot of genuine footage from B-17 gunners’ perspective. There’s enough, if the producers bother to look for it. Newsreel cameramen flew quite a few missions over Europe, in all sorts of bombers. The movie makers usually just grab whatever is in the vaults at the studio. ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2013, 2:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-where-pilots-change-planes-mid-flight/654592/38 "2013-04-03T14:14:37Z")
> [@silenus](#): > > There’s enough, if the producers bother to look for it. Newsreel cameramen flew quite a few missions over Europe, in all sorts of bombers. The movie makers usually just grab whatever is in the vaults at the studio. I’m sure that’s true, as we keep seeing the same combat footage time after time in one movie after another. There must be thousands of hours of genuine footage that have never seen the light of day since they were shot. I wonder if the Air Force still has it all in archives somewhere, or if they just dumped it at some point. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2013, 2:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-where-pilots-change-planes-mid-flight/654592/39 "2013-04-03T14:26:39Z")
Probably both. I’m sure there is footage stashed somewhere, but most was probably recycled years ago. ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2013, 2:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-where-pilots-change-planes-mid-flight/654592/40 "2013-04-03T14:54:13Z")
> [@detop](#): > > It’s not footage of Devastators in battle. Actually I think they used real Devastators as props for the movie. … If they did, they built them from scratch. According to Wiki, not a single one survived the war. More than half the ones left were shot down at Midway, and the few remaining were scrapped in 1944. There isn’t even a non-flying one on a museum. A little more googling shows there are locations known for a total of three of them, all underwater after ditching, and so far none have been recovered for restoration. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-where-pilots-change-planes-mid-flight/654592.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/movies-where-pilots-change-planes-mid-flight/654592.md?page=3)