# Moving Isreal **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [January 12, 2010, 2:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moving-isreal/524607 "2010-01-12T02:43:56Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2010, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moving-isreal/524607/81 "2010-01-12T19:29:37Z")
I have spoken to my friends in the Q Continuum. They are able to do this but frankly don’t care enough to bother. One Q in particular however is willing to assist in exchange for a handjob from a certain winsome starship captain. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2010, 7:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moving-isreal/524607/82 "2010-01-12T19:51:34Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > One Q in particular however is willing to assist in exchange for a handjob from a certain winsome starship captain. Tell him George Takei is married. ---
**Author:** ![Odaran09](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Odaran09](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Odaran09)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2010, 12:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moving-isreal/524607/83 "2010-01-13T00:51:08Z")
> [@Odesio](#): > > Sometimes I’m amazed at how ridiculous topics can go so far on the Straight Dope. Really, move the entire country of Israel? Seems like a rather silly idea that doesn’t deserve to be taken seriously. When all the good questions are taken, only the silly ones are left. [@Everyone](https://boards.straightdope.com/groups/everyone): I tried not making my question too political or religously motivated and found many of the answers entertaining as well as informative. It would be great if everyone in the world could get along and not have war, but I feel that is against human nature. We always seem to be competing for something, be it land or resources. The mention of Europe was not intended to be snarky, I was just the closest place to come to mind that would be easy for them to get too. Apparently my 6th grade Geography failed me. ---
**Author:** ![Kobal2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kobal2/32/20_2.png) [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2010, 5:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moving-isreal/524607/84 "2010-01-13T05:28:49Z")
> [@ivan\_astikov](#): > > The human race will always have a chance as long as we retain our sense of humour. > > Apparently, those Swedes don’t have one, so I’m all for that. > > Seriously though - Swedish stand-up comedians, anyone? > > ps. [Hang on, I could be wrong](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BXmxdIxyzFY) > > \< 8 minutes later\> Nope, I’m still awaiting proof. What the Swedes lack in conventional humour, they make up in bleak, soul-sucking depression. I never knew a Swede who, given a winter evening and a generous supply of Aquavit, couldn’t make young Werther look like My Little Pony on a sugar high. And that oughta count for something. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2010, 5:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moving-isreal/524607/85 "2010-01-13T05:54:33Z")
> [@Revenant\_Threshold](#): > > Maybe we should all swap every 5 months or so. Dibs on Canada. [Mad Hatter] Change places! [/MH] ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2010, 1:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moving-isreal/524607/86 "2010-01-13T13:50:51Z")
National Chinese fire drill! ---
**Author:** ![spudbucket](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/85e7bf/32.png) [@spudbucket](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/spudbucket)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2010, 2:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moving-isreal/524607/87 "2010-01-13T14:26:23Z")
> [@Punoqllads](#): > > Wrong. Jews constituted about one-third of the population of Palestine at the time of the partition. But this was the result of a massive migration from Europe to Palestine following the holocaust. 1850 about 4 percent of the population was Jewish 1914 about 7.5 percent of the population was Jewish 1920 about 11 percent of the population was Jewish League of Nations’ Interim Report on the Civil Administration of Palestine (1920) stated “the Jewish element of the population…Almost all have entered Palestine during the last 40 years. Prior to 1850 there were in the country only a handful of Jews.” > **[Palestine](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestine#Demographics_in_the_late_Ottoman_and_British_Mandate_periods)** > > Palestine,\[i\] officially the State of Palestine,\[ii\]\[g\] is a country in West Asia. It encompasses the Israeli-occupied West Bank, including East Jerusalem, and the Gaza Strip, collectively known as the Palestinian territories. The territories share the vast majority of their borders with Israel, with the West Bank bordering Jordan to the east and the Gaza Strip bordering Egypt to the southwest. It has a total land area of 6,020 square kilometres (2,320 sq mi) while its population exceeds five... ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2010, 2:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moving-isreal/524607/88 "2010-01-13T14:35:10Z")
I don’t really see how it matters, but in any case, the assertion being rebutted was that prior to 1948 there were very few Jews in the area. It doesn’t matter if they had all shown up in the preceding 100 years; after all, it’s not like Jerusalem is some mythical city and its present location is based on guesswork. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2010, 2:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moving-isreal/524607/89 "2010-01-13T14:49:49Z")
> [@spudbucket](#): > > But this was the result of a massive migration from Europe to Palestine following the holocaust. > > 1850 about 4 percent of the population was Jewish > 1914 about 7.5 percent of the population was Jewish > 1920 about 11 percent of the population was Jewish > > League of Nations’ Interim Report on the Civil Administration of Palestine (1920) stated “the Jewish element of the population…Almost all have entered Palestine during the last 40 years. Prior to 1850 there were in the country only a handful of Jews.” > > [Palestine - Wikipedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestine#Demographics_in_the_late_Ottoman_and_British_Mandate_periods) You’re conveniently overlooking the massive waves of immigration in the 1920’s and 1930’s, not to mention the natural growth that occured during that period (most of the Jews who fought in the Israeli War of Independence had been born in the Mandate). Only a handful of Jews actually moved to the country between 1945 and 1948. And if almost all Jews immigrated after 1880… so? What difference does that make? ---
**Author:** ![Scuba\_Ben](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/278dde/32.png) [@Scuba\_Ben](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scuba_Ben)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2010, 3:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moving-isreal/524607/90 "2010-01-13T15:25:37Z")
@ **Odaran09** : You live somewhere. Perhaps you’ve lived there much of your life. Would you be willing to pick up and move somewhere else purely to satisfy a disgruntled neighbor? I didn’t think so. Now magnify the simplistic question by a zillion times. The answer probably will still be no. ---
**Author:** ![Odaran09](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Odaran09](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Odaran09)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2010, 7:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moving-isreal/524607/91 "2010-01-13T19:49:25Z")
> [@Scuba\_Ben](#): > > @ **Odaran09** : You live somewhere. Perhaps you’ve lived there much of your life. > > Would you be willing to pick up and move somewhere else purely to satisfy a disgruntled neighbor? I didn’t think so. > > Now magnify the simplistic question by a zillion times. The answer probably will still be no. I do understand what you are saying, but if the disgruntled neighbor is shooting at my front door every week or so and once in a while grazes me, I would either try to take out the neighbor myself or get out of there. We see how the retaliation thing is going. So if someone comes up to me and tells me they have a new place to live where the neighbors might not like me there but are not constantly shooting at me and they will pay for the move, I might be more inclined to go. ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2010, 8:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moving-isreal/524607/92 "2010-01-13T20:03:57Z")
> [@Odaran09](#): > > So if someone comes up to me and tells me they have a new place to live where the neighbors might not like me there but are not constantly shooting at me and they will pay for the move, I might be more inclined to go. Aside from the mild inconvenience of there being no “new place to live”\*, what happens in your scenario if all those people are not “inclined” to pick up and go? \*although I suppose there are a lot of countries that would put up the Israelis temporarily until we figure out who’d be willing to take them. There’s the problem of where to store all their stuff, but I hear [these nice people](http://www.unclebobs.com/) might be willing to help. ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2010, 8:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moving-isreal/524607/93 "2010-01-13T20:04:00Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > Tell him George Takei is married. Your slander of Janeway shall not go unanswered. ---
**Author:** ![levdrakon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/49beb7/32.png) [@levdrakon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/levdrakon)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2010, 8:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moving-isreal/524607/94 "2010-01-13T20:09:56Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > Your slander of Janeway shall not go unanswered. I figured it was Q/Picard. Q was totally ga-ga for Picard. ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2010, 8:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moving-isreal/524607/95 "2010-01-13T20:11:56Z")
> [@levdrakon](#): > > I figured it was Q/Picard. Q was totally ga-ga for Picard. I think Q merely liked making Picard feel uncomfortable. (And he had an ulterior motive for that.) He clearly wanted to jump Janeway’s bones. Which made sense, as 90s-Mulgrew was hot. ETA: Sorry for taking this so far off topic. I’ll shut up on the issue on this thread. ---
**Author:** ![begbert2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/begbert2/32/3357_2.png) [@begbert2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/begbert2)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2010, 9:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moving-isreal/524607/96 "2010-01-13T21:39:44Z")
> [@Odaran09](#): > > I do understand what you are saying, but if the disgruntled neighbor is shooting at my front door every week or so and once in a while grazes me, I would either try to take out the neighbor myself or get out of there. We see how the retaliation thing is going. I think we can say with reasonable confidence that Israel has not _begun_ to “retaliate”. If Israel seriously decided to try to “take out” one or more of their neighbor countries, they might not succeed, but I’m certain there would be a great deal more glass in the middle east than there is currently. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2010, 9:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moving-isreal/524607/97 "2010-01-13T21:44:12Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > I think Q merely liked making Picard feel uncomfortable. (And he had an ulterior motive for that.) He clearly wanted to jump Janeway’s bones. Which made sense, as 90s-Mulgrew was hot. > > ETA: Sorry for taking this so far off topic. I’ll shut up on the issue on this thread. I dunno - I’m partial to Picard’s “The line must be drawn _HEE-AA!!_” speech from _First Contact_, myself. Anyway, I’ve been trying to understand the logic of people like the OP, and I think I’ve figured it out. It goes something like this: Jews live in Israel. Jews also live elsewhere in the world. Therefore, the Jews can move from Israel to elsewhere in the world, and it wouldn’t be that big a deal. The problem with that is that it’s based on an incorrect assumption: namely, that we’re “Jews living in Israel”. We aren’t. We’re Israelis. We may have a certain connection to diaspora Jews, but we’re not them, and they’re not us. ---
**Author:** ![begbert2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/begbert2/32/3357_2.png) [@begbert2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/begbert2)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2010, 9:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moving-isreal/524607/98 "2010-01-13T21:50:12Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > Anyway, I’ve been trying to understand the logic of people like the OP, and I think I’ve figured it out. It goes something like this: Jews live in Israel. Jews also live elsewhere in the world. Therefore, the Jews can move from Israel to elsewhere in the world, and it wouldn’t be that big a deal. > > The problem with that is that it’s based on an incorrect assumption: namely, that we’re “Jews living in Israel”. We aren’t. We’re Israelis. We may have a certain connection to diaspora Jews, but we’re not them, and they’re not us. Hmm, I would have thought the logic (so to speak) was “Israel wasn’t always there - all\* those Jews just rolled in and took over a few decades ago. If they could move once, why not again?” The obvious response to this, of course, is “the USA-ans are inconveniencing the native american indians. Heave-ho!” - or most of them, whichever. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2010, 9:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moving-isreal/524607/99 "2010-01-13T21:52:17Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > The problem with that is that it’s based on an incorrect assumption: namely, that we’re “Jews living in Israel”. We aren’t. We’re Israelis. We may have a certain connection to diaspora Jews, but we’re not them, and they’re not us. Wait a second… you have _Jews_ in Israel? :eek: ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2010, 9:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moving-isreal/524607/100 "2010-01-13T21:56:14Z")
> [@begbert2](#): > > Hmm, I would have thought the logic (so to speak) was “Israel wasn’t always there - all\* those Jews just rolled in and took over a few decades ago. If they could move once, why not again?” But that would be implying that the descendants of immigrants are somehow second-class citizens. Nobody here would dare say something like that. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moving-isreal/524607.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/moving-isreal/524607.md?page=6)