# Mr. Bush, a word please? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [January 21, 2001, 6:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-bush-a-word-please/51109 "2001-01-21T06:31:14Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Flymaster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/c4cdca/32.png) [@Flymaster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Flymaster)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2001, 6:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-bush-a-word-please/51109/1 "2001-01-21T06:31:14Z")
[http://washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A23628-2001Jan20.html](http://washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A23628-2001Jan20.html) Ok…leaving most of the content of this article to a different thread, what in the name of holy hell is this? > [@](#): > > Bush also issued a proclamation declaring today a National Day of Prayer and Thanksgiving, urging Americans to spend their Sunday in prayer and reflection, recalling “all that unites us.” Oh god. 4 years of this shit? Great. ---
**Author:** ![Flymaster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/c4cdca/32.png) [@Flymaster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Flymaster)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2001, 6:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-bush-a-word-please/51109/2 "2001-01-21T06:33:42Z")
Hmm…actually, as soon as I posted this, I realized that this could just as easily be a Pit thread. Mods…take your pick, and my apologies in advance. ---
**Author:** ![horowitz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/2acd7d/32.png) [@horowitz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/horowitz)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2001, 6:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-bush-a-word-please/51109/3 "2001-01-21T06:52:18Z")
I don’t know exactly how to respond to this. In your opion does separation of church from state mean separation of chuch and state? What is the problem here? Cannot a President of faith declare a day of prayer without the attacks of those that do not believe as he does? I think that too many are looking for reasons to admonish our new President. What I do not want to have is everybody taking every moment to point out every difference between them and the President for the next 4 years. I guess such is the burden of free speech. What is the problem with this man expressing his faith at this moment? ---
**Author:** ![horowitz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/2acd7d/32.png) [@horowitz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/horowitz)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2001, 6:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-bush-a-word-please/51109/4 "2001-01-21T06:54:12Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by horowitz \* > \*\*In your opion does separation of church from state mean separation of chuch and state?/B] Make that the other way around. ---
**Author:** ![Flymaster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/c4cdca/32.png) [@Flymaster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Flymaster)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2001, 6:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-bush-a-word-please/51109/5 "2001-01-21T06:58:58Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by horowitz \* > **What is the problem with this man expressing his faith at this moment?** Nothing, if he expresses HIS faith as a private citizen. If, however, as this article suggests, he used his OFFICIAL powers as an elected official to declare a day of prayer, I have a major issue with it. The first ammendment specifically forbids the establishment of a religion, which is what such a declaration does. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Ryan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7feea3/32.png) [@The\_Ryan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Ryan)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2001, 9:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-bush-a-word-please/51109/6 "2001-01-21T09:05:06Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by horowitz \* > What is the problem here? Atheists don’t like being told to pray. > [@](#): > > Cannot a President of faith declare a day of prayer without the attacks of those that do not believe as he does? You’re a bit confused as to who’s attacking whom. > [@](#): > > I think that too many are looking for reasons to admonish our new President. In other words, if we notice Bush doing something wrong, it’s **our** fault because if we hadn’t been paying attention, we wouldn’t have noticed it? What ridiculous logic. > [@](#): > > What I do not want to have is everybody taking every moment to point out every difference between them and the President for the next 4 years. Again, you are confused as to who is doing the pointing out of differences. > [@](#): > > What is the problem with this man expressing his faith at this moment? He’s not expressing his faith. Expressing his faith would be saying something like “since I am a Christian, **I** am going to pray for unity”. As soon as he tries to involve other in his praying, it is no longer simply expressing his faith. ---
**Author:** ![Sterra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/8c91f0/32.png) [@Sterra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sterra)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2001, 9:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-bush-a-word-please/51109/7 "2001-01-21T09:14:16Z")
mmm Im a christan and I don’t like to be told to pray either.🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Typo\_Negative](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/typo_negative/32/484_2.png) [@Typo\_Negative](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Typo_Negative)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2001, 2:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-bush-a-word-please/51109/8 "2001-01-21T14:19:34Z")
[sarcasm] Wow, a National Day of Prayer. That’s great idea. And on the customary day christians observe the sabbath! Pretty convenient, eh! I think this will help unite us all. [/sarcasm] ---
**Author:** ![Twin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/85f322/32.png) [@Twin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Twin)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2001, 2:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-bush-a-word-please/51109/9 "2001-01-21T14:24:44Z")
Here’s an excerpt from a proclamation our EX-president made last year. > [@](#): > > NOW, THEREFORE, I, WILLIAM J. CLINTON, President of the United States of America, do hereby proclaim May 4, 2000, as a National Day of Prayer. I encourage the citizens of this great Nation to pray, each in his or her own manner, seeking strength from God to face today’s challenges, seeking guidance for tomorrow’s uncertainties, and giving thanks for the rich blessings that our country has enjoyed throughout its history. Let’s not be hypocrites now. How soon you forget. Cite? Here you go. [http://ofcn.org/cyber.serv/teledem/pb/2000/may/msg00028.html](http://ofcn.org/cyber.serv/teledem/pb/2000/may/msg00028.html) ---
**Author:** ![UncleBeer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/977dab/32.png) [@UncleBeer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UncleBeer)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2001, 2:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-bush-a-word-please/51109/10 "2001-01-21T14:36:15Z")
Let me get this straight. You’re angry because Bush declared a day of prayer, right? How 'bout Memorial Day, you mad about that, too? The president proclaiming an official day of prayer is _far_ from an isolated incident. Clinton made an identical proclamation every year of his presidency. Now, you were saying, what, four years of this crap? I think it’s been a few years more than that. This is nothing more than a thinly disguised rant against a conservative president. Here’s an excerpt from a Clinton Whitehouse press release dated 05/26/2000 concerning Memorial Day: > [@](#): > > In recognition of those courageous Americans, the Congress, by joint resolution approved on May 11, 1950 (64 Stat. 158), has requested the President to issue a proclamation calling upon the people of the United States to observe each Memorial Day as a day of prayer for permanent peace and designating a period on that day when the American people might unite in prayer. In support of the new tradition of a National Moment of Remembrance, the Congress has passed H.Con.Res. 302 calling on the people of the United States to observe a National Moment of Remembrance on Memorial Day. > > NOW, THEREFORE, I, WILLIAM J. CLINTON, President of the United States of America, do hereby proclaim Memorial Day, May 29, 2000, as a day of prayer for permanent peace, and I designate 3:00 p.m. local time on that day as the time to join in prayer and to observe the National Moment of Remembrance. I urge the press, radio, television, and all other media to participate in this observance. ---
**Author:** ![David\_B](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/51bf81/32.png) [@David\_B](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/David_B)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2001, 2:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-bush-a-word-please/51109/11 "2001-01-21T14:36:51Z")
Yes, Twin, Clinton gave in to religious pressures, too. Last I checked, though, two wrongs don’t make a right. Flymaster: I had just read the paper and noticed the same thing. You got here before I did, though. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![UncleBeer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/977dab/32.png) [@UncleBeer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UncleBeer)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2001, 2:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-bush-a-word-please/51109/12 "2001-01-21T14:37:34Z")
Heh. We had the same idea, Twin; picked a different day though. ---
**Author:** ![David\_B](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/51bf81/32.png) [@David\_B](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/David_B)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2001, 2:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-bush-a-word-please/51109/13 "2001-01-21T14:38:21Z")
Since Unc slipped in there while I was typing, add “and UncleBeer” to my message after “Twin.” ---
**Author:** ![UncleBeer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/977dab/32.png) [@UncleBeer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UncleBeer)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2001, 2:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-bush-a-word-please/51109/14 "2001-01-21T14:45:45Z")
Whaddya say, David? While I don’t approve of Bush proclaiming a “day of prayer,” either, I just don’t see it as a big deal, nor, as we can see, is it unique. You are always free to ignore it if ya want. That is until the storm troopers round you up and drag you down to the cathedral to light a candle or some such horseshit. And for the record, in case there are a few who are yet unaware of it, I’m a conservative and an athiest. ---
**Author:** ![David\_B](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/51bf81/32.png) [@David\_B](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/David_B)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2001, 2:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-bush-a-word-please/51109/15 "2001-01-21T14:49:45Z")
No, it’s not unique. Is it a big deal? Well, in the grand scheme of all possible horrible things, no. For example, the possibility of Ashcroft as AG or \< shudder \> on the Supreme Court is much worse. But to start off his administration on this note doesn’t bode well, IMO. And, FYI, had I been around here and aware of Clinton doing what you pointed out, I’d have posted in opposition to that as well. ---
**Author:** ![UncleBeer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/977dab/32.png) [@UncleBeer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UncleBeer)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2001, 2:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-bush-a-word-please/51109/16 "2001-01-21T14:54:44Z")
Gotcha. Fair enough. ---
**Author:** ![Squink](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5e925/32.png) [@Squink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Squink)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2001, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-bush-a-word-please/51109/17 "2001-01-21T16:46:52Z")
First Block Clintons work: “Send no proposed or final regulation to the Office of the Federal Register unless and until a department or agency head appointed by the President after noon on 20 January 2001, reviews and approves the regulatory action,” Then tell us to: Spend Sunday in prayer and reflection, recalling “all that unites us.” He might have stated that he wants the unification process to include only his plans for the nation. Seems a bit self serving to not mention that doesn’t it ? -I’ve nothing against praying, but my higher power tells me that someone is trying to use him to achieve worldy powers. ---
**Author:** ![tracer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tracer/32/20578_2.png) [@tracer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tracer)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2001, 6:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-bush-a-word-please/51109/18 "2001-01-21T18:32:13Z")
UncleBeer wrote: > [@](#): > > Gotcha. Fair enough. Darn it, for a minute I thought we might get to see a few good rounds of Duellin’ Moderators. C’mon, guys, start disagreeing some more! Muss it up a bit! Can’t have a Great Debate with all this namby-pamby agreement going on… ---
**Author:** ![Flymaster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/c4cdca/32.png) [@Flymaster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Flymaster)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2001, 7:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-bush-a-word-please/51109/19 "2001-01-21T19:25:09Z")
Twin and Uncle Beer: First off, had I been aware of the Clinton prayer days, I would have been just as angry. As David says, two wrongs don’t make a right. It would still have been just as discriminatory, and in my mind, just as unconstitutional. It’s just wrong. ---
**Author:** ![Stoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stoid/32/272_2.png) [@Stoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stoid)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2001, 8:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-bush-a-word-please/51109/20 "2001-01-21T20:33:36Z")
in justifying my hatred of him. (Or what I called hatred without really feeling it. Now I feel it.) I mean, up to now my hatred for the man was based on supposition about how he would behave…he lived down to my expectations INSTANTLY. And yes, my conservative Bush-loving Doper breathren, he’s EVIL. (disclaimer: I am not referring to the OP issue regarding the “proclamation” so much as the article from which the information is taken, which talks much more about how Bush acted immediately to undo or stop everything Clinton did in his last days, especially Clinton’s environmental protection regulations. Yeah, Dub, let’s make absolutely sure that every square inch of land is exploited to exhaustion. Damn corporate whore.) stoid [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-bush-a-word-please/51109.md?page=2)