# Mr. Clothahump, if you will **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [March 31, 2017, 4:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-clothahump-if-you-will/783422 "2017-03-31T16:23:22Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2017, 9:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-clothahump-if-you-will/783422/61 "2017-04-02T21:11:40Z")
I’m still curious if **Clothahump** still uses ethnic slurs, or still thinks it’s okay to do so, or if he’s changed his mind. The first time I challenged him on this he didn’t respond honestly, but I’m still curious as to his actual thoughts. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2017, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-clothahump-if-you-will/783422/62 "2017-04-02T21:37:20Z")
> [@Superdude](#): > > Point of order, **Clothahump** : > > I’ve posted on this board for over 15 years. Over that time, I’ve had the opportunity to see scores of interactions between you and other posters. At no time have I seen you engage, or attempt to engage, in anything even approaching civility. You don’t debate, you insult. You characterize anyone disagreeing with you as stupid. You consider yourself as intellectually superior to just about every other person who posts here, yet when an assertion of yours is challenged, you either resort to insults and condescension, or you abandon the thread, never to return to it. > > If you feel like you’re an unfair target in your interactions, you might want to admit that at least part of the problem is that you engage in dishonest debate tactics. > > I’m not trying to insult you, or turn people against you. I’m not trying to disrespect you, either. I’m just trying to get you to realize how you come across to others. I’m reminded of an old joke about Taylor Swift, and how she should write a song called “Maybe It’s Me.” > > Yes, some people here disrespect you. But you haven’t exactly made it easy for them to change their opinion. You’re really asking for yet another “Fuck off”, aren’t you? ---
**Author:** ![Superdude](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/superdude/32/13450_2.png) [@Superdude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Superdude)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2017, 11:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-clothahump-if-you-will/783422/63 "2017-04-02T23:41:58Z")
I’m hoping not. But, considering some of the sniping he and I have done at each other over the years, it wouldn’t surprise me. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2017, 11:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-clothahump-if-you-will/783422/64 "2017-04-02T23:44:47Z")
> [@Not\_Carlson](#): > > \*“They” _are **Miller, Helena330, snfaulkner, ioioio, Grrr!, Wolf333, running coach, eulalia, Robot Arm, running coach, Gilundone, SeDragonTattoo, panache45, steronz, Aspenglow, Beren Erchamion, Lasciel, Bryan Ekers, Yllaria, Guinastasia, Sunny Daze, Budget Player Cadet, pilykamell, Little Nemo, dropzone, BigT, CairoCarol, Gatopescado, SaneBill, some doofus not named Carlson, kambuckta, Nava, kayaker, Fubaya, Knowed Out, Vinyl Turnip, naita, Eonwe, QuickSilver,** and **Azeotrope** _ — all those who posted something that could be considered an opposition to the now banned **CosmicManiac** before you came in from left field to make your sweeping statement of derision, ostensibly in support of the OP. I would guess that he did not see 70% of these posts, and did not bother reading about another 25%. ---
**Author:** ![kayT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayt/32/3633_2.png) [@kayT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayT)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2017, 11:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-clothahump-if-you-will/783422/65 "2017-04-02T23:45:33Z")
I don’t understand how anyone of any political position can fail to see that saying “every time” and “all liberals” and “automatically” is going to be wrong. How can anyone defend saying “all liberals” as “obviously true”? Is this someone who doesn’t understand the meanings of words? ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2017, 11:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-clothahump-if-you-will/783422/66 "2017-04-02T23:53:53Z")
> [@kayT](#): > > I don’t understand how anyone of any political position can fail to see that saying “every time” and “all liberals” and “automatically” is going to be wrong. How can anyone defend saying “all liberals” as “obviously true”? Is this someone who doesn’t understand the meanings of words? These are words used by a self-confessed troll, who posts only to get a negative response, and then revels in that negative response by painting himself as the victim. It’s not really much more than that. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2017, 1:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-clothahump-if-you-will/783422/67 "2017-04-03T01:45:22Z")
My theory is that he tells himself he’s only persecuted because of his political beliefs to make him feel better. Rather than admit the fact that people don’t like him because he’s a total dipshit. ---
**Author:** ![Not\_Carlson](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/bc79bd/32.png) [@Not\_Carlson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Not_Carlson)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2017, 2:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-clothahump-if-you-will/783422/68 "2017-04-03T02:34:14Z")
Thank you, **Clothahump** , for addressing my two followup points. > [@Clothahump](#): > > I went back and re-read them both. That’s what made me acknowledge that my comment was wrong. I shouldn’t have made it. As to (1) although you didnt say it clearly, I’ll assume that your response means that yes you did read the referenced thread before posting. Although this still leaves me wondering why, if you read for comprehension before posting, you went ahead and posted what you did in defense of the OP and as an attack on his detractors, and whether your acknowledgement that your statement was out of place is also acknowledgement that, in the context of that thread, your defence of the OP and your snipe at his detractors was inappropriate. (If you do acknowledge this within yourself, that’s great, and you may be thinking “didn’t I already say that?” but from my perspective I haven’t yet seen that. What I have seen is a very brief admission that your comment was out of place, followed by a greater insistance that it is somehow still valid, regardless of context. Although you have now said your post was “wrong”, so mabe this is the response I was hoping for. I can’t yet be sure.) > [@](#): > > Giving me a negative response is okay. Responding with NOTHING but personal attacks (ad hominem) simply indicates that what I posted was correct and the respondent can’t refute it. Hence the ad hominem. > > But it is not just this thread. It’s damn near any comment I make on any topic at any time. I don’t get intelligent responses, I get name-calling and bullshit on the level of a five year old throwing a tantrum in a sandbox. If a large number of members of a group repeatedly respond in a similar manner, it’s a reasonable assumption that that type of response is indicative of the group as a whole. I have seen the same sort of behavior from the liberals towards other conservative posters here as well. And that is why I made the statement. As for (2), I don’t think you’ve quite yet addressed the question head-on, although you’ve at least offered a relevant clarification of your perspective, which I’d like to come back to later. The question was whether you can recognize that the derision you recieved in that thread (and this) is a result of the content and context of your posts. > [@](#): > > Giving me a negative response is okay. Responding with NOTHING but personal attacks (ad hominem) simply indicates that what I posted was correct and the respondent can’t refute it. Hence the ad hominem. As to your apparent disgust of ad hominem attacks, although it isn’t strictly-speaking ad hominem, I will observe that I have never seen any other poster resort to a “fuck off” retort as often as you. In my opinion that ranks pretty high for vehemency and derision. If I make a dericive remark against another poster in the Pit, I fully accept that it may earn a “fuck off”. But if I’ve also presented a logical or reasonable challenge along with my derisive comment, on a message board whose stated primary mission is to fight ignorance, and I see the target of my post ignore the logic and focus on the derision, I’m apt to dismiss that poster. Maybe in your own mind you feel that this describes your own perspective, but I’m saying that while I’ve observed you making many inflammatory and derisive comments, I haven’t yet seen you make any logical arguments. And your statement above is quite simply not a logical conclusion. To your credit, you are at least responding reasonably to me here and have explained your perspective. Anyway, if you could please directly address the question I put to you in point (2), above, then I hope we can move on to discussing the points I presented in my OP. > [@](#): > > Again, I hope I clarified things. If I didn’t, keep hitting me for follow-ups until I do. Thank you for keeping the door open. > [@](#): > > Calling me a gutless coward, etc., isn’t exactly mild, although I did get a laugh out of the big, brave keyboard warrior making that comment **while posting anonymously on a internet message board**. (Bolding mine) Your name isn’t actually _ **Clothahump** _, is it? ---
**Author:** ![Clothahump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/51bf81/32.png) [@Clothahump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Clothahump)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2017, 2:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-clothahump-if-you-will/783422/69 "2017-04-03T02:59:36Z")
> [@SteveG1](#): > > In response to the bullshit to which you were relying to (Clothy)… > > Clothy: > When everyone around you is an asshole, maybe it isn’t THEM. And maybe it is. ---
**Author:** ![Superdude](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/superdude/32/13450_2.png) [@Superdude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Superdude)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2017, 3:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-clothahump-if-you-will/783422/70 "2017-04-03T03:19:56Z")
But it’s more likely that it’s not them _or_ you being the asshole, it’s them _and_ you. It seems like you’re saying that you’re squeaky clean in those conversations. I can assure you that you’re not. It’s somewhere in the middle. ---
**Author:** ![Clothahump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/51bf81/32.png) [@Clothahump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Clothahump)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2017, 3:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-clothahump-if-you-will/783422/71 "2017-04-03T03:21:12Z")
> [@Not\_Carlson](#): > > Thank you, **Clothahump** , for addressing my two followup points. > > As to (1) although you didnt say it clearly, I’ll assume that your response means that yes you did read the referenced thread before posting. Although this still leaves me wondering why, if you read for comprehension before posting, you went ahead and posted what you did in defense of the OP and as an attack on his detractors, and whether your acknowledgement that your statement was out of place is also acknowledgement that, in the context of that thread, your defence of the OP and your snipe at his detractors was inappropriate. (If you do acknowledge this within yourself, that’s great, and you may be thinking “didn’t I already say that?” but from my perspective I haven’t yet seen that. What I have seen is a very brief admission that your comment was out of place, followed by a greater insistance that it is somehow still valid, regardless of context. Although you have now said your post was “wrong”, so mabe this is the response I was hoping for. I can’t yet be sure.) > > As for (2), I don’t think you’ve quite yet addressed the question head-on, although you’ve at least offered a relevant clarification of your perspective, which I’d like to come back to later. The question was whether you can recognize that the derision you recieved in that thread (and this) is a result of the content and context of your posts. I’m really not sure what you are looking for here. In the context of the threads, my post should not have been made. I can’t state that any clearer or plainer. > [@](#): > > As to your apparent disgust of ad hominem attacks, although it isn’t strictly-speaking ad hominem, I will observe that I have never seen any other poster resort to a “fuck off” retort as often as you. In my opinion that ranks pretty high for vehemency and derision. Saying 'fuck off" is not an ad hominem response. It is not a direct attack against someone, it’s letting them know that they are being annoying. Since it’s a true statement, there’s nothing derisive about it. > [@](#): > > If I make a dericive remark against another poster in the Pit, I fully accept that it may earn a “fuck off”. But if I’ve also presented a logical or reasonable challenge along with my derisive comment, on a message board whose stated primary mission is to fight ignorance, and I see the target of my post ignore the logic and focus on the derision, I’m apt to dismiss that poster. And therein lies the difference. I don’t see posts that present logical or reasonable challenges. I see name-calling and responses at the level of a five year old. On a board whose stated primary mission is to fight ignorance, that is sad beyond belief. > [@](#): > > Maybe in your own mind you feel that this describes your own perspective, but I’m saying that while I’ve observed you making many inflammatory and derisive comments, I haven’t yet seen you make any logical arguments. Really? As an example, for the last eight years, I and many other conservative posters continually pointed out what a miserable failure Obama was as President. We would post reports of his screw-ups and then get shouted down. We were proven correct over and over and over again. Most of the others are gone because they weren’t willing to put up with the bullshit attack responses. I guess I’ve got thicker hide or something, I don’t know. > [@](#): > > And your statement above is quite simply not a logical conclusion. In what manner is it not? > [@](#): > > To your credit, you are at least responding reasonably to me here and have explained your perspective. When I am approached with reasonableness, I will always try to respond in kind. > [@](#): > > Anyway, if you could please directly address the question I put to you in point (2), above, then I hope we can move on to discussing the points I presented in my OP. I believe I have. > [@](#): > > Thank you for keeping the door open. You’re welcome. > [@](#): > > (Bolding mine) > Your name isn’t actually _ **Clothahump** _, is it? [/quote] No, of course not. But can you say irony? And I have to say this: you say that you are a liberal. You are the first one in a long damn time to post anything in a reasonable manner to me, and I thank you. ---
**Author:** ![Clothahump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/51bf81/32.png) [@Clothahump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Clothahump)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2017, 3:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-clothahump-if-you-will/783422/72 "2017-04-03T03:23:51Z")
> [@Not\_Carlson](#): > > **Clothahump** , that \*\*Superdude \*_chap’s words seem pretty reasonable to me. > I hope when the time comes that someone says something like that to me,_ I take a moment to give their words some serious thought. > > \*(again) I neglected to answer this earlier. Superdude is on ignore, so I don’t know what he said. ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2017, 3:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-clothahump-if-you-will/783422/73 "2017-04-03T03:26:50Z")
> [@Clothahump](#): > > I neglected to answer this earlier. Superdude is on ignore, so I don’t know what he said. I know I’m on ignore too. Because you don’t like when people point out that you are constantly wrong. ---
**Author:** ![Superdude](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/superdude/32/13450_2.png) [@Superdude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Superdude)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2017, 3:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-clothahump-if-you-will/783422/74 "2017-04-03T03:27:24Z")
I’m on ignore? Wow. I’ve been one of his milder critics. As I’m sure a few have noticed. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2017, 3:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-clothahump-if-you-will/783422/75 "2017-04-03T03:44:41Z")
> [@Clothahump](#): > > I neglected to answer this earlier. Superdude is on ignore, so I don’t know what he said. > [@Lobohan](#): > > I know I’m on ignore too. Because you don’t like when people point out that you are constantly wrong. > [@Superdude](#): > > I’m on ignore? Wow. I’ve been one of his milder critics. As I’m sure a few have noticed. **Precious Snowflake** likes to dish it out, but can’t take it. He’s fundamentally a coward and a hypocrite. ---
**Author:** ![Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/budget_player_cadet/32/205_2.png) [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Budget_Player_Cadet)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2017, 4:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-clothahump-if-you-will/783422/76 "2017-04-03T04:14:12Z")
> [@Clothahump](#): > > And I have to say this: you say that you are a liberal. You are the first one in a long damn time to post anything in a reasonable manner to me, and I thank you. That’s a damn dirty lie. ---
**Author:** ![Not\_Carlson](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/bc79bd/32.png) [@Not\_Carlson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Not_Carlson)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2017, 5:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-clothahump-if-you-will/783422/77 "2017-04-03T05:49:49Z")
> [@Clothahump](#): > > I’m really not sure what you are looking for here. In the context of the threads, my post should not have been made. I can’t state that any clearer or plainer. All other things aside for now, > [@Not\_Carlson](#): > > (2) . . . > You seem to use posters’ attacks on you as evidence that “liberals” are bigoted or illogical, without acknowledging that the content of your posts or the context in which you make them may justify a negative response. > Since you acknowledge that the Pit thread against \*\*Helena \*\*was an inappropriate place to make your comments, can you also acknowledge that at least some of the subsequent derision you received there and here has been _because_of the inappropriateness of your comments in that context? > [@Not\_Carlson](#): > > . . . (2) can he acknowledge that, in the context, at least some of the rebuke he received was justified. > [@Not\_Carlson](#): > > As for (2), I don’t think you’ve quite yet addressed the question head-on, although you’ve at least offered a relevant clarification of your perspective, which I’d like to come back to later. The question was whether you can recognize that the derision you recieved in that thread (and this) is a result of the content and context of your posts. Once more, I’d like to ask you: Can you recognize that at least some of the derision you received in the referenced Pit thread (all other threads aside for now) was, on this one occasion, justified by the (acknowledged) inappropriateness of your post? Thank you. (I am glad that you are now acknowledging the importance of context.) ---
**Author:** ![Not\_Carlson](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/bc79bd/32.png) [@Not\_Carlson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Not_Carlson)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2017, 6:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-clothahump-if-you-will/783422/78 "2017-04-03T06:10:08Z")
> [@Clothahump](#): > > I neglected to answer this earlier. Superdude is on ignore, so I don’t know what he said. Assuming my quoting this means you can now see it: > [@Superdude](#): > > Point of order, **Clothahump** : > > I’ve posted on this board for over 15 years. Over that time, I’ve had the opportunity to see scores of interactions between you and other posters. At no time have I seen you engage, or attempt to engage, in anything even approaching civility. You don’t debate, you insult. You characterize anyone disagreeing with you as stupid. You consider yourself as intellectually superior to just about every other person who posts here, yet when an assertion of yours is challenged, you either resort to insults and condescension, or you abandon the thread, never to return to it. > > If you feel like you’re an unfair target in your interactions, you might want to admit that at least part of the problem is that you engage in dishonest debate tactics. > > I’m not trying to insult you, or turn people against you. I’m not trying to disrespect you, either. I’m just trying to get you to realize how you come across to others. I’m reminded of an old joke about Taylor Swift, and how she should write a song called “Maybe It’s Me.” > > Yes, some people here disrespect you. But you haven’t exactly made it easy for them to change their opinion. > [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > You’re really asking for yet another “Fuck off”, aren’t you? > [@Superdude](#): > > I’m hoping not. But, considering some of the sniping he and I have done at each other over the years, it wouldn’t surprise me. . . . > [@Superdude](#): > > But it’s more likely that it’s not them _or_ you being the asshole, it’s them _and_ you. It seems like you’re saying that you’re squeaky clean in those conversations. I can assure you that you’re not. It’s somewhere in the middle. . . . > [@Superdude](#): > > I’m on ignore? Wow. I’ve been one of his milder critics. As I’m sure a few have noticed. Maybe you should unblock him. ---
**Author:** ![kayT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayt/32/3633_2.png) [@kayT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayT)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2017, 12:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-clothahump-if-you-will/783422/79 "2017-04-03T12:08:08Z")
I thought it was against board rules to say who you have on ignore; am I wrong? ---
**Author:** ![Clothahump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/51bf81/32.png) [@Clothahump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Clothahump)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2017, 12:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-clothahump-if-you-will/783422/80 "2017-04-03T12:20:07Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > **Precious Snowflake** likes to dish it out, but can’t take it. He’s fundamentally a coward and a hypocrite. If you weren’t a mod, you’d have been on ignore a long time ago. You’re one of the biggest assholes on this board, and you have no place calling me a hypocrite. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-clothahump-if-you-will/783422.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-clothahump-if-you-will/783422.md?page=5)