# Mr. Clothahump, if you will **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [March 31, 2017, 4:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-clothahump-if-you-will/783422 "2017-03-31T16:23:22Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![Not\_Carlson](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/bc79bd/32.png) [@Not\_Carlson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Not_Carlson)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2017, 4:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-clothahump-if-you-will/783422/101 "2017-04-03T16:28:46Z")
> [@Clothahump](#): > > Maybe I shouldn’t. He went on the ignore list for being an asshole. No, Clothahump, \*\*\*I \*\*\*am an asshole! (Please read in Darth Vader’s voice for full effect.) I mean, [the world is full of “assholes”.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tVJC0LJTYZc) I don’t like ‘em none neither, but try blocking them all out and there’ll be no end to it. Your world will grow ever smaller when you choose to dismiss and ignore other perspectives, such as those offered by **Superdude**. > [@Superdude](#): > > But it’s more likely that it’s not them _or_ you being the asshole, it’s them _and_ you. It seems like you’re saying that you’re squeaky clean in those conversations. I can assure you that you’re not. It’s somewhere in the middle. That’s a pretty fair and balanced persepctive. Butts on both sides of the scales. > [@Clothahump](#): > > And for the record, his statement is incorrect, but **no one seems to mind things like that around here any more**. There was a _Golden Age_? Sorry, I’m getting distracted. Please feel free to just ignore this post. ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2017, 4:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-clothahump-if-you-will/783422/102 "2017-04-03T16:29:37Z")
> [@Fotheringay-Phipps](#): > > The question therefore is whether clothahump is an outlier in terms of being worse than most, either in frequency or severity, or if there are many others just as bad as him but who don’t attract the same level of criticism because their politics are in line with the board’s. It’s more the inability to argue in good faith than the politics. At some point, it becomes less painful to berate a wall rather than continue beating one’s head against it. ---
**Author:** ![Not\_Carlson](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/bc79bd/32.png) [@Not\_Carlson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Not_Carlson)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2017, 4:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-clothahump-if-you-will/783422/103 "2017-04-03T16:39:44Z")
> [@Fotheringay-Phipps](#): > > No problem at all. In all candor, I genuinely doubt your sincerity in starting this thread. You have made that much quite apparent from the get-go. > [@](#): > > My point was that you can’t settle the issue by hashing out one particular instance, as you were purporting to attempt. Well, I’ll keep trying the one-step-at-a-time approach for now. I started the thread as a callout without much hope, but I do now have some small hope that it might get us somewhere. As frustrating as this is, I’m actually starting to see **Clothahump** a little more as a person rather than a caricature, so at least there’s that. ---
**Author:** ![El\_Kabong](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/el_kabong/32/496_2.png) [@El\_Kabong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/El_Kabong)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2017, 5:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-clothahump-if-you-will/783422/104 "2017-04-03T17:59:04Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > He really isn’t, though. Even hyperpartisan debaters who are capable of analysing and responding to the substantive issues in their opponents’ posts manage to earn some grudging respect on this board. **Clothahump** , on the other hand, has yet to demonstrate any notable critical thinking skills at all. His sole rhetorical gambit, repeated in various forms, is “You’re liberal, therefore you’re stupid, therefore I win.” Like the man in the Monty Python sketch he confuses arguments and abuse, and like the knight in a different Monty Python sketch he keeps insisting he’s winning when he’s run out of legs to stand on. > > Consider his [Stupid Liberal Idea of the Day thread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=605448). He launches right off with “So many to choose from”, and then promptly falls over at the first hurdle with a blatant misrepresentation of a non-issue. Most of the rest of the thread is left to us so-called liberals to fill - which we’ve been doing - while he sputters and posts abuse and insists there are so many examples of stupid liberal ideas that he can’t possibly choose one, occasionally selecting something from one of the far-right sources he apparently relies heavily on only to have it picked apart by those with more discerning eyes. Occasionally, in a stopped-clock kind of way, he manages to hit close to the mark but there’s no evidence that he understands how those differ from all the attempts that have gone wide of the mark. > > None of this will have any effect on him, more’s the pity. Those posts not actively blocked by the Ignore function are blocked by his impenetrable Dunning-Krugerism. But we persevere anyway, because this is the internet. Hear hear. The quoted post really captures the fundamental essence of **Clothahump** ism, IMO. ---
**Author:** ![Buck\_Godot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/buck_godot/32/6573_2.png) [@Buck\_Godot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Buck_Godot)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2017, 6:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-clothahump-if-you-will/783422/105 "2017-04-03T18:52:39Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > None of this will have any effect on him, more’s the pity. Those posts not actively blocked by the Ignore function are blocked by his impenetrable Dunning-Krugerism. But we persevere anyway, because this is the internet. Yes this is exactly the problem I have with him, and also why I am willing to cut him more slack than some of the more obvious trolls, (such as the late binkyandpinky). Clothahump really doesn’t appear to be able to recognize the difference between a well reasoned argument backed up by evidence and a knee jerk reposting of a partisan talking point. And all arguments are equally good, the only difference is that some are on the left and some are on the right. So when multiple posters eviscerate one of his posts by citing reliable sources that demonstrably contradict everything he posted. He can dismiss them as just partisan opinions that are no better (and since come on the “wrong” side actually worse) then his original post. Basically like the art restorer who decided to improve [on the Ecce Homo](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/newreply.php?do=newreply&p=20111103), and can’t see that what she did is any worse than what any art restorer would do. I can’t get that upset at him because I feel he honestly doesn’t know any better. ---
**Author:** ![Clothahump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/51bf81/32.png) [@Clothahump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Clothahump)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2017, 9:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-clothahump-if-you-will/783422/106 "2017-04-03T21:30:47Z")
> [@Not\_Carlson](#): > > The question is whether you can acknowledge that at least some of the derision you received was justified. > > It is important because it goes to the heart of your claim that this board is full of bigots, bullies and buttheads. > It is important because it is central to the question of why you receive so much flack on this board and why people generally refuse to engage you. > It is important because it is connected to the number of blank posts that show up on your screen when you open a thread. > It is important because it is the hook on which I hang my hopes of having a reasonable discourse with you. > > Saying “I shouldn’t have made the post” is a promising but ambiguous admission. > “As to be expected, a pile-on occurred” seems to me to be sliding back into the territory of blame-shifting. > “If I hadn’t made the post, it wouldn’t have” is an overly detached cause-effect observation that is neither an admission nor denial of culpability. (Similarly, if you had not turned on your computer that day you would not have been caught in a “pile-on”.) > > I’m NOT asking whether you think you should or shouldn’t have made the post. > I’m NOT asking whether you regret making the post. > I’m NOT asking whether you think your post was justifiable in the greater context of board biases and bullying. > > I’m not trying to goad you or set a trap for you. (Honest to god, who may or may not exist.) > I’m just trying to lay the groundwork for straight and honest discourse. > I must sound like a scratched record, but I feel like Sysyphus here. > > So, at the risk of us perpetually talking past each other, I will ask again: > \*\*THE QUESTION: \*\ ***Can you acknowledge that at least some of the derision you received in the referenced Pit thread was justified?** > > **Yes?** > (Cards on the table: I am actually hoping you \*will \*respond in this manner, perhaps with some introspective elaboration, and prove that you are capable of self-assessment and accepting responsibility for how others see you.) > > **No?** > (Honestly, this would disappoint me, but I realize it’s a strong possibility, which I would at least hope would be accompanied by something approaching a reasoned explanation.) Some, yes. Although I would bet money that even if the comment had been germane to the threads in question, there would still have been the usual shit-slinging by the usual suspects. Cards on the table: I know how others on this board see me. I’m conservative and I am outspoken. I also refuse to roll over and accept the shit that the liberals think I deserve for being conservative. And I know that annoys the hell out of them. And that is where all the fooraw comes from - I respond back to them in the manner that they respond to me and they get all bent out of shape about it. No self-assessment necessary, my friend. I’ve been very open about this from day one. ---
**Author:** ![Clothahump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/51bf81/32.png) [@Clothahump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Clothahump)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2017, 9:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-clothahump-if-you-will/783422/107 "2017-04-03T21:33:27Z")
> [@Chimera](#): > > And you still doubt he’s the Cobra Kai guy? :dubious: Since the Cobra Kai guy was fictitious and I’m not, I think that should answer your question for you. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2017, 9:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-clothahump-if-you-will/783422/108 "2017-04-03T21:43:35Z")
> [@Clothahump](#): > > Cards on the table: I know how others on this board see me. I’m conservative and I am outspoken. I also refuse to roll over and accept the shit that the liberals think I deserve for being conservative. And I know that annoys the hell out of them. And that is where all the fooraw comes from - I respond back to them in the manner that they respond to me and they get all bent out of shape about it. > > No self-assessment necessary, my friend. I’ve been very open about this from day one. Someone who this idiot hasn’t already blocked needs to remind him that the reason he is generally ridiculed isn’t because he’s an “outspoken conservative”. ---
**Author:** ![Chimera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Chimera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chimera)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2017, 9:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-clothahump-if-you-will/783422/109 "2017-04-03T21:46:31Z")
Pretty much the personification of Dunning-Kruger Syndrome. He thinks he’s an intelligent conservative. He’s too retarded to know otherwise and simply assumes it is an political insult when his idiocy is called out. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2017, 9:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-clothahump-if-you-will/783422/110 "2017-04-03T21:48:04Z")
> [@Clothahump](#): > > Some, yes. Although I would bet money that even if the comment had been germane to the threads in question, there would still have been the usual shit-slinging by the usual suspects. > > Cards on the table: I know how others on this board see me. I’m conservative and I am outspoken. I also refuse to roll over and accept the shit that the liberals think I deserve for being conservative. And I know that annoys the hell out of them. And that is where all the fooraw comes from - I respond back to them in the manner that they respond to me and they get all bent out of shape about it. > > No self-assessment necessary, my friend. I’ve been very open about this from day one. How about the ethnic slur usage? Can you be open about that? ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2017, 10:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-clothahump-if-you-will/783422/111 "2017-04-03T22:01:16Z")
I really love how he knows that everyone would have been mean to him, even IF his comment had been germane to the thread. Because he already knows what everyone thinks. ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2017, 10:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-clothahump-if-you-will/783422/112 "2017-04-03T22:03:48Z")
> [@QuickSilver](#): > > Someone who this idiot hasn’t already blocked needs to remind him that the reason he is generally ridiculed isn’t because he’s an “outspoken conservative”. In one of those locked threads, I tried pointing out the dichotomy between wanting “a rational debate” and slowly putting on ignore any and all ideas that he finds inconvenient. If he doesn’t get banned first, he’ll eventually only see posts by himself and his fellow Trump supporters. How can one have any sort of debate when the only posts one really pays attention to agrees with one? ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2017, 10:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-clothahump-if-you-will/783422/113 "2017-04-03T22:12:21Z")
> [@Skywatcher](#): > > How can one have any sort of debate when the only posts one really pays attention to agrees with one? A “debate” in which you are assured of WINNING, while assuring yourself that everyone that you can’t see is saying mean things about you. ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Economist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/c89c15/32.png) [@Evil\_Economist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Economist)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2017, 10:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-clothahump-if-you-will/783422/114 "2017-04-03T22:37:03Z")
**Clothahump** , could you link to a single post of yours where you responded in a reasoned manner to a liberal about any political issue ever? ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2017, 10:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-clothahump-if-you-will/783422/115 "2017-04-03T22:37:49Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > A “debate” in which you are assured of WINNING, while assuring yourself that everyone that you can’t see is saying mean things about you. Exactly. He’s [contributing to the very thing he’s complaining about](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=20037515#post20037515) (i.e.: the supposed circling of the drain). ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2017, 11:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-clothahump-if-you-will/783422/116 "2017-04-03T23:27:09Z")
> [@Clothahump](#): > > the shit that the liberals think I deserve for being conservative. No, that isn’t the reason. :rolleyes:😛 ---
**Author:** ![Not\_Carlson](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/bc79bd/32.png) [@Not\_Carlson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Not_Carlson)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2017, 12:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-clothahump-if-you-will/783422/117 "2017-04-04T00:49:35Z")
> [@Clothahump](#): > > Some, yes. Although I would bet money that even if the comment had been germane to the threads in question, there would still have been the usual shit-slinging by the usual suspects. > > Cards on the table: I know how others on this board see me. I’m conservative and I am outspoken. I also refuse to roll over and accept the shit that the liberals think I deserve for being conservative. And I know that annoys the hell out of them. And that is where all the fooraw comes from - I respond back to them in the manner that they respond to me and they get all bent out of shape about it. > > No self-assessment necessary, my friend. I’ve been very open about this from day one. Thank you. I’ll take it. You’re still couching it with unnecessary justifications, but in light of your general impression of the board majority, that’s understandible. Now I hope we can get around to discussing the actual points of my OP. But I think I’ll wait until I’m back at my PC and not trying to type and format posts on my phone. (Bloody annoying miracle of technology.) Mean time, to address your earlier comments on bullying, I do think there is a good deal of bullying on this board, but I see it on both sides of the political spectrum. I myself have participated in what you might call bullying. And not all opposition, or even all derision, is necessarily bullying. Of course this board’s apparent left-leaning majority may give the impression of Liberal bullying, but if you look at each member and each post individually, you see a variety of ideas, sentiments, and perspectives. (Of course, if you’ve blocked a whole bunch of folks, you’ll see much less variety.) I’ve seen ostensibly liberal members make some of the dumbest, meanest posts imaginable, and I’ve seen conservative members make insightful and rational posts. And vice versa. I’ve seen some some rather clever zingers fired off at liberal members and, looking up at the poster’s name, been surprised to see it’s someone I’d written off as a witless goon. But from what you’ve told me, you have personal or close experience of bullying and its hurtful impact. So I can understand why you would be so angry at perceived bullying on this board, and why you would be closed to discourse with those you consider to be bullies. I don’t think this excuses your own behavior on this board, and I think you’re dead wrong about your characterization of most board members and your explanation for why you encounter so much negativity here. But I can now see it probably comes from more than just a desire to goad librulz. Personal attacks and vitriol are supposed to be kept to the Pit so that the board can function as a place of reasonable discussion, and I think the board is generally well moderated. If you genuinely hate what you see here in the Pit, why not just keep away from the Pit. If you think you see personal attacks and bullying outside the Pit, make a stand by reporting it to the mods (the take-it-to-the-teacher rule of bully handling). Although you may have burned your bridges with them. (I come here FOR the conflict, because I find a lot of it funny and witty. And, yes, I also come here for the adrenaline buzz from reasuring myself that I’m on the right vaguely-defined team in the unclear game of life.) > [@QuickSilver](#): > > Someone who this idiot hasn’t already blocked needs to remind him that the reason he is generally ridiculed isn’t because he’s an “outspoken conservative”. **Clothahump** , the reason you are generally ridiculed isn’t because you’re an “outspoken conservative”. Well, at least it isn’t the only reason. Some folks have other reasons for objecting to your posts. For example: > [@iiandyiiii](#): > > How about the ethnic slur usage? Can you be open about that? ---
**Author:** ![Clothahump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/51bf81/32.png) [@Clothahump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Clothahump)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2017, 1:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-clothahump-if-you-will/783422/118 "2017-04-04T01:26:43Z")
> [@Chimera](#): > > Pretty much the personification of Dunning-Kruger Syndrome. > > He thinks he’s an intelligent conservative. He’s too retarded to know otherwise and simply assumes it is an political insult when his idiocy is called out. That statement is a bald-faced lie. ---
**Author:** ![Clothahump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/51bf81/32.png) [@Clothahump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Clothahump)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2017, 1:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-clothahump-if-you-will/783422/119 "2017-04-04T01:31:23Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > I really love how he knows that everyone would have been mean to him, even IF his comment had been germane to the thread. Because he already knows what everyone thinks. Did you not read the statement I made earlier? If I see repeated behavior under certain circumstances from a large segment of a population, it’s a safe assumption that will be behavior indicative of the group as a whole. Based on a long-standing history, it goes like this: 1. I post something 2. Liberals on the board take a collective shit and fling it at me. 3. Repeat ad nauseam I really love how people ignore what I say just so they can, ya know, make fools of themselves in public. Your post is a classic example. ---
**Author:** ![Clothahump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/51bf81/32.png) [@Clothahump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Clothahump)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2017, 1:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-clothahump-if-you-will/783422/120 "2017-04-04T01:33:45Z")
> [@Skywatcher](#): > > In one of those locked threads, I tried pointing out the dichotomy between wanting “a rational debate” and slowly putting on ignore any and all ideas that he finds inconvenient. If he doesn’t get banned first, he’ll eventually only see posts by himself and his fellow Trump supporters. > > How can one have any sort of debate when the only posts one really pays attention to agrees with one? I’m not putting people on ignore because they disagree with me. I’m putting them on ignore because they are assholes. I’m just not inclined to put up with their bullshit any more. People can disagree with me all they want. That is what leads to conversation and discourse. Everywhere, apparently, except here. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-clothahump-if-you-will/783422.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mr-clothahump-if-you-will/783422.md?page=7)