# Mrs Clinton's vulnerabilities which could be exploited in a Primary **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [April 23, 2015, 6:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mrs-clintons-vulnerabilities-which-could-be-exploited-in-a-primary/718376 "2015-04-23T18:45:21Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2015, 11:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mrs-clintons-vulnerabilities-which-could-be-exploited-in-a-primary/718376/21 "2015-04-23T23:46:21Z")
> [@AHunter3](#): > > No one seeking an ideologically pure or ethically pristine candidate was ever going to get enthused about Hillary Clinton. She’s primarily a wheeler-dealer political insider type of politician. There was a time when that might have been a factor. But the 2000 election killed that idea. I’m think every person who voted for Nader instead of Gore because Gore wasn’t pure enough spent eight years regretting that decision. ---
**Author:** ![ITR\_champion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/c67d28/32.png) [@ITR\_champion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ITR_champion)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2015, 1:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mrs-clintons-vulnerabilities-which-could-be-exploited-in-a-primary/718376/22 "2015-04-24T01:14:45Z")
> [@AK84](#): > > This time around are there any vulnerabilities like that that could be exploited by an Obama type candidate? Hillary has a vast number of such vulnerabilities. Despite that, I expect she’ll cruise to an easy victory in the Democratic primary. For one thing, the other candidates are laughably weak. (Jim Webb, I’m looking at you when I say this.) But Hillary’s biggest vulnerability is also the reason she’ll win: she’s a creature of the Democratic establishment and Wall Street. Corporations and rich people will give her tons and tons of money, knowing that she’ll repay them if she becomes President. A few things that could be brought up by a liberal primary opponent: [ul] [li]Claims to care about income inequality, but makes more in an hour than most of us make in three years.[/li][li]Opposed designating Boko Haram as a terrorist group.[/li][li]Supports the corn ethanol mandate.[/li][li]Opposed gay marriage for a very long time, and flip-flopped only after the rest of the Democrats had done so.[/li][li]When they moved to New York, Bill and Hillary chose to live in a very rich enclave. Moreover, it’s a place with virtually no Blacks or Hispanics.[/li][/ul] ---
**Author:** ![Ibn\_Warraq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e19b73/32.png) [@Ibn\_Warraq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ibn_Warraq)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2015, 1:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mrs-clintons-vulnerabilities-which-could-be-exploited-in-a-primary/718376/23 "2015-04-24T01:40:49Z")
> [@Oakminster](#): > > Guns. She hates them. A pro gun candidate should be able to exploit that against her. In the Democratic primaries?:dubious: As for the general election the gun nuts are going to vote against her anyway. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2015, 2:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mrs-clintons-vulnerabilities-which-could-be-exploited-in-a-primary/718376/24 "2015-04-24T02:32:27Z")
> [@Haberdash](#): > > Whatever. The fact is that there is a substantial population of “people who agree with Democrats on every issue but guns” and Democratic candidates who shut up about guns always do better because they attract the votes of those people. I don’t normally agree with you, but I do agree with the logic here. It may not be a huge deal, but it is something that could harm her versus someone equally viable. Problem is, as people say, there isn’t likely to be an equally viable candidate. So these people will likely hold their nose and vote for Clinton. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2015, 3:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mrs-clintons-vulnerabilities-which-could-be-exploited-in-a-primary/718376/25 "2015-04-24T03:03:16Z")
> [@BobLibDem](#): > > One man’s bottom falling out of the tub is another man’s success story. Obama will be remembered as the guy who had the courage to begin to put an end to a 50 year failed embargo against Cuba, who negotiated with the Iranians to stop them from developing nukes, and who didn’t lie to start a war. I think she can run on the Obama foreign policy quite well, thank you. Foreign policy isn’t just about what you did or tried to do, it’s also about what happened and how you reacted to it. When Mrs. Clinton was SecState, we had a fairly aggressive, strong foreign policy. Once she was gone, various bad actors started screwing with the administration and getting away with it. That’s obviously a point in her favor. As for her weaknesses, if she starts trailing in the polls by the end of the year against Republican hopefuls(she’s currently only polling a few points ahead at 45-46 support), then her weakness will quite simply be electability. A fresh face will probably have a better chance. Clinton’s strength is based on her perceived strength, if that makes sense. If she looks weak as a candidate, the bottom will fall out of her campaign. ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2015, 4:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mrs-clintons-vulnerabilities-which-could-be-exploited-in-a-primary/718376/26 "2015-04-24T04:45:57Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > T > > **AK84** , if you could be more specific about how you think the bottom has fallen out of US foreign policy, it would be possible to answer you on the point. But even so, in a primary or even a general election in the US, foreign policy just doesn’t matter much anyway, unless the screwup is so monumental that our own people are getting killed in large numbers over it. Even when the subject comes up, a candidate whose one answer to every problem is to bomb the bastards will typically not do well. It certainly did matter in 2008 and was one of the reasons it cost her the nomination. To answer your question Russia/Ukraine. She touted the “reset” quite a bit when she was Secretary Iraq-ISIS growth after withdrawal. Syria WMD fiasco Libya has gone quite bad since 2012 ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2015, 11:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mrs-clintons-vulnerabilities-which-could-be-exploited-in-a-primary/718376/27 "2015-04-24T11:19:03Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Once she was gone, various bad actors started screwing with the administration and getting away with it. This is a statement of opinion, not fact. I don’t buy the right wing critique of Obama’s foreign policy. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2015, 11:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mrs-clintons-vulnerabilities-which-could-be-exploited-in-a-primary/718376/28 "2015-04-24T11:21:18Z")
Wouldn’t it make more sense though for us to say that things got BETTER after Clinton left? Observing that things got worse may give us satisfaction that we’re making Obama look bad, but he’s not the one running for President. But yes, it is opinion to some extent. What is not opinion is that Obama’s second term has been much more difficult on foreign policy than his first. It is also a fact that his foreign policy poll ratings were very high when Clinton was SecState and very low shortly after she left. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2015, 11:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mrs-clintons-vulnerabilities-which-could-be-exploited-in-a-primary/718376/29 "2015-04-24T11:25:31Z")
> [@](#): > > It is also a fact that his foreign policy poll ratings were very high when Clinton was SecState and very low shortly after she left. The “very low” is not a fact – they were lower, but not very low. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2015, 11:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mrs-clintons-vulnerabilities-which-could-be-exploited-in-a-primary/718376/30 "2015-04-24T11:34:35Z")
Pretty darn low, and Presidents usually get pretty high ratings on foreign policy: [http://pollingreport.com/obama\_ad.htm](http://pollingreport.com/obama_ad.htm) Last poll had him at 42%. 38% according to CBS a month ago. CBS had his foreign policy rating at 51% when Clinton left. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2015, 1:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mrs-clintons-vulnerabilities-which-could-be-exploited-in-a-primary/718376/31 "2015-04-24T13:57:00Z")
> [@AK84](#): > > To answer your question > > Russia/Ukraine. She touted the “reset” quite a bit when she was Secretary And Russia is now at a historically low ebb in its international influence, it’s as isolated as a country its size can be, its economy is in the tank, and it’s Putin’s fault, not Clinton’s. Your point is not clear. > [@](#): > > Iraq-ISIS growth after withdrawal. US withdrawal from Iraq is not the cause of the ongoing disaster there; arguably the cause was US _entry into_ Iraq. Ethnic/religious fighting has been pretty serious there for a long time, and IS is not really anything new except for the beheadings part. How you link that to US foreign policy is unclear, but anything you could recommend that we aren’t already doing would be interesting to learn. > [@](#): > > Syria WMD fiasco Pretty much the same answer, the Syria mess being basically ISIS again, following a popular uprising. How is that a failure of US foreign policy, unless your answer is the one many in the US have as their sole answer - to find someone to bomb? Iranian nukes, not Syrian gas shells, are the bigger concern in the region, wouldn’t you say? > [@](#): > > Libya has gone quite bad since 2012 Yes, it has. Same question. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2015, 1:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mrs-clintons-vulnerabilities-which-could-be-exploited-in-a-primary/718376/32 "2015-04-24T13:58:58Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > As for her weaknesses, if she starts trailing in the polls by the end of the year against Republican hopefuls(she’s currently only polling a few points ahead at 45-46 support) With double-digit leads on all of them, you might acknowledge but won’t. > [@](#): > > A fresh face will probably have a better chance. Once again, who? Can’t beat somebody with nobody. As you know. > [@](#): > > If she looks weak as a candidate, the bottom will fall out of her campaign. Gotta be a pony in there … ---
**Author:** ![Haberdash](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Haberdash](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Haberdash)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2015, 2:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mrs-clintons-vulnerabilities-which-could-be-exploited-in-a-primary/718376/33 "2015-04-24T14:09:57Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > With double-digit leads on all of them, you might acknowledge but won’t. If you cherry-pick the most Clinton-favorable result out of each, maybe. If you look at the median of the various polls, then no. > **[2016 General Election: Bush vs. Clinton | RealClearPolling](https://www.realclearpolling.com/polls/president/general/2016/bush-vs-clinton)** > > 2016 General Election: Bush vs. Clinton | RealClearPolling As usual, these polls aren’t reliable in any case, since it doesn’t matter whether people in New York and California really hate Jeb Bush or only sort of hate Jeb Bush; the Democrat is going to win those states anyway and you don’t get more electoral votes for winning them at 59% instead of 53%. When it gets down to it, who is going to win Pennsylvania, Ohio, and Florida? It’s folly to try to predict anything at this point. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2015, 2:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mrs-clintons-vulnerabilities-which-could-be-exploited-in-a-primary/718376/34 "2015-04-24T14:20:45Z")
So how ya gonna beat her? How ya gonna win _all_ of PA, OH, and FL, which is what you have to do? Being against her isn’t enough, as the polls showing all of your guys getting beat badly show, you gotta make people wanna vote _for_ your guy instead. How ya gonna do that? ---
**Author:** ![Haberdash](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Haberdash](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Haberdash)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2015, 2:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mrs-clintons-vulnerabilities-which-could-be-exploited-in-a-primary/718376/35 "2015-04-24T14:35:31Z")
Me? I’m not running for President, so I concede that I have little chance of winning the election. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2015, 2:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mrs-clintons-vulnerabilities-which-could-be-exploited-in-a-primary/718376/36 "2015-04-24T14:46:13Z")
If you don’t have an answer, it’s perfectly OK to say so. ---
**Author:** ![Haberdash](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Haberdash](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Haberdash)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2015, 2:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mrs-clintons-vulnerabilities-which-could-be-exploited-in-a-primary/718376/37 "2015-04-24T14:53:20Z")
If you’re asking how a Republican could win, the paths are: \*drop in consumer confidence between now and the election – always damages incumbent party with swing voters \*election becomes about guns – Democrats don’t win when this happens, and PA and OH have lots of gun owners who aren’t solid Republicans when elections focus on other issues \*credible anti-Obamacare candidate succeeds in making the election about ACA I don’t know if the Republicans are capable of nominating someone who can stay on-message about Obamacare without waffling or verging into areas that turn off economic voters like social conservative bullshit. The other issues are beyond their control to some extent; Clinton can choose to not make guns an issue, and the economy is going to do what it does. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2015, 2:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mrs-clintons-vulnerabilities-which-could-be-exploited-in-a-primary/718376/38 "2015-04-24T14:54:55Z")
> [@BobLibDem](#): > > How many Democratic pro-guns are there? In the general, the pro-gun crowd reflexively votes Republican. I can’t say about the population in general, but we’ve got a number of passionately pro-gun folks on this board who lean Dem on most other issues. ---
**Author:** ![Omar\_Little](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omar_little/32/269_2.png) [@Omar\_Little](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omar_Little)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2015, 3:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mrs-clintons-vulnerabilities-which-could-be-exploited-in-a-primary/718376/39 "2015-04-24T15:03:05Z")
> [@PastTense](#): > > I think Clinton is so far ahead that there is no realistic possibility of beating her in the primaries. So candidates will either be interested in the Vice Presidency or positioning themselves for the nomination in later years. :dubious: Don’t follow politics much? ---
**Author:** ![CaptMurdock](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/captmurdock/32/11736_2.png) [@CaptMurdock](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CaptMurdock)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2015, 3:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mrs-clintons-vulnerabilities-which-could-be-exploited-in-a-primary/718376/40 "2015-04-24T15:04:26Z")
> [@Haberdash](#): > > If you’re asking how a Republican could win, the paths are: > > \*drop in consumer confidence between now and the election – always damages incumbent party with swing voters Consumer confidence seems to be on the rise, albeit slowly. That is not faster is mostly due to 30 years of growth being skewed to the .1% in the detritus of Reagonomics. > [@](#): > > \*election becomes about guns – Democrats don’t win when this happens, and PA and OH have lots of gun owners who aren’t solid Republicans when elections focus on other issues Given how the last eight years of “They’re gonna take our guns!!! ZOMG!!” has resulted in nothing, I think that particular cry of “Wolf” is not going to get any traction. > [@](#): > > \*credible anti-Obamacare candidate succeeds in making the election about ACA By 2016, “credible anti-Obamacare candidate” is going to be in the same deserted green room with the “credible anti-Social Security canditate”. Maybe there will be some peanuts left over for them to munch on. > [@](#): > > I don’t know if the Republicans are capable of nominating someone who can stay on-message about Obamacare without waffling or verging into areas that turn off economic voters like social conservative bullshit. Based on how many of the GOP wannabes are still bleating about same-sex marriage… it doesn’t look good. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mrs-clintons-vulnerabilities-which-could-be-exploited-in-a-primary/718376.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mrs-clintons-vulnerabilities-which-could-be-exploited-in-a-primary/718376.md?page=3)