# MS Excel has me stumped **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [June 9, 2004, 3:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-excel-has-me-stumped/249459 "2004-06-09T15:30:04Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 18\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Carnac\_the\_Magnificent](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ccd318/32.png) [@Carnac\_the\_Magnificent](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Carnac_the_Magnificent)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2004, 3:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-excel-has-me-stumped/249459/1 "2004-06-09T15:30:04Z")
I’m stuck. Let’s say I have a spreadsheet of business contacts and I want to add the telephone number to this entry: XYZ, Inc. Donald Trump, Mail Clerk 400 Rockefeller Ave New York, NY 10014 How do I insert the telephone number? When I hit \ to move the second line down and out of the way, the cursor jumps to the field below. When I hit the \ key, the cursor bumps over to the right. My solution to date has been to type in the new information at the end of, say, Line 1 and then keep hitting the space bar until the new information wraps around onto Line 2. Me dumb, no? :smack: ---
**Author:** ![Aeschines](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aeschines/32/16251_2.png) [@Aeschines](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aeschines)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2004, 3:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-excel-has-me-stumped/249459/2 "2004-06-09T15:34:31Z")
> [@Carnac the Magnificent!](#): > > I’m stuck. Let’s say I have a spreadsheet of business contacts and I want to add the telephone number to this entry: > > XYZ, Inc. > Donald Trump, Mail Clerk > 400 Rockefeller Ave > New York, NY 10014 > > How do I insert the telephone number? > > When I hit \ to move the second line down and out of the way, the cursor jumps to the field below. When I hit the \ key, the cursor bumps over to the right. > > My solution to date has been to type in the new information at the end of, say, Line 1 and then keep hitting the space bar until the new information wraps around onto Line 2. Me dumb, no? :smack: OK, suppose this is all in the same cell, right? In that case the ALT key plus ENTER provides the line break. Interesting, non? If the things are in different cells, then of course you just grab the cells. If you have to add an entire line, select the tab for the row on the left and hit CTRL and + (plus key) together. Or select the row and use functions under “Edit.” ---
**Author:** ![don\_t\_ask](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e68b1a/32.png) [@don\_t\_ask](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/don_t_ask)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2004, 3:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-excel-has-me-stumped/249459/3 "2004-06-09T15:35:00Z")
I sincerely hope this isn’t the answer: Click in the second row and from the menu select Insert\>Rows ---
**Author:** ![Armilla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e19b73/32.png) [@Armilla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Armilla)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2004, 3:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-excel-has-me-stumped/249459/4 "2004-06-09T15:35:15Z")
Right-click on the cell you want to insert the line _above_. Select “Insert” and tick “Shift cells down” in the dialogue. Or am I missing something here? ---
**Author:** ![Aeschines](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aeschines/32/16251_2.png) [@Aeschines](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aeschines)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2004, 3:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-excel-has-me-stumped/249459/5 "2004-06-09T15:36:51Z")
Yes, as Armilla suggests, you can also grab a group of cells and hit CTRL and + or CTRL and - and it will give you shifting options. I think the ALT and Enter for line break is what you’re talking about, though. ---
**Author:** ![Shoeless](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shoeless/32/7099_2.png) [@Shoeless](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shoeless)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2004, 3:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-excel-has-me-stumped/249459/6 "2004-06-09T15:37:37Z")
If the OP is trying to insert a line break / carriage return into an existing cell, then **Aeschines** is correct. Alt+Enter will create a new line within the cell. ---
**Author:** ![Jpeg\_Jones](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/4bbf92/32.png) [@Jpeg\_Jones](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jpeg_Jones)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2004, 4:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-excel-has-me-stumped/249459/7 "2004-06-09T16:57:10Z")
[pet peeve mode=on] You’re using Excel all wrong. Your _columns_ should be the different types of data and your _rows_ should be all the different contacts. Instead of this: ```auto Name: Joe Blow Mary Smith Billy Brown Address: 123 Main St 456 Main St 789 Main St Phone: (310) 444-1000 (310) 444-1002 (310) 444-1003 ``` You should be doing this: ```auto Last: First: Street: Street No: Phone: Blow Joe Main St 123 (310) 444-1000 Brown Billy Main St 789 (310) 444-1003 Smith Mary Main St 456 (310) 444-1002 ``` Dig? Now, when you need to add a field, such as birthday, or fax#, whatever, you use the method mentioned above to insert a new column wherever you want it. DON’T tack new types of information into an existing column by just adding spaces. Please keep your data in discreet, easily sortable chunks. Otherwise, you might just as well use Word. [/pet peeve mode=off] ---
**Author:** ![Carnac\_the\_Magnificent](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ccd318/32.png) [@Carnac\_the\_Magnificent](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Carnac_the_Magnificent)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2004, 6:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-excel-has-me-stumped/249459/8 "2004-06-09T18:27:02Z")
> [@Jpeg Jones](#): > > Dig? > > Now, when you need to add a field, such as birthday, or fax#, whatever, you use the method mentioned above to insert a new column wherever you want it. DON’T tack new types of information into an existing column by just adding spaces. > > Please keep your data in discreet, easily sortable chunks. Otherwise, you might just as well use Word. > > [/pet peeve mode=off] I _think_ I know what you’re saying (I hope), but what’s technically wrong with this? 1. XYZ, Inc. Donald Trump, Mail Clerk 400 Rockefeller Ave New York, NY 10014 2. Jpeg Jones 1600 Pennsylvania Ave Washington, D.C. 20002 3. Jerry Springer 1938 Idiot Way Burbank, CA 39395 4. Madonna 38-C Bazoomer Court Longon, UK 5. Michael Jackson Neverland Ranch Yadda yadda Am I somehow not tapping the power of Excel? Is that your implication? ---
**Author:** ![Nametag](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/nametag/32/406_2.png) [@Nametag](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nametag)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2004, 6:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-excel-has-me-stumped/249459/9 "2004-06-09T18:38:01Z")
Are you putting all of this information in one cell? That’s word processing; why use a spreadsheet? ---
**Author:** ![dotchan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/9d8465/32.png) [@dotchan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dotchan)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2004, 6:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-excel-has-me-stumped/249459/10 "2004-06-09T18:44:42Z")
Because discrete datasets means you can sort your records by any field you want. [even more pedantic mode on] …and if you’re trying to keep records like this, why aren’t you using Access or some other database software? [even more pedantic mode off] ---
**Author:** ![Munch](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/munch/32/5281_2.png) [@Munch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Munch)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2004, 7:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-excel-has-me-stumped/249459/11 "2004-06-09T19:40:13Z")
> [@Carnac the Magnificent!](#): > > Am I somehow not tapping the power of Excel? Is that your implication? The only power of Excel you’re tapping is its ability to store data. You’ve lost its ability to manipulate and analyze the data by doing it that way. Now you can no longer sort by last name, or by state, or by zip code, or by area code, etc. ---
**Author:** ![Cheesesteak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cheesesteak/32/3694_2.png) [@Cheesesteak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheesesteak)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2004, 8:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-excel-has-me-stumped/249459/12 "2004-06-09T20:27:02Z")
A database would definitely be preferable, but it can be difficult to learn for a novice, and can be like swatting a fly with a howitzer. Excel is easier to use, and can do some simple DB functions with smaller amounts of data. By doing it the Jpeg Jones way, I think you can also merge those addresses with Word and do a mass mailing, without having to retype everything. If you just want a list of names and addresses, use Word, or Notepad, it will save you headaches. You don’t get any functionality, but if you don’t intend to use the extra functions, what’s the diff? ---
**Author:** ![Carnac\_the\_Magnificent](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ccd318/32.png) [@Carnac\_the\_Magnificent](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Carnac_the_Magnificent)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2004, 9:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-excel-has-me-stumped/249459/13 "2004-06-09T21:10:11Z")
> [@Nametag](#): > > Are you putting all of this information in one cell? That’s word processing; why use a spreadsheet? No, I’m storing each contact in discrete cells. I suppose MS Word would work well/better, but I just wanted to use Excel for the practice. Basically, I’m using Excel as an electronic Rolodex–for storing names and contact information, with different worksheets for different projects/contacts. I don’t plan on sifting, sorting, calculating or jigging with it in any way. Perhaps Access is better suited for this, but I’ve never touched the program and I’m intimidated by its reputation. _Is Access user-friendly enough for me to store basic Rolodex-like information, or is it overkill for that purpose?_ ANY guidance you have would be appreciated. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2004, 9:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-excel-has-me-stumped/249459/14 "2004-06-09T21:18:54Z")
I find Access to be easy to use. And it is the type of product that you want for Rolodex-type stuff. I have no idea of your background, but use the Wizard and follow the prompts. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Jpeg\_Jones](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/4bbf92/32.png) [@Jpeg\_Jones](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jpeg_Jones)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2004, 9:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-excel-has-me-stumped/249459/15 "2004-06-09T21:45:04Z")
I suppose your method is fine as a sort of data “sketchpad”, for a small number of records. There are plenty of uses for Excel that aren’t necessarily mass-data oriented. I’ve even seen someone who uses Excel’s rudimentary drawing tools to make very detailed graphic art. Keep in mind, though, that Excel’s forte is in sorting, calculating, and analzying huge amounts of data, organized in rows and columns. Right now I’m working on a spreadsheet that has about 200 columns and consists of several thousand records. I can sort and analyze and filter all day long with Excel. I don’t think you need to bother with Access, if all you need to do is store a few names and addresses. ---
**Author:** ![Cardinal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cardinal/32/4000_2.png) [@Cardinal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cardinal)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2004, 10:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-excel-has-me-stumped/249459/16 "2004-06-09T22:14:25Z")
If I understand the OP correctly, I implore him to put EVERY SINGLE PIECE of data in a different cell. The time will come, oh yes, it will come, when you will want to sort that data according to something that’s in your big cell there: Can we find all the people in New Jersey? Can we group people by their zip codes for a cheaper bulk mailing? Can I mail merge people into MS Word without using their addresses in the letter? If all the info is in the same cell, the answer to all of these is a resounding, “NO”. ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2004, 12:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-excel-has-me-stumped/249459/17 "2004-06-10T00:13:18Z")
I think you are confusing a “field” with a “record”. Fields are small pieces of data assiciated with each other that need to remain linked together to make sense. For an application like yours, typical fields would be: first name, last name, address line 1, address line two, city, state, zip, phone number, and mabye a couple of extra things like a salutation (Mr. Mrs., Ms.). Your method does in fact accomplish that, and so I can’t say it is “wrong”. But it **severely** limits how you can use the information. Ideally the data for each field is stored in separate and adjacent cells – I’ll get to why later. All the information in those fields about a single person constitute constitue a single RECORD, and each record is fully contained in a single ROW. Each field “type”, ie, address or zip, is contained down a single column, as Jpeg Jone’s example of a data structure. Before I go any farther. let me say that if your rolodex list is only 10 or twenty names (what you can more or less see on a single screen), and you ONLY want to be able to glance at it to look up a name or address, that I’d say what you’re doing is okay. But if you want to be able to do _any more than one_ of these other things, then it will be well worth your while to restructure your data as Jpeg suggests: 1. print the names and address on envelops 2. print the names and addresses on mailing labels 3. Write a single letter, which you want to duplicate and send out individually addressed to everybody on the list. (Or everybody on the list from California, or from with a certain range of zip codes, or everybody with the first name "john, etc) 4. Sort the list by any field. (Maybe you remember one contact’s name as John, and another as Mr. Smith – you can sort so all Johs, or Smiths, or Misters for that matter are grouped together for easier finding. With your design, you can search for each John one at a time, and spend a lot more time and keystrokes doing it). 5. Automatically count how many of your clients are in each city, state, or whatever. 6. Delete duplicate rows of data 7. Many many more things that I haven’t thought of… Technically\* Access \* is an even better program for these functions, but it is not very intuitive, and the report functions which determin how the data prints out onto a page are pretty cumbersome. I would agree with others who say that you can stick with Excel for the job. And the biggest risk in using Excel for this kind of data is something that your system, as limited as it is, DOES prevent. The risk is that you can sort one or more columns of this data, and NOT sort the others, which essentially breaks up record into peices that you won’t be able to reassemble without a great deal of trouble. (Access prevents this, which is why it is a theoretically better tool). ---
**Author:** ![Carnac\_the\_Magnificent](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ccd318/32.png) [@Carnac\_the\_Magnificent](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Carnac_the_Magnificent)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2004, 2:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-excel-has-me-stumped/249459/18 "2004-06-10T02:24:36Z")
> [@Boyo Jim](#): > > I think you are confusing a “field” with a “record”. > > Technically\* Access \* is an even better program for these functions, but it is not very intuitive, and the report functions which determin how the data prints out onto a page are pretty cumbersome. I would agree with others who say that you can stick with Excel for the job. > > And the biggest risk in using Excel for this kind of data is something that your system, as limited as it is, DOES prevent. The risk is that you can sort one or more columns of this data, and NOT sort the others, which essentially breaks up record into peices that you won’t be able to reassemble without a great deal of trouble. (Access prevents this, which is why it is a theoretically better tool). Christ! You people make me feel like a ninth-rate rookie amid a field of Olympians. I truly had no idea I’m such a computing knucklehead. ☹ The only appeal of Access is that it would allow me to at least familiarize myself with the monster. That said, there’s something very tempting about KISS. I will follow the advice above re: fields/records, etc. I am just using Excel to, basically, convince myself that I am tech savvy. My needs are simple, my expectations similar.