# Ms. Ocasio-Cortez, on How to Pay for Medicare for All **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [December 3, 2018, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-ocasio-cortez-on-how-to-pay-for-medicare-for-all/825514 "2018-12-03T18:43:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 31
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2019, 3:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-ocasio-cortez-on-how-to-pay-for-medicare-for-all/825514/601 "2019-01-22T15:37:28Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > Enjoy it while it lasts - [the world is coming to an end in a dozen years](https://www.foxnews.com/politics/ocasio-cortez-calls-climate-change-our-world-war-ii-warns-the-world-will-end-in-12-years) unless we end climate change. > > Regards, > Shodan NYT: [Greenland’s Melting Ice Nears a ‘Tipping Point,’ Scientists Say](https://www.nytimes.com/2019/01/21/climate/greenland-ice.html) > [@](#): > > Greenland’s enormous ice sheet is melting at such an accelerated rate that it may have reached a “tipping point,” and could become a major factor in sea-level rise around the world within two decades, scientists said in a study published on Monday. > > The Arctic is warming at twice the average rate of the rest of the planet, and the new research adds to the evidence that the ice loss in Greenland, which lies mainly above the Arctic Circle, is speeding up as the warming increases. The authors found that ice loss in 2012, more than 400 billion tons per year, was nearly four times the rate in 2003. After a lull in 2013-14, losses have resumed. > > The study is the latest in a series of papers published this month suggesting that scientific estimates of the effects of a warming planet have been, if anything, too conservative. Just a week ago, a separate study of ice loss in Antarctica found that the continent is contributing more to rising sea levels than previously thought. > > Another new analysis suggested that the oceans are warming far faster than earlier estimates. Warming oceans are currently the leading cause of sea-level rise, since water expands as it warms. But AOC is an idiot. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![WillFarnaby](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/willfarnaby/32/514_2.png) [@WillFarnaby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WillFarnaby)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2019, 3:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-ocasio-cortez-on-how-to-pay-for-medicare-for-all/825514/602 "2019-01-22T15:38:08Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > It’s hilarious how much effort AOC critics put into deliberately misrepresenting and belittling her statements while simultaneously claiming she’s an insignificant nobody unworthy of attention. And “thirsty male”? Sounds like someone’s got issues. Did the scary lady trigger you? No but the thirst is evident. Perhaps the dem women have taken to the bottle in the wake of Trump, passing out early and leaving you guys all frustrated. ---
**Author:** ![WillFarnaby](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/willfarnaby/32/514_2.png) [@WillFarnaby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WillFarnaby)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2019, 3:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-ocasio-cortez-on-how-to-pay-for-medicare-for-all/825514/603 "2019-01-22T15:39:11Z")
> [@RTFirefly](#): > > NYT: [Greenland’s Melting Ice Nears a ‘Tipping Point,’ Scientists Say](https://www.nytimes.com/2019/01/21/climate/greenland-ice.html) > But AOC is an idiot. :rolleyes: No. A skilled demagogue. ---
**Author:** ![Airbeck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/airbeck/32/6574_2.png) [@Airbeck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airbeck)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2019, 3:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-ocasio-cortez-on-how-to-pay-for-medicare-for-all/825514/604 "2019-01-22T15:42:28Z")
No. A freshman representative that has conservatives terrified and freaking out for some reason… ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2019, 3:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-ocasio-cortez-on-how-to-pay-for-medicare-for-all/825514/605 "2019-01-22T15:48:22Z")
> [@WillFarnaby](#): > > No but the thirst is evident. Perhaps the dem women have taken to the bottle in the wake of Trump, passing out early and leaving you guys all frustrated. You seem unusually interested in the sex lives of Democrats, particularly in the context of Ms. Ocasio-Cortez. Is this something you spend a lot of time thinking about? ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2019, 3:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-ocasio-cortez-on-how-to-pay-for-medicare-for-all/825514/606 "2019-01-22T15:49:42Z")
> [@WillFarnaby](#): > > Climate related deaths continue to plummet. Cite? ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2019, 3:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-ocasio-cortez-on-how-to-pay-for-medicare-for-all/825514/607 "2019-01-22T15:52:24Z")
> [@WillFarnaby](#): > > No. A skilled demagogue. Given that we’re pretty much at the crisis level wrt global warming, better to have a skilled demagogue trying to be Paul Revere here, than to continue to treat it as some minor issue that “even the liberal” NYT buries on page A9. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2019, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-ocasio-cortez-on-how-to-pay-for-medicare-for-all/825514/608 "2019-01-22T16:07:13Z")
Only if you consider Chicken Little to be a skilled demagogue. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2019, 11:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-ocasio-cortez-on-how-to-pay-for-medicare-for-all/825514/609 "2019-01-22T23:01:04Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > Enjoy it while it lasts - [the world is coming to an end in a dozen years](https://www.foxnews.com/politics/ocasio-cortez-calls-climate-change-our-world-war-ii-warns-the-world-will-end-in-12-years) unless we end climate change. :smack: Yeah, that’s “fucking retarded”, as Rahm would say. ETA: What does it mean to 100% a video game? ---
**Author:** ![Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/budget_player_cadet/32/205_2.png) [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Budget_Player_Cadet)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2019, 12:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-ocasio-cortez-on-how-to-pay-for-medicare-for-all/825514/610 "2019-01-23T00:18:01Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > :smack: Yeah, that’s “fucking retarded”, as Rahm would say. Read like the very next three posts. > [@](#): > > ETA: What does it mean to 100% a video game? Entirely dependent on the video game. For DK64, there’s an in-game counter that counts up each collectible you can get, so the game will tell you when you have 100% (this is common in collectathons and metroidvanias where there are plenty of unique items that you can in theory miss). In other games, the category is more fluid - in Super Mario World, for example, the equivalent to “100%” is the “96 exits” category, where you have to beat the game as fast as possible while still collecting all 96 exits in the game - there are 72 levels, of which 24 have two exits. This is as opposed to a Super Mario World “any%” run, where the object is to beat the game as fast as possible, regardless of how. This is actually pretty funny, because the solution to “how do you beat Super Mario World as fast as possible” is “cause the game to glitch out, manually manipulate the RAM, and [jump straight to the end within 43 seconds](https://www.speedrun.com/smw/run/zp0q5rvm).” (He’s doing that with a controller on an original SNES, by the way.) Hence various categories like “100%” or “Any%” or “Warpless” or even “Low%”, a category for games like Super Metroid where you are required to take only absolutely mandatory items and to finish the game with a certain predetermined percentage. So let’s keep in mind that “100% DK64” takes something like 16 hours for someone who’s like… a really good speedrunner. So… it’s a hell of a feat, even if you do it in 60. …Dammit, now I gotta see how the fuck you beat Super Metroid with only exactly 14 items. The crazy part is, there’s not just one route. There’s like… 8. 8 Different ways to collect _exactly_ 14 items and still beat the game, with different items each time. And one way to collect exactly 12 items and still beat the game. Dammit, now I’m [down the speedrunning rabbit hole](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I5auJOBC828) and forgot that I was mad at you for taking **Shodan** at his stupid, dishonest word. Ah well, this is more fun anyways! 🙂 Let me just link one fucking insane speedrun - [a “zero exit” Super Mario World race from AGDQ 2016](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rbtXnd_1lJM). It’s beyond insane. They call it “zero exit” because you beat the game without actually beating a single level. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2019, 2:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-ocasio-cortez-on-how-to-pay-for-medicare-for-all/825514/611 "2019-01-23T02:39:38Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > Only if you consider Chicken Little to be a skilled demagogue. I’ll let you and **Will** argue that one out. But while the sky isn’t falling, the glaciers ARE melting. Paul Revere, Chicken Little, whoever. If you’re still in denial about global warming, really, just go stick your head in a pig. The rest of us don’t have time for this shit. ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2019, 4:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-ocasio-cortez-on-how-to-pay-for-medicare-for-all/825514/612 "2019-01-23T04:33:08Z")
LOL, thanks BPC. I think both people who say climate change is a liberal/Chinese hoax, and those who say “if we don’t stop it ASAP, we are DOOMED”, are ridiculous. My view: Climate change is real, it’s caused by human actions, and it’s really NBD in the grand scheme of things. But I am very much down with a “Green New Deal” or “Green Apollo Project”, because I’d love to bankrupt Russia and Middle Eastern goverments, and I do believe coal is really bad due to the particulate emissions (not the CO2, I don’t care about that as it’s not a toxin) and the destruction of mountaintops, pollution of streams, etc. And what AOC said was definitely quite stupid. ---
**Author:** ![Gary\_Kumquat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/4491bb/32.png) [@Gary\_Kumquat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gary_Kumquat)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2019, 7:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-ocasio-cortez-on-how-to-pay-for-medicare-for-all/825514/613 "2019-01-23T07:07:19Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > Enjoy it while it lasts - [the world is coming to an end in a dozen years](https://www.foxnews.com/politics/ocasio-cortez-calls-climate-change-our-world-war-ii-warns-the-world-will-end-in-12-years) unless we end climate change. If no changes are made within the next decade to current greenhouse gas emissions and deforestation trends, multiple studies have indicated climate change will be unstoppable: > **[The world has just over a decade to get climate change under control, U.N....](https://www.washingtonpost.com/energy-environment/2018/10/08/world-has-only-years-get-climate-change-under-control-un-scientists-say/?utm_term=.9adaa8c79b99)** > > “There is no documented historic precedent” for the sweeping changes required to hold the planet’s warming to just 1.5 degrees Celsius (2.7 degrees Fahrenheit), the U.N. Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change found. > **[Unstoppable man-made climate change will make New York unihabitable](https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2451604/Apocalypse-Now-Unstoppable-man-climate-change-reality-end-decade-make-New-York-London-Paris-uninhabitable-45-years-says-new-study.html)** > > The Earth is racing towards an apocalyptic future in which major cities such as New York and London could become uninhabitable, according to a frightening new study. > **[Climate change may become unstoppable within decades](https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/climate-change-may-become-unstoppable-within-decades-3367xf3jj)** > > The Earth could be locked into unavoidable global warming even if all countries met their targets to cut emissions, a study has found.The 2015 Paris agreement on climate change aims to keep the increase in global average temperatures below 2C... It’s an incredibly clear indication of just who you are, as a person, that your takeaway from this topic is to smugly attempt to claim a point because she should have said “The end of the world is inevitable in 12 years if we don’t address climate change” rather than “The world is gonna end in 12 years if we don’t address climate change” ---
**Author:** ![Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/budget_player_cadet/32/205_2.png) [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Budget_Player_Cadet)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2019, 7:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-ocasio-cortez-on-how-to-pay-for-medicare-for-all/825514/614 "2019-01-23T07:25:52Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > My view: Climate change is real, it’s caused by human actions, and it’s really NBD in the grand scheme of things. Your view is wrong and dangerous. ---
**Author:** ![Gary\_Kumquat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/4491bb/32.png) [@Gary\_Kumquat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gary_Kumquat)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2019, 7:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-ocasio-cortez-on-how-to-pay-for-medicare-for-all/825514/615 "2019-01-23T07:48:42Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > Climate change is…NBD in the grand scheme of things. I am shocked to discover that an entity who believes himself to be biologically superior to other races (despite all evidence to the contrary) also thinks climate change is no big deal. ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2019, 7:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-ocasio-cortez-on-how-to-pay-for-medicare-for-all/825514/616 "2019-01-23T07:51:49Z")
The scientists say that in my region (the upper Midwest), it’s supposed to warm winters more than summers. That sounds like a pretty sweet deal TBH, that can’t come soon enough: [https://twitter.com/slackerinc/status/1087851869353975808?s=21](https://twitter.com/slackerinc/status/1087851869353975808?s=21) ETA: > [@Gary\_Kumquat](#): > > an entity who believes himself to be biologically superior to other races This is not an accurate description of my belief, not even close. But of course you are hijacking the thread, since this has nothing to do with AOC or her statements about anything. ---
**Author:** ![Gary\_Kumquat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/4491bb/32.png) [@Gary\_Kumquat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gary_Kumquat)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2019, 8:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-ocasio-cortez-on-how-to-pay-for-medicare-for-all/825514/617 "2019-01-23T08:22:30Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > The scientists say that in my region (the upper Midwest), it’s supposed to warm winters more than summers. That sounds like a pretty sweet deal TBH, that can’t come soon enough: [https://twitter.com/slackerinc/status/1087851869353975808?s=21](https://twitter.com/slackerinc/status/1087851869353975808?s=21) Similar to Shodan’s self exposure above, it’s equally revealing that you look at an event that will affect the entire planet purely in terms of the change to your local winter. Sure, hundreds of millions - perhaps even billions - may be affected by heatwaves, drought, famine and rising sea levels; entire species may be killed off; regions of the planet turned into either swamps or deserts…but hey, you personally will be more comfy in the winter, so no big deal. ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2019, 8:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-ocasio-cortez-on-how-to-pay-for-medicare-for-all/825514/618 "2019-01-23T08:33:25Z")
> [@Gary\_Kumquat](#): > > Similar to Shodan’s self exposure above, it’s equally revealing that you look at an event that will affect the entire planet purely in terms of the change to your local winter. Sure, hundreds of millions - perhaps even billions - may be affected by heatwaves, drought, famine and rising sea levels; entire species may be killed off; regions of the planet turned into either swamps or deserts…but hey, you personally will be more comfy in the winter, so no big deal. This is exactly what all of us do each time we buy a pint of beer instead of sending that money to an organization who will buy a bed net with it and possibly save someone from dying of malaria. By Peter Singer’s account, we are metaphorically walking by drowning children in shallow ponds all the time, and refusing to save them because it would ruin our clothing and inconvenience us. But in fact, what you are breathlessly describing is only the downside of climate change. Funny how the positives are so rarely mentioned, even though the same scientists cited by the Chicken Littles will acknowledge them if pressed on the point. I can understand why you’d find my perspective “dangerous”, though, if you are wedded to that millennialist Chicken Little narrative. I have found that it gets a good response from politically moderate, middle class folks when the subject comes up and I can take that reasonable, middle path: “No, of course it’s not a Chinese hoax or a Marxist plot. It’s a real thing that is definitely happening. But did you know a lot more people will be saved from freezing to death than will die in heat waves? Or that despite localized droughts and flooding, it will increase worldwide crop yields overall?” And I talk about technological fixes that will arise over time that don’t require a sudden, jarring belt-tightening, and it is clear that they are visibly relieved to hear this. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Gary\_Kumquat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/4491bb/32.png) [@Gary\_Kumquat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gary_Kumquat)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2019, 8:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-ocasio-cortez-on-how-to-pay-for-medicare-for-all/825514/619 "2019-01-23T08:57:08Z")
“Climate change is making drought and humanitarian disasters worse in the Horn of Africa, Oxfam said on Thursday, ahead of a major climate march in Washington to coincide with the first 100 days of the Trump administration. About 12 million people in Ethiopia, Kenya and Somalia are at risk of hunger due to recurring droughts, the U.N. Food and Agriculture Organization (FAO) says, with Somalia at risk of slipping into famine for the second time in six years. “Climate change is a real and current problem in East Africa. What were previously once in a life time droughts now come around more often,” Nigel Tricks, Oxfam’s regional director told the Thomson Reuters Foundation.”\* “Satellite observations show sea levels rising, and climate change is accelerating it…“This acceleration, driven mainly by accelerated melting in Greenland and Antarctica, has the potential to double the total sea level rise by 2100 as compared to projections that assume a constant rate, to more than 60 centimeters instead of about 30,” said Nerem, who is also a fellow with the Cooperative Institute for Research in Environmental Science.”\*\* “Up to half of plant and animal species in the world’s most naturally rich areas, such as the Amazon and the Galapagos, could face local extinction by the turn of the century due to climate change if carbon emissions continue to rise unchecked. Even if the Paris Climate Agreement 2°C target is met, these places could lose 25 percent of their species according to a landmark new study by the University of East Anglia, the James Cook University, and WWF.” But no big deal, eh? “Extreme heat can kill, as it did by the dozens in Pakistan in May. But as many of South Asia’s already-scorching cities get even hotter, scientists and economists are warning of a quieter, more far-reaching danger: Extreme heat is devastating the health and livelihoods of tens of millions more. If global greenhouse gas emissions continue at their current pace, they say, heat and humidity levels could become unbearable, especially for the poor.” But no big deal, eh? Why you’d have to be a middle class, alarmist, chicken little to not look at these trends and realise that the important thing here is that Slacker’s winters could be a little bit more comfy. Or more importantly that a new york politician might have used a poorly worded statement on the timing of it. Now why don’t you fuck off and try and find a cite that shows that more people will be saved by climate change than killed. - [Climate change deepening Horn of Africa's hunger crisis, Oxfam says | Reuters](https://www.reuters.com/article/us-eastafrica-climatechange-idUSKBN17T00D) \*\* [Observations show sea levels rising, and climate change is accelerating it | CNN](https://edition.cnn.com/2018/02/12/world/sea-level-rise-accelerating/index.html) \*\*\*[Half of plant and animal species at risk from climate change in world’s most important natural places | Press Releases | WWF](https://www.worldwildlife.org/press-releases/half-of-plant-and-animal-species-at-risk-from-climate-change-in-world-s-most-important-natural-places) \*\*\*\*[https://www.nytimes.com/2018/07/17/climate/india-heat-wave-summer.html](https://www.nytimes.com/2018/07/17/climate/india-heat-wave-summer.html) ---
**Author:** ![Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/budget_player_cadet/32/205_2.png) [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Budget_Player_Cadet)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2019, 9:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-ocasio-cortez-on-how-to-pay-for-medicare-for-all/825514/620 "2019-01-23T09:10:35Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > The scientists say that in my region (the upper Midwest), it’s supposed to warm winters more than summers. That sounds like a pretty sweet deal TBH, that can’t come soon enough: [https://twitter.com/slackerinc/status/1087851869353975808?s=21](https://twitter.com/slackerinc/status/1087851869353975808?s=21) Great, sounds like a perfect place to put up a few million climate refugees. 🙂 You will be taking them, right? > [@SlackerInc](#): > > This is exactly what all of us do each time we buy a pint of beer instead of sending that money to an organization who will buy a bed net with it and possibly save someone from dying of malaria. No, it really isn’t. This is more like replying by saying “Malaria never killed anyone”. > [@](#): > > But in fact, what you are breathlessly describing is only the downside of climate change. Funny how the positives are so rarely mentioned, even though the same scientists cited by the Chicken Littles will acknowledge them if pressed on the point. Because the negatives grossly outweigh the positives and talking about the positives of global warming is a bit like praising AIDS as a weight loss tool. I’m not sure if I should spend time getting into this with a racist attention whore, but SkepticalScience has an excellent primer for the chronically stupid. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-ocasio-cortez-on-how-to-pay-for-medicare-for-all/825514.md?page=30) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-ocasio-cortez-on-how-to-pay-for-medicare-for-all/825514.md?page=32)