# Ms. Ocasio-Cortez, on How to Pay for Medicare for All **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [December 3, 2018, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-ocasio-cortez-on-how-to-pay-for-medicare-for-all/825514 "2018-12-03T18:43:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 39
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2019, 12:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-ocasio-cortez-on-how-to-pay-for-medicare-for-all/825514/761 "2019-01-26T00:47:37Z")
BTW, this is the kind of environmental initiative I would love us to focus on instead of obsessing over climate change (which term, BTW, I just learned was one of Frank Luntz’s little tricks, which the left has obliviously signed on to): > **[How to solve the world’s plastics problem: Bring back the milk man](https://www.cnn.com/interactive/2019/01/business/loop-reusable-packaging-mission-ahead/index.html)** > > Loop, a shopping service from Procter & Gamble, Unilever, Nestlé and others seeks to reduce plastic pollution by delivering your household items in reusable packaging just like milk men of the past. I would sign up for this in a hot second if it were available here. And I would absolutely support either subsidizing efforts like these, or penalizing disposable plastic via taxation. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2019, 2:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-ocasio-cortez-on-how-to-pay-for-medicare-for-all/825514/762 "2019-01-26T02:40:54Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > BTW, this is the kind of environmental initiative I would love us to focus on instead of obsessing over climate change (which term, BTW, I just learned was one of Frank Luntz’s little tricks, which the left has obliviously signed on to): Well, thanks for letting us know you are still drinking from a poisonous well. The climate change term was not just a “little trick” by Frank Luntz, it was recommended by him to the Republicans to use instead of “global warming” as to make the issue less scary. And the left did not hang to it because of Luntz, but because scientists continued to use the term. What do you think the [IPCC](https://www.ipcc.ch/) letters stand for? So, in reality you got it backwards, it was a term used by scientists decades ago repeatedly and the republicans decided to hang on to the “apparent” change of terminology (it was not changed, Luntz just decided to focus on it and make the Republicans to say it as if that was the only term) in an attempt to make the scientists (and the left) as guys who are not being able to make up their minds. Somehow in the little pea brain of many Republicans in power it turned into the meme that “they changed the term, because it is not warming as predicted!\* Now it is climate change!” [QUOTE] Switching the words "climate change", for global warming, -- is it a devious, Orwellian perversion of the language, a mind controlling neurolinguistic word play engineered by psychological manipulators of the New World Order?. Climate deniers realize that only they can see through the evil plans of the global thought police. What mysterious and secretive conspiracy is behind this monstrous mind game? [/QUOTE] [spoiler] ‘Nah, conspiracy minded fellows who think that are really hopeless dudes!’ > [@SlackerInc](#): > > [Loop, a shopping service with reusable packages, wants to end the world’s plastics problem](https://www.cnn.com/interactive/2019/01/business/loop-reusable-packaging-mission-ahead/index.html) > > I would sign up for this in a hot second if it were available here. And I would absolutely support either subsidizing efforts like these, or penalizing disposable plastic via taxation. And that is good and needed, although not much involved on the issue of dumping CO2 into the atmosphere. - And of course in the previous years the warming got into record territory once again for a few years, making the warming to be more in tune with the predictions made early, and making the deniers look like idiots when they still pushed the idea of a ‘pause in the warming’ or that ‘we are headed to a cooling phase’. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2019, 3:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-ocasio-cortez-on-how-to-pay-for-medicare-for-all/825514/763 "2019-01-26T03:01:54Z")
And the stupid keeps going in the White House: > **[Sarah Huckabee Sanders Dismisses AOC's Climate Warning](https://www.newsweek.com/sarah-sanders-dismisses-ocasio-cortez-climate-warning-well-leave-it-much-much-1301197)** > > U.S. Representative Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez's recent doomsday warning was rejected by the White House press secretary. > [@](#): > > “Look, I don’t think we’re going to listen to her on much of anything, particularly not on matters we’re gonna leave in the hands of a much, much higher authority, and certainly not listen to the freshman congresswoman on when the world may end,” she said. “We’re focused on what’s happening in the world right now.” -Sarah Huckabee Sanders to Ocasio-Cortez. :rolleyes: > [@](#): > > "Our posturings, our imagined self-importance, the delusion that we have some privileged position in the Universe, are challenged by this point of pale light. Our planet is a lonely speck in the great enveloping cosmic dark. In our obscurity, in all this vastness, there is no hint that help will come from elsewhere to save us from ourselves. > > The Earth is the only world known so far to harbor life. There is nowhere else, at least in the near future, to which our species could migrate. Visit, yes. Settle, not yet. Like it or not, for the moment the Earth is where we make our stand. > > It has been said that astronomy is a humbling and character-building experience. There is perhaps no better demonstration of the folly of human conceits than this distant image of our tiny world. To me, it underscores our responsibility to deal more kindly with one another, and to preserve and cherish the pale blue dot, the only home we’ve ever known." – Carl Sagan, Pale Blue Dot, 1994 So, yes Miss [del]Chug a bee[/del] Huckabee, we are the ones that have the power to do it. [https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2018/09/why-there-need-for-speed-on-climate-action-paris-agreement/](https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2018/09/why-there-need-for-speed-on-climate-action-paris-agreement/) > [@](#): > > China, India and the EU account for more than 40% of global emissions. Working together, they could help convince other big and mid-sized economies, such as those in Asia and Latin America, that they have ample room and economic incentives to accelerate. For example, Chile’s recent decision to phase out coal will see it well ahead of its Paris target as we move into the next decade. > > Time is of the essence. As we have been rudely reminded this summer, there is no more room in the atmosphere for our carbon pollution. Going forward from 2020, annual global greenhouse gas emissions need to be half of what they were in the preceding decade. The good news is that countries and leaders who understand the need for speed are accelerating their climate action and also accelerating their growth. > > A new industrial revolution is upon us, one that puts economic development and environmental protection on a level playing field. One that understands that ecological health and balance is intrinsic to long term well-being and prosperity. > > Those who embrace this change will ultimately win the race. ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2019, 8:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-ocasio-cortez-on-how-to-pay-for-medicare-for-all/825514/764 "2019-01-26T08:18:56Z")
It suddenly occurs to me that the “debate,” even the diction, between Republicans and progressives on issues like climate change is eerily similar to the medieval “debates” after the publication of Copernicus’ _Dē revolutionibus orbium coelestium_. The comparison became clear in **GIGObuster** ’s last post which quotes Ms. Suckabee as “leave in the hands of a much, much higher authority”, while Professor Sagan echoes Giordano Bruno with “Our planet is a lonely speck in the great enveloping cosmic dark.” Recall that Pope Clement VIII, before burning Bruno alive, ordered his mouth shuttered with iron spikes so he could no longer utter heresies. Similarly though less viciously, the Trumpists also seek to stifle science and the free press. ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2019, 4:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-ocasio-cortez-on-how-to-pay-for-medicare-for-all/825514/765 "2019-01-26T16:57:47Z")
> [@GIGObuster](#): > > And the stupid keeps going in the White House: > > [Sarah Huckabee Sanders Dismisses Ocasio-Cortez Climate Warning: We'll Leave It to 'Much, Much Higher Authority'](https://www.newsweek.com/sarah-sanders-dismisses-ocasio-cortez-climate-warning-well-leave-it-much-much-1301197) > > > [@](#): > > > > “Look, I don’t think we’re going to listen to her on much of anything, particularly not on matters we’re gonna leave in the hands of a much, much higher authority, and certainly not listen to the freshman congresswoman on when the world may end,” she said. “We’re focused on what’s happening in the world right now.” > > -Sarah Huckabee Sanders to Ocasio-Cortez. > > :rolleyes: St. Carl is great (Hail Sagan!) but Ms. O-C came up with a more effective way to [pwn the Huck](https://www.businessinsider.com/alexandria-ocasio-cortez-claps-back-at-sarah-huckabee-sanders-2019-1) _“‘Genesis 1: God looked on the world & called it good not once, not twice, but seven times. Genesis 2: God commands all people to “serve and protect” creation. Leviticus: God mandates that not only the people, but the land that sustains them, shall be respected.’” … “You shouldn’t need a Bible to tell you to protect our planet, but it does anyway.”_ ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2019, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-ocasio-cortez-on-how-to-pay-for-medicare-for-all/825514/766 "2019-01-26T17:01:17Z")
We’re just not worthy. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2019, 10:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-ocasio-cortez-on-how-to-pay-for-medicare-for-all/825514/767 "2019-01-26T22:32:38Z")
> [@](#): > > "'Genesis 1: God looked on the world & called it good not once, not twice, but seven times. Six, actually, but given Ms. AOC’s problems with numeracy, I would say close enough for government work. > [@](#): > > Genesis 2: God commands all people to “serve and protect” creation. No, “have dominion over the earth, and subdue it”. Creation serves mankind, not vice versa. AOC is confusing the KJV with the LAPD. > [@](#): > > Leviticus: God mandates that not only the people, but the land that sustains them, shall be respected.'" Leviticus is authoritative now? I can think of some passages that she might not want to bring up, if she is arguing the authority of Scripture. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2019, 11:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-ocasio-cortez-on-how-to-pay-for-medicare-for-all/825514/768 "2019-01-26T23:01:00Z")
I don’t know man, the NIV doesn’t say subdued: " The Lord God took the man and put him in the Garden of Eden to work it and take care of it." Maybe you’re reading from the wrong Bible? > **[Genesis 2 - New International Version (NIV)](https://www.biblica.com/bible/niv/genesis/2/)** > > Thus the heavens and the earth were completed in all their vast array.By the seventh day God had finished the work he had been doing; so on the seventh day he rested from all his work. Then God blesse ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2019, 11:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-ocasio-cortez-on-how-to-pay-for-medicare-for-all/825514/769 "2019-01-26T23:03:50Z")
Good think I quoted Sagan, but regarding what people of faith should be doing: [https://www.ncronline.org/news/environment/religious-leaders-scientists-massachusetts-together-declare-climate-change](https://www.ncronline.org/news/environment/religious-leaders-scientists-massachusetts-together-declare-climate-change) > [@](#): > > “Climate change is an ecological and moral emergency that impacts all other aspects of our shared lives and requires us to work together to protect our common home.” > > —Faith and Science Joint Appeal for Climate Action ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2019, 11:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-ocasio-cortez-on-how-to-pay-for-medicare-for-all/825514/770 "2019-01-26T23:07:25Z")
Dude, here in America we only quote the Bible when it comes to individual “rights” and domination excuses. All that shit about collective responsibility is ignored. Get with the conservative program! ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Economist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/c89c15/32.png) [@Evil\_Economist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Economist)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2019, 2:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-ocasio-cortez-on-how-to-pay-for-medicare-for-all/825514/771 "2019-01-27T02:25:21Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > Six, actually, but given Ms. AOC’s problems with numeracy, I would say close enough for government work. She was quoting someone else there, idiot. P.s., 7 is [correct](https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Genesis+1&version=NKJV). I just counted. Bet you never acknowledge your error. ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Economist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/c89c15/32.png) [@Evil\_Economist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Economist)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2019, 2:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-ocasio-cortez-on-how-to-pay-for-medicare-for-all/825514/772 "2019-01-27T02:32:18Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > Six, actually, but given Ms. AOC’s problems with numeracy, I would say close enough for government work. For those people who think Shodan might actually be right about something, I provide the following: Then God said, “Let there be light”; and there was light. And God saw the light, that it was good [that’s ONE] And God called the dry land Earth, and the gathering together of the waters He called Seas. And God saw that it was good. [that’s TWO] And the earth brought forth grass, the herb that yields seed according to its kind, and the tree that yields fruit, whose seed is in itself according to its kind. And God saw that it was good. [THREE] God set them in the firmament of the heavens to give light on the earth, and to rule over the day and over the night, and to divide the light from the darkness. And God saw that it was good. [FOUR] So God created great sea creatures and every living thing that moves, with which the waters abounded, according to their kind, and every winged bird according to its kind. And God saw that it was good [FIVE] And God made the beast of the earth according to its kind, cattle according to its kind, and everything that creeps on the earth according to its kind. And God saw that it was good.[SIX] Then God saw everything that He had made, and indeed it was very good. [SEVEN] [Seven](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DxHmds6URe8). Ha ha ha. ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2019, 2:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-ocasio-cortez-on-how-to-pay-for-medicare-for-all/825514/773 "2019-01-27T02:59:52Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > No, “have dominion over the earth, and subdue it”. Creation serves mankind, not vice versa. She was, as has been noted, quoting Genesis 2, in which the forebears of mankind were created. You are quoting Genesis 1, in which a different pair of humans were created, in a different manner. ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2019, 8:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-ocasio-cortez-on-how-to-pay-for-medicare-for-all/825514/774 "2019-01-27T08:28:27Z")
> [@eschereal](#): > > She was, as has been noted, quoting Genesis 2, in which the forebears of mankind were created. You are quoting Genesis 1, in which a different pair of humans were created, in a different manner. Maybe that was the start of the whole problem. Did God create the progressives in Chapter 1 and the imbeciles in Chapter 2, or vice versa? ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2019, 2:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-ocasio-cortez-on-how-to-pay-for-medicare-for-all/825514/775 "2019-01-27T14:05:14Z")
Trying to use the Bible (or Koran) as substantiation of any argument is ridiculous. ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2019, 2:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-ocasio-cortez-on-how-to-pay-for-medicare-for-all/825514/776 "2019-01-27T14:14:34Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > Maybe that was the start of the whole problem. Did God create the progressives in Chapter 1 and the imbeciles in Chapter 2, or vice versa? Meh. Who cares. I’m waiting for the Old Ones and the Elder Things to return. Ph’nglui mglw’nafh Cthulhu R’lyeh wgah’nagl fhtagn. ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2019, 2:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-ocasio-cortez-on-how-to-pay-for-medicare-for-all/825514/777 "2019-01-27T14:25:55Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > Maybe that was the start of the whole problem. Did God create the progressives in Chapter 1 and the imbeciles in Chapter 2, or vice versa? In Chapter 1, they are created side-by-side, in his image, and told to rule the earth; in Chapter 2, the guy is created from the dirt (the common clay, you know …), then has the woman surgically extracted from him, and they are instructed to tend to stuff. You decide. ---
**Author:** ![andros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e480ec/32.png) [@andros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/andros)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2019, 2:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-ocasio-cortez-on-how-to-pay-for-medicare-for-all/825514/778 "2019-01-27T14:54:45Z")
> [@SteveG1](#): > > …Ph’nglui mglw’nafh Cthulhu R’lyeh wgah’nagl fhtagn. Ia! Ia! Cthulhu fhtagn! ---
**Author:** ![Red\_Wiggler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/red_wiggler/32/13190_2.png) [@Red\_Wiggler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Red_Wiggler)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2019, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-ocasio-cortez-on-how-to-pay-for-medicare-for-all/825514/779 "2019-01-27T17:26:10Z")
> [@Evil\_Economist](#): > > For those people who think Shodan might actually be right about something… Who? What? ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2019, 2:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-ocasio-cortez-on-how-to-pay-for-medicare-for-all/825514/780 "2019-01-28T14:27:56Z")
> [@Evil\_Economist](#): > > She was quoting someone else there, idiot. > > P.s., 7 is [correct](https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Genesis+1&version=NKJV). I just counted. > > Bet you never acknowledge your error. My bad, then. Somebody else counted for her, which no doubt explains it. If Ms. AOC had counted it herself, she would have come up with 156, and y’all would be saying “Close enough”. Regards, Shodan [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-ocasio-cortez-on-how-to-pay-for-medicare-for-all/825514.md?page=38) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ms-ocasio-cortez-on-how-to-pay-for-medicare-for-all/825514.md?page=40)