# Muggle: A racist term? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [July 1, 2013, 1:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/muggle-a-racist-term/662340 "2013-07-01T13:05:50Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 14\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![WhyNot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c77e96/32.png) [@WhyNot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WhyNot)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2013, 11:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/muggle-a-racist-term/662340/41 "2013-07-02T11:10:57Z")
> [@Gagundathar](#): > > As an aside, when I was a younger person and deeply into fantasy and SF, my cadre referred to the rest of humanity who were not so enamored as ‘mundanes’. I can imagine that the current generation of like-minded people would use the term ‘muggle’ in the same manner. > [@Saltire](#): > > ‘Muggle’ has also been adopted out;it is used among geocachers to refer to those that don’t play the game… I avoid the term myself, because so many seem to use it as if ignorance of geocaching indicates lack of intelligence. It’s come into use in just that way in the neopagan festival circuit. I started using it as a joke the year of Book One, and it’s everywhere now (not that I started the use, of course; just coincidence, I’m sure.) But yes, with a little bit of self conscious guilt, more often than not, as it sounds like a racist/derogatory/prejudiced term, even when one is making a lighthearted reference to People In Town Who Think We’re Weirdos For Doing Magick and Running Around In Wizard Hats and Fairy Wings\*. People’s sensitivities to the perception of prejudice is tuned pretty darn high at this moment in history. \*If I’ve told you once, I’ve told you a hundred times, Grasshopper…wizard hats OR fairy wings. To combine the two is just gauche. ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2013, 12:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/muggle-a-racist-term/662340/42 "2013-07-02T12:49:19Z")
> [@gracer](#): > > _ **Mudbloods** _ are the racism allegory, not muggles. Muggles just _are_. They are not of much interest to the “racist” magical world, they are not oppressed or hurt in any way. Oh really? What happened at the World Cup during the Death Eater riot? ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2013, 12:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/muggle-a-racist-term/662340/43 "2013-07-02T12:51:14Z")
> [@Malden\_Capell](#): > > So mudbloods are wizarding mulattos, essentially, from the point of view of an anti-muggle. Well they get mad when you say “quadroon”. ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2013, 12:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/muggle-a-racist-term/662340/44 "2013-07-02T12:57:00Z")
> [@Mijin](#): > > It’s interesting isn’t it: racism is very common in fantasy works. > “Khajit can’t be trusted”, “Dark fairies are always chaotic neutral”, “Ferengi make lousy scientists” etc. > > Of course, this is justified in many cases…obviously an extraterrestrial species for example is likely to be vastly different to average human behaviour (much more so than the Ferengi). But it’s just interesting how common the motifs of “them” and “us”, and generalization, are. Probably because in most fantasy, entire planets (especially in the Trek universe) are often comprised of a single ecosystem with a single sentient species with a single culture, geopolitical structure, and who all work in a single occupation with a single industry. ie Ferengi are all sketchy businessmen, Klingons are all warriors, so on and so forth. Of course hu-mons have a hard enough time getting along with members of it’s own species who look slightly different. Let alone a totally different species that looks like humans with an ass on their head. ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2013, 1:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/muggle-a-racist-term/662340/45 "2013-07-02T13:03:53Z")
> [@Phnord\_Prephect](#): > > They’re all resting down at Hogwarts, writing up their memoirs for the paperback edition of the Wizards’ Manual. Dumbledore my friend, don’t you start away uneasy, you poor old sod, I’m Snape: it’s only me! ---
**Author:** ![Molesworth\_2](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9dc877/32.png) [@Molesworth\_2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Molesworth_2)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2013, 1:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/muggle-a-racist-term/662340/46 "2013-07-02T13:13:49Z")
Back when I was a 6yo in the mid 1970s I was reading the works of JK Rowling’s predecessor Enid Blyton. In the mid-80s my teenaged self re-read Blyton’s “Mr Galliano’s Circus” for a laugh. On page three the young boy protagonist of the story met the young girl who’d become one of his best friends and confidants. It was much like Harry Potter meeting Hermione Granger for the first time. As I recall it, Hermione’s first action wasn’t to introduce Harry to her three performing circus dogs: “Ni\*\*er, Darky, and Boy”. So, even if the works of JK Rowling are somehow deemed racist, there was a lot of progress in the intervening decades. ---
**Author:** ![muldoonthief](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muldoonthief/32/3188_2.png) [@muldoonthief](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/muldoonthief)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2013, 1:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/muggle-a-racist-term/662340/47 "2013-07-02T13:16:27Z")
> [@msmith537](#): > > Well they get mad when you say “quadroon”. Imagine that! ---
**Author:** ![DesertDog](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/desertdog/32/11503_2.png) [@DesertDog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DesertDog)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2013, 1:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/muggle-a-racist-term/662340/48 "2013-07-02T13:17:53Z")
> [@Saltire](#): > > I’ve often wondered whether ‘mundane’ as a term for ‘those not into strange things’ predates Piers Anthony’s Xanth books. I know it used to be used within the Society for Creative Anachronism to describe non-members, particularly those one runs into while one is wearing medieval garb. I’m pretty sure it’s fallen out of fashion in the SCA because it was starting to be used derogatorially. “Mundane” was used in fanspeak to label someone not interested in science-fiction long before Piers Anthony was on the scene. I’m sure the SCAdians picked it up from the fans, since there is a fair amount of overlap between the two groups. I don’t think it was meant as a pejorative so much as using one characteristic to label a whole person. In _Babylon 5_ the term was used by telepaths to describe non-telepaths. The character Bester (named after [Alfred Bester](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alfred_Bester)) clearly meant the term as an insult. ---
**Author:** ![Mijin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mijin/32/9369_2.png) [@Mijin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mijin)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2013, 1:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/muggle-a-racist-term/662340/49 "2013-07-02T13:32:38Z")
> [@msmith537](#): > > Probably because in most fantasy, entire planets (especially in the Trek universe) are often comprised of a single ecosystem with a single sentient species with a single culture, geopolitical structure, and who all work in a single occupation with a single industry. ie Ferengi are all sketchy businessmen, Klingons are all warriors, so on and so forth. Trope: [Planet of Hats](http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/PlanetOfHats) ---
**Author:** ![Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/qadgop_the_mercotan/32/83_2.png) [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qadgop_the_Mercotan)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2013, 2:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/muggle-a-racist-term/662340/50 "2013-07-02T14:59:48Z")
> [@Phnord\_Prephect](#): > > We really don’t mind if you sit this one out. 😉 His words but a whisper, our deafness a shout! 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Phnord\_Prephect](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/df705f/32.png) [@Phnord\_Prephect](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Phnord_Prephect)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2013, 3:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/muggle-a-racist-term/662340/51 "2013-07-02T15:24:08Z")
> [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](#): > > His words but a whisper, our deafness a shout! 😃 The muggles don’t know how it feels… to be thick as a brick. ---
**Author:** ![Irishman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/b487fb/32.png) [@Irishman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Irishman)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2013, 7:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/muggle-a-racist-term/662340/52 "2013-07-02T19:07:50Z")
There is a tendency for the usage of words to morph over time. What starts as a purely neutral descriptive term comes to take on negative connotations through misuse by people who have negative attitudes about that characteristic. Consider _negro_, and even _nigger_. Consider _retarded_ and _moron_. Consider _handicapped_. For Brits, perhaps consider _Paki_. It is a characteristic of human speech that those we view negatively we impugn their whole class with whatever term describes that class, and that term takes on negative connotations because of the constant use of that term in negative contexts. In the Potterverse, _muggle_ is not **intended** to convey any negative connotations. It is just a descriptor of the alternates, the non-wizards. However, many wizards do have a superior attitude, and that can roll down on how they inflect their use of the word. Thus the term can, in some uses, carry a negative sentiment that is not inherent to the word or in all uses of the word. _Mudblood_ is an intentional perjorative. ---
**Author:** ![BwanaBob](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bwanabob/32/2985_2.png) [@BwanaBob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BwanaBob)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2013, 12:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/muggle-a-racist-term/662340/53 "2013-07-08T00:21:02Z")
> [@Phnord\_Prephect](#): > > They’re all resting down at Hogwarts, writing up their memoirs for the paperback edition of the Wizards’ Manual. This Tull fan appreciates your posts immensely. You both deserve a Premium Bond win. ---
**Author:** ![dwyr](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dwyr/32/363_2.png) [@dwyr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dwyr)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2013, 5:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/muggle-a-racist-term/662340/54 "2013-07-08T05:50:34Z")
> [@Phnord\_Prephect](#): > > The muggles don’t know > how it feels… > to be thick > as a brick. I feel thick. It took me entirely too long to figure this out. BTW, Ian’s at Riverbend in only 12 days! Woohoo! [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/muggle-a-racist-term/662340.md?page=2)