# Music in triplet \*and\* "straight" time **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Tags:** music\ **Created:** [January 22, 2023, 9:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/music-in-triplet-and-straight-time/978602 "2023-01-22T09:56:42Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Disinfectus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/disinfectus/32/11085_2.png) [@Disinfectus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Disinfectus)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2023, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/music-in-triplet-and-straight-time/978602/21 "2023-01-22T19:43:33Z")
Yes, it is. The beginning section, at least. Then the song switches into straight eighths. ---
**Author:** ![alovem](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/b38774/32.png) [@alovem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alovem)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2023, 7:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/music-in-triplet-and-straight-time/978602/22 "2023-01-22T19:44:25Z")
The first half is, the second half isn’t (as noted above). ---
**Author:** ![commasense](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/commasense/32/3017_2.png) [@commasense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/commasense)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2023, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/music-in-triplet-and-straight-time/978602/23 "2023-01-22T19:46:50Z")
Thanks, I’ve learned something. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2023, 7:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/music-in-triplet-and-straight-time/978602/24 "2023-01-22T19:49:35Z")
And “Money” is an example of swung eights in 7/4. But it’s swung time, not straight time. The OP is looking for songs that contrast the two feels. I -_think_ the OP would also be interested in something with a “flowing” 6/8 or 12/8 (where the middle note isn’t skipped) contrasted with something with an eighth note subdivision, as well. ---
**Author:** ![Disinfectus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/disinfectus/32/11085_2.png) [@Disinfectus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Disinfectus)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2023, 7:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/music-in-triplet-and-straight-time/978602/25 "2023-01-22T19:55:53Z")
I understood the question. I was simply trying to correct the misconception of this being about time signatures. Honestly, there aren’t a ton of examples of songs switching from straight to swing time or vice versa, because it just isn’t done that much. It tends to disrupt the flow of the song. On rare occasion though, like “Carry On”, the switching of gears, so to speak, works well. ---
**Author:** ![alovem](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/b38774/32.png) [@alovem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alovem)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2023, 7:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/music-in-triplet-and-straight-time/978602/26 "2023-01-22T19:57:31Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > I -_think_ the OP would also be interested in something with a “flowing” 6/8 or 12/8 (where the middle note isn’t skipped) contrasted with something with an eighth note subdivision, as well. Yeah, doesn’t matter if it’s actual triplets or a swing feel, it’s the coexistence in a single song or instrumental of triplets/swing and straight, in different sections, that I’m looking for. Tangentially, it’s something that some musicians do extraordinarily well when soloing. I heard someone do that a few months ago, can’t remember who now. It was almost too much. In that sense (variation in soloing), I suppose Monk has to be mentioned. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2023, 8:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/music-in-triplet-and-straight-time/978602/27 "2023-01-22T20:04:38Z")
I was just adding to your statement an example of one given in this thread that was also not an example of what the OP was looking for. It wasn’t meant as a counter to your post. ---
**Author:** ![Disinfectus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/disinfectus/32/11085_2.png) [@Disinfectus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Disinfectus)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2023, 8:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/music-in-triplet-and-straight-time/978602/28 "2023-01-22T20:06:08Z")
Fair enough and thanks for the clarification. Since you replied to me, I couldn’t quite tell. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2023, 8:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/music-in-triplet-and-straight-time/978602/29 "2023-01-22T20:08:22Z")
Yeah loosening and tightening the “swing” definitely happens. I’ve had this swimming in my head for a few hours, but I can’t figure out where I’ve heard stuff like, loose swing in most of the song, and then segue into a rocking straight 8 groove for the end or outro. It’s rare, but I don’t feel like it’s that strange an idea. ---
**Author:** ![alovem](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/b38774/32.png) [@alovem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alovem)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2023, 8:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/music-in-triplet-and-straight-time/978602/30 "2023-01-22T20:10:07Z")
I agree that it’s not that rare in popular music (there aren’t that many ideas, and it’s a common enough way to add variety), and I predict that by the end of this week, most of us will have noticed at least two such tunes. Phil Collins, for example, whom I know you like or have liked at some point, has probably recorded something like that, being a talented drummer. > [@Maserschmidt](#): > > The second section of “Shine On You Crazy Diamond” goes back-and-forth a lot between 6/8 and 4/4. Okay, at 12:01 in this link… [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/54W8kktFE_o/maxresdefault.jpg "Shine On You Crazy Diamond (Parts I-V)") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=54W8kktFE_o) …they go from straight to swing time. If the link doesn’t work for anyone, it’s when the sax solo kicks in. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2023, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/music-in-triplet-and-straight-time/978602/31 "2023-01-22T20:35:52Z")
Here’s one I thought of – a jazz tune, but also a popular tune, and one that was especially popular last month. “Linus and Lucy” by the Vince Guaraldi trio. In the piano solo breaks, it goes into a pretty deep swing in the second piano solo at 1:54 [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/x6zypc_LhnM/maxresdefault.jpg "Vince Guaraldi Trio - Linus And Lucy") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x6zypc_LhnM) ---
**Author:** ![alovem](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/b38774/32.png) [@alovem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alovem)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2023, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/music-in-triplet-and-straight-time/978602/32 "2023-01-22T20:38:46Z")
There you go! ---
**Author:** ![Disinfectus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/disinfectus/32/11085_2.png) [@Disinfectus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Disinfectus)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2023, 8:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/music-in-triplet-and-straight-time/978602/33 "2023-01-22T20:56:43Z")
Great example! ---
**Author:** ![needscoffee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/needscoffee/32/1076_2.png) [@needscoffee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/needscoffee)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2023, 9:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/music-in-triplet-and-straight-time/978602/34 "2023-01-22T21:00:04Z")
Jim Croce’s “Photographs and Memories” goes into swing time and contains triplets. ---
**Author:** ![alovem](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/b38774/32.png) [@alovem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alovem)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2023, 10:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/music-in-triplet-and-straight-time/978602/35 "2023-01-22T22:24:00Z")
Chicago’s “Does Anybody Really Know What Time It Is?” starts in straight time (with different time signatures, I think) before shifting to swing time at 0:26: [![](https://i.ytimg.com/vi/9FzCWLOHUes/hqdefault.jpg "Chicago - Does Anybody Really Know What Time It Is? (Official Audio)") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9FzCWLOHUes) ---
**Author:** ![JKellyMap](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jkellymap/32/15880_2.png) [@JKellyMap](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JKellyMap)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2023, 12:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/music-in-triplet-and-straight-time/978602/36 "2023-01-23T00:39:09Z")
The Stones’ Midnight Rambler is mostly shuffle (dotted “triple” rhythm — uncanny similarities to Fleetwood Mac’s Don’t Stop) — but shifts to a four-on-the-floor rhythm after the verses and into the harp solo, then back to a (very slow) shuffle for the prowling break (and the return to fast shuffle for the ending). Around 2:15 [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/EN2cWWUHa5g/maxresdefault.jpg "Midnight Rambler (Get Yer Ya Ya's Out)") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EN2cWWUHa5g) ---
**Author:** ![alovem](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/b38774/32.png) [@alovem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alovem)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2023, 9:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/music-in-triplet-and-straight-time/978602/37 "2023-01-23T09:44:54Z")
> [@needscoffee](#): > > Jim Croce’s “Photographs and Memories” goes into swing time and contains triplets. No, actually it’s straight time all the way through. There’s a tempo change twice, and, in the rest of the recording, there’s a repeating guitar riff on the treble strings followed by a triplet slur on the bass strings (first heard at 0:03). There might be a triplet figure in the vocals once in a while, but it’s all straight time. > [@JKellyMap](#): > > The Stones’ Midnight Rambler… Yup. Good example of the sensation of shifting gears mentioned upthread. ---
**Author:** ![alovem](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/b38774/32.png) [@alovem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alovem)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2023, 10:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/music-in-triplet-and-straight-time/978602/38 "2023-01-23T10:03:19Z")
I’m reconsidering “Shiny, Happy People” and “We Can Work It Out” because it’s very hard to tell if the “oom-pa-pa” parts are straight or swung eights (in these recordings and most others with this kind of section). Think of it this way: The 1-2-3 rhythm could be thought of as “_oom-pa-pa_.” Those syllables in straight eighths would be “_oompy-poppy-poppy_.” And in triplets they’d be “_oompity-poppity-poppity_.” In the REM tune in particular, nearly all the music in that section is in quarter notes. I hear a single example of eighths in the strings, and it sounds like it’s straight eighths. Same for the Beatles tune, but, as I said, it’s not easily discerned, and, as we’ve seen, there are much clearer examples for us to consider here. Yeah, the syllables look and sound stupid, but, without an instrument in one’s hands, it’s the best way to talk about these things. Feel free to disagree. ---
**Author:** ![Moonrise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/moonrise/32/14764_2.png) [@Moonrise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Moonrise)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2023, 11:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/music-in-triplet-and-straight-time/978602/39 "2023-01-23T11:52:24Z")
> [@alovem](#): > > I’m reconsidering “Shiny, Happy People” and “We Can Work It Out” because it’s very hard to tell if the “oom-pa-pa” parts are straight or swung eights (in these recordings and most others with this kind of section). To me, _We Can Work It Out_ sounds like 4/4 + straight, not swung 3/4. Thus, if I understand your OP correctly, not what you’re after. The Wikipedia article disagrees with me, though… ---
**Author:** ![JKellyMap](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jkellymap/32/15880_2.png) [@JKellyMap](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JKellyMap)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2023, 12:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/music-in-triplet-and-straight-time/978602/40 "2023-01-23T12:19:36Z")
In Midnight Rambler, the switch from shuffle to duple (at 2:15 in the Ya-Yas version) is pretty clear. The shift from duple back to shuffle, around 4:30, is more subtle. One of the guitarists had been repeating a four-note lick resembling the old-timey cliché “stripper song” in fast 4/4. Then, suddenly, the song’s whole feel changes — slower and softer — but the guitarist keeps playing the same “stripper song” lick, but now as a slow shuffle. (The “three-ness” of the rhythm from here on is emphasized in the buildup about a minute later — just continuous, hammering triplets, not a shuffle per se, not until the after the buildup crests into the release of the last verse, which IS a shuffle.) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/music-in-triplet-and-straight-time/978602.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/music-in-triplet-and-straight-time/978602.md?page=3)