# Musk predicts civil war in the UK? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Tags:** elon-musk\ **Created:** [August 7, 2024, 5:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/musk-predicts-civil-war-in-the-uk/1005381 "2024-08-07T17:14:50Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![gnoitall](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/bb73d2/32.png) [@gnoitall](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gnoitall)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2024, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/musk-predicts-civil-war-in-the-uk/1005381/41 "2024-08-08T15:51:15Z")
> [@xtenkfarpl](#): > > In Musk’s case, you have to give him credit for SpaceX Yes. He was quite skilled at buying a company with good technology. Lilewise Twitter, but we saw what his direct intervention did, in comparison to letting the grownups drive in the case of SpaceX or Tesla. ---
**Author:** ![EinsteinsHund](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/einsteinshund/32/8400_2.png) [@EinsteinsHund](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EinsteinsHund)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2024, 4:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/musk-predicts-civil-war-in-the-uk/1005381/42 "2024-08-08T16:11:07Z")
> [@xtenkfarpl](#): > > As for Musk, he seems to have developed the syndrome (I’m sure there’s an official name for it in psychology?) where a person who has had considerable success in one field starts to think they’re the sharpest tool in the box and thus qualified to make authoritative statements about completely unrelated subjects. Megalomania? ---
**Author:** ![Yllaria](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yllaria/32/3452_2.png) [@Yllaria](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yllaria)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2024, 5:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/musk-predicts-civil-war-in-the-uk/1005381/43 "2024-08-08T17:15:30Z")
> [@xtenkfarpl](#): > > I’m pretty sure there’s a different syndrome name; it’s a common enough phenomenon. > Eminent professors of physics spouting nonsense about economics, that sort of thing? I vaguely remember hearing of Engineer’s Something. Tried googling and found the [Salem Hypothesis](https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Engineers_and_woo). > This phenomenon is so prevalent that users of talk.origins have come up with the Salem Hypothesis, which predicts that any creationist claiming scientific expertise or advanced degrees is likely to be an engineer. Of course, this does NOT mean that engineers are likely to be creationists. ---
**Author:** ![xtenkfarpl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/c2a13f/32.png) [@xtenkfarpl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/xtenkfarpl)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2024, 5:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/musk-predicts-civil-war-in-the-uk/1005381/44 "2024-08-08T17:18:07Z")
> [@gnoitall](#): > > He was quite skilled at buying a company with good technology. Lilewise Twitter, but we saw what his direct intervention did, in comparison to letting the grownups drive in the case of SpaceX or Tesla. I don’t think he bought SpaceX as an existing concern? Correct me if wrong? It seems he had some talent as a visionary engineer with enough grasp of the physics to at least get a good team together to make it work. But he seemed to go off the rails with Twitter? ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2024, 5:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/musk-predicts-civil-war-in-the-uk/1005381/45 "2024-08-08T17:24:04Z")
> [@xtenkfarpl](#): > > I don’t think it’s quite Dunning-Kruger? If I recall correctly, that is a negative correlation between actual ability and a person’s opinion of their ability? Dunning-Kruger is the idea that the dumber you are, the less capable you are of recognizing how dumb you are. What Musk has is Engineer’s Disease, which is the term for what happens when you’re smart in one particular field, and you assume that means you’re smart in every field. “I’m good at designing rockets, therefore, I must also be good at designing political systems.” ---
**Author:** ![xtenkfarpl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/c2a13f/32.png) [@xtenkfarpl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/xtenkfarpl)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2024, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/musk-predicts-civil-war-in-the-uk/1005381/46 "2024-08-08T17:34:42Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > “I’m good at designing rockets, therefore, I must also be good at designing political systems.” Exactly. It’s not quite Dunning-Kruger, since that applies, at least in the original study, I think, to ability and perceptions within a particular field of capability. The extension of that to a belief that your expertise qualifies you to be an ‘expert’ on every subject is a different syndrome… ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2024, 5:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/musk-predicts-civil-war-in-the-uk/1005381/47 "2024-08-08T17:35:39Z")
> [@xtenkfarpl](#): > > I don’t think he bought SpaceX as an existing concern? > Correct me if wrong? > > It seems he had some talent as a visionary engineer with enough grasp of the physics to at least get a good team together to make it work. Musk may be a “visionary” (although most of his “visions” are heavily borrowed from forebearers) but listening to him try to talk about technical details of propulsion and structures quickly /reveals that he is ineptly parroting things that he has heard other people explain, much less in areas such as avionics or flight software. Elon’s main skill is in convincing wealthy people to invest in unlikely ventures and inspiring legions of devoted cheerleaders; his “management” of Tesla nearly forced it into the ground by imposing ridiculous degrees of automation and “vertical integration” before he was rescued by experts brought in from the automotive industry who understood where it was advantageous to apply automation and in-house manufacture, and where human labor and out-sourcing made dense. Similarly, with SpaceX, the credit for the functional success of the Falcon 9 goes to CEO. Gwynne Shotwell and the management and technical teams who remained focused on finding the “right-size” vehicle and business niche. Elon Musk is not a “a visionary engineer with enough grasp of the physics”; frankly, I doubt he could formulate a free body diagram or a basic thermodynamic cycle, much less dive deep into the multidisciplinary technical details of how a space launch vehicle works. Stranger ---
**Author:** ![pjd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pjd/32/3009_2.png) [@pjd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pjd)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2024, 10:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/musk-predicts-civil-war-in-the-uk/1005381/48 "2024-08-09T10:13:12Z")
I am constantly amazed by the number of people who think that intelligence is measured in dollars. Both people with, and those without. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2024, 6:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/musk-predicts-civil-war-in-the-uk/1005381/49 "2024-08-09T18:08:51Z")
I dont often consciously feel specific pride in my country (I mean I was born here by accident and I dont think I can take very much credit for the way the country is), but holy shit I felt it when those anti racist crowds turned out in such overwhelming number. Good job. ---
**Author:** ![PatrickLondon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/patricklondon/32/4422_2.png) [@PatrickLondon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatrickLondon)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2024, 9:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/musk-predicts-civil-war-in-the-uk/1005381/50 "2024-08-09T21:01:42Z")
> What Musk has is Engineer’s Disease, which is the term for what happens when you’re smart in one particular field, and you assume that means you’re smart in every field. Which gives rise to the notion that if you can handle a hammer, every problem’s a nail. As every two-year-old believes. ---
**Author:** ![xtenkfarpl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/c2a13f/32.png) [@xtenkfarpl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/xtenkfarpl)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2024, 9:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/musk-predicts-civil-war-in-the-uk/1005381/51 "2024-08-09T21:38:25Z")
Not without precedent by any means. Newton was a groundbreaking mathematical physicist, but still apparently wasted a lot, even most, of his time on astrology and alchemy… Not that I’m saying Musk is in Newton’s league, of course! 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![hibernicus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hibernicus/32/2802_2.png) [@hibernicus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hibernicus)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2024, 2:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/musk-predicts-civil-war-in-the-uk/1005381/52 "2024-08-10T14:47:55Z")
There’s the Nobel Prize effect and the Nobel disease or Nobelitis. Nobel disease is the tendency of Nobel Prize winners to speak as if they were experts on matters outside their field of expertise. Linus Pauling promoting Vitamin C, for example, or Murray Gell-Mann expounding on ill-founded theories about the origin of language. Nobel Prize effect is the related phenomenon where Nobel winners become distracted and achieve less in their own field after winning the prize. ---
**Author:** ![hibernicus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hibernicus/32/2802_2.png) [@hibernicus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hibernicus)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2024, 2:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/musk-predicts-civil-war-in-the-uk/1005381/53 "2024-08-10T14:53:26Z")
> [@xtenkfarpl](#): > > Newton was a groundbreaking mathematical physicist, but still apparently wasted a lot, even most, of his time on astrology and alchemy… I don’t know if that’s a good example. Of course now, with the benefit of the work of countless scientists including Newton, we distinguish between pseudoscience such as astrology and legitimate science such as optics. But that distinction may not have existed in Newton’s time, and astrology and alchemy may have been just as legitimate fields of scientific enquiry as optics. ---
**Author:** ![Al128](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/al128/32/16541_2.png) [@Al128](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Al128)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2024, 2:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/musk-predicts-civil-war-in-the-uk/1005381/54 "2024-08-11T02:37:57Z")
> [@Great\_Antibob](#): > > Yeah, basically Dunning-Kruger. Plus an unhealthy dose of narcissism. I refer to this effect as R.Waters / D.Maradona effect. (neither of those did something remotely “well” outside their core-competence - in which they were actually really good - but that did not keep them from having strong opinions and doing stupid things). ---
**Author:** ![bob\_2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bob_2/32/3341_2.png) [@bob\_2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bob_2)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2024, 9:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/musk-predicts-civil-war-in-the-uk/1005381/55 "2024-08-11T09:17:57Z")
It seems to be a common phenomenon. To some extent, it is enabled (?) by reporters who expect anyone who has achieved notoriety in one field to have valid views and opinions on unrelated subjects. ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2024, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/musk-predicts-civil-war-in-the-uk/1005381/56 "2024-08-11T17:30:36Z")
> [@hibernicus](#): > > There’s the Nobel Prize effect and the Nobel disease or Nobelitis. > > Nobel disease is the tendency of Nobel Prize winners to speak as if they were experts on matters outside their field of expertise. Linus Pauling promoting Vitamin C, for example, or Murray Gell-Mann expounding on ill-founded theories about the origin of language. A list of those afflicted by Nobel Disease [can be found here](https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Nobel_disease). Kary Mullis and Luc Montagnier were prominent victims. ---
**Author:** ![PatrickLondon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/patricklondon/32/4422_2.png) [@PatrickLondon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatrickLondon)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2024, 7:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/musk-predicts-civil-war-in-the-uk/1005381/57 "2024-08-11T19:54:29Z")
Of course, some people in the UK have been training for civil war for some time: [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/d67rhIzUhhk/hqdefault.jpg "The Battle of Pearl Harbor") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d67rhIzUhhk) ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2024, 11:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/musk-predicts-civil-war-in-the-uk/1005381/58 "2024-08-13T23:11:10Z")
I also recall reading about studies showing a correlation between engineers and political/religious extremism of all sorts. A hypothesis as to why I’ve seen is that engineering self-selects for people who are intelligent & technically minded but who want to avoid examining their preconceptions and prejudices, because engineering is all about _how to do_ things. It lets a smart person use their intelligence while avoiding information that would call into question the factuality of racism, religion, and all sorts of extremist politics. Extremist ideologies usually have dogma on issues involving human behavior and origins, the economy/social structure, or the origin of the universe; not how to build bridges. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2024, 11:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/musk-predicts-civil-war-in-the-uk/1005381/59 "2024-08-13T23:37:15Z")
**Musk predicts civil war in the UK?** Well, that raises my hopes that there won’t be. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2024, 12:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/musk-predicts-civil-war-in-the-uk/1005381/60 "2024-08-14T00:01:24Z")
Or if there is, at least it’ll be delivered vey late and the early versions won’t be very effective. So there is that. 😁 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/musk-predicts-civil-war-in-the-uk/1005381.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/musk-predicts-civil-war-in-the-uk/1005381.md?page=4)