# Muslim boycott of Danish goods **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [January 30, 2006, 3:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/muslim-boycott-of-danish-goods/342209 "2006-01-30T15:31:18Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![tagos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@tagos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tagos)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2006, 11:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/muslim-boycott-of-danish-goods/342209/81 "2006-02-02T11:40:26Z")
The knife behind the back. [Gunmen surround EU Offices](http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/4673214.stm) > [@](#): > > Gunmen briefly surrounded the EU’s offices in Gaza, demanding an apology for the publication of cartoons of the Prophet Muhammad in European papers. > > Members of Islamic Jihad and the Yasser Arafat Brigades fired into the air and climbed the compound’s walls. > > The gunmen left the offices after 45 minutes. There were no injuries. Fuck them. And fuck the cheese-eating surrender monkey owners of the french newspaper that re-published the pictures for sacking the editor. ---
**Author:** ![rayh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e79b87/32.png) [@rayh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rayh)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2006, 12:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/muslim-boycott-of-danish-goods/342209/82 "2006-02-02T12:34:17Z")
> [@tagos](#): > > [Go, surrender monkeys, go.](http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/4669360.stm) > Good on them. The editor of the French newspaper that re-published the cartoons [has been sacked](http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/4672642). > [@](#): > > Jacques Lefranc was dismissed by the owner of France Soir, as his paper became embroiled in a developing row between Muslims and the European press. > [@](#): > > The row intensified when France Soir, alongside the 12 original cartoons, printed a newly created cartoon on its front page showing Buddhist, Jewish, Muslim and Christian holy figures sitting on a cloud, with the caption “Don’t worry Muhammad, we’ve all been caricatured here”. > [@](#): > > However France Soir owner Raymond Lakah, a French Egyptian, said in a statement to AFP news agency that he “decided to remove Jacques Lefranc as managing director of the publication as a powerful sign of respect for the intimate beliefs and convictions of every individual”. ---
**Author:** ![LonesomePolecat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/a88e57/32.png) [@LonesomePolecat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LonesomePolecat)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2006, 1:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/muslim-boycott-of-danish-goods/342209/83 "2006-02-02T13:16:17Z")
In the 1950’s when producers tried to bring the popular radio show \*Life with Luigi \* to television, the show was killed because Italian Americans protested that it was offensive. In the 1960’s the television show \* Amos n’ Andy \* was taken out of syndication because it was considered offensive to blacks. So far as I’m aware, it’s still not back in syndication, although videotapes of the TV show and tapes and MP3s of the radio show are available. Warners Brothers has removed a number of cartoons from circulation on the grounds that they are offensive to minorities (although I understand that they are made available to scholars and researchers). Among these are the famous Speedy Gonzales cartoons, which ironically are very popular in Latin America. Gay activists managed to get Dr. Laura’s television show canceled. An atheist sued to get a cross removed from the official seal of the city of Los Angeles. This cross was simply part of an illustration of a church mission, and the illustration was meant simply to portray the history of the city. I’ve not seen the old city seal, but some people say the cross in question was so small it was almost invisible. In Italy an atheist has brought a lawsuit for fraud against a local Catholic priest for teaching that Jesus Christ actually existed. In Georgia a couple of Democrats in the state legislature are trying to pass a bill which would allow public schools to teach courses about the Bible’s influence on Western history, culture and literature. They’re meeting a lot of opposition from the Usual Suspects. If Muslims choosing to boycott Danish products to protest needlessly offensive cartoons is censorship, then aren’t these all examples of censorship? ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2006, 1:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/muslim-boycott-of-danish-goods/342209/84 "2006-02-02T13:29:06Z")
Nothing wrong with boycotts. Boycotting a country because of of the actions of a free press within it is just illustrative of a lack of understanding about how a free press works. The concept is not well understood in most Arab countries. Boycotting for offensive images when your press is full of images and more that are highly offensive to others, and _is_ under governmental control, is hypocritical. Encouraging violence is just plain unacceptable. Intentionally insulting a whole group (religion or otherwise) with offensive images is just rude. Sometimes rude is called for, sometimes not. ---
**Author:** ![rayh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e79b87/32.png) [@rayh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rayh)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2006, 4:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/muslim-boycott-of-danish-goods/342209/85 "2006-02-02T16:17:27Z")
[Protests have spread across the Muslim world over the publication in Europe of cartoons of the Prophet Muhammad.](http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/4673908.stm) However :- > [@](#): > > Jordanian independent tabloid al-Shihan reprinted three of the cartoons on Thursday, saying people should know what they were protesting about, AFP news agency reports. > > “Muslims of the world be reasonable,” wrote editor Jihad Momani. > > “What brings more prejudice against Islam, these caricatures or pictures of a hostage-taker slashing the throat of his victim in front of the cameras or a suicide bomber who blows himself up during a wedding ceremony in Amman?” ---
**Author:** ![gum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/bbe5ce/32.png) [@gum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gum)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2006, 4:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/muslim-boycott-of-danish-goods/342209/86 "2006-02-02T16:23:29Z")
**tagos** , the cheese-eating surrender monkey owner of the french newspaper that re-published the pictures that sacked the editor is an _Egyptian_. **LonesomePolecat** - and others: What’s with the comparison of other censorships? Was anyone killed, were there bomb scares, death threads? No? Stop comparing them. Yes, these backward bastards have every right to a boycot. They do NOT, however, have the right to violence. \*Palestinian gunmen shut down the European Union’s office Thursday in Gaza City, Palestinian security sources said, demanding an apology in a row over European newspapers running cartoons featuring the prophet Mohammad. The gunmen left a notice on the EU office’s door that the building would remain closed until Europeans apologize to Muslims, many of whom consider the cartoons offensive. Mask-wearing members of the militant group Islamic Jihad and Al Aqsa Martyrs Brigades, the armed wing of former Palestinian ruling party Fatah, fired bullets into the air and a man read the group’s demands. Palestinian officials said the gunmen were threatening to kidnap European workers if the European Union did not apologize. \* Really, there aren’t enough rolling eyes smileys for this. “Any excuse will serve a tyrant”. [Aesop] btw: **DSeid** , > [@](#): > > _Sometimes rude is called for, sometimes not._ I think _right now_ the calling to be rude is here. Luckily I’m not the only one feeling that way. The BBC is going to broadcast the cartoons. . ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2006, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/muslim-boycott-of-danish-goods/342209/87 "2006-02-02T16:30:23Z")
As long as the EU shows some backbone, things are right with the world. I hope every newspaper and broadcaster in the Western world publishes these cartoons. Let them boycott the world, see what we care. If they respond with violence, it just shows the true motivations. ---
**Author:** ![tagos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@tagos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tagos)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2006, 4:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/muslim-boycott-of-danish-goods/342209/88 "2006-02-02T16:37:15Z")
Thanks Gum - I didn’t catch that. The West really does need to stand up and say we’re not letting the bloody Dark Ages cast a shadow across the 21st century. ---
**Author:** ![Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ccd318/32.png) [@Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Paul_in_Qatar)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2006, 4:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/muslim-boycott-of-danish-goods/342209/89 "2006-02-02T16:42:52Z")
I see a couple of other newspapers have re-published the cartoons in question. Did the Danish paper give them permission? Did the artists? Since it is now a news story does anyone have to get permission to print the things? By the way, I had my regular Thursday breakfast with a Dane at the Presidency of Civil Aviation. All his Saudi friends are telling him to call them if he feels unsafe. That is nice. ---
**Author:** ![tagos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@tagos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tagos)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2006, 4:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/muslim-boycott-of-danish-goods/342209/90 "2006-02-02T16:45:45Z")
> [@Paul in Saudi](#): > > I see a couple of other newspapers have re-published the cartoons in question. Did the Danish paper give them permission? Did the artists? Since it is now a news story does anyone have to get permission to print the things? > > By the way, I had my regular Thursday breakfast with a Dane at the Presidency of Civil Aviation. All his Saudi friends are telling him to call them if he feels unsafe. That is nice. Not sure, but irrelevant. As they are actually part of the story I guess copyright doesn’t apply. How do your colleagues feel about the issue? ---
**Author:** ![tagos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@tagos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tagos)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2006, 4:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/muslim-boycott-of-danish-goods/342209/91 "2006-02-02T16:55:09Z")
[Threats escalate](http://english.aljazeera.net/NR/exeres/B656C415-F0B8-488A-8C2B-14014EF1B3A8.htm) > [@](#): > > Armed groups in the Palestinian territories have threatened to attack Danish, French and Norwegian nationals after cartoons depicting the Prophet Muhammad appeared in European newspapers. > > Two militants groups released a joint statement on Thursday that said: “All nationals and those who work in the diplomatic corps of these countries can be considered targets of the Popular Resistance Committee and Al-Aqsa Martyrs Brigades.” > > Abu Mudjahid, a spokesman for the “joint command” of the two factions, said the threat was serious and extended to the nationals of all countries that had published the caricatures. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2006, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/muslim-boycott-of-danish-goods/342209/92 "2006-02-02T17:00:34Z")
> [@gum](#): > > Oh come on, Kimstu. > > I’ve let you rant on about your precious Islam, but if you’re honest, you can’t compare the protests by Christians [which I think are ridiculous too - but that’s because I’m a non-believer] and the bomb scares, death threats and even murder by Islamists, when their religion is ‘attacked’. > I really thought you weren’t disingenuous. I’m not, **gum**. Please calm down. Thanks. I certainly didn’t say or imply in any way that the protests by, say, UK Catholics against the cartoon _Popetown_ were at all comparable to death threats or bomb scares by Muslims offended by the caricatures of the Prophet. (Although see below.) However, many in this thread (including me, btw) have been saying that we think even more mild expressions of protest, such as a boycott of Danish goods, are inappropriate in this case. And boycotts have certainly been used, and are still used, by groups of offended Christians. So I think it’s perfectly valid to point out that we need to establish a common standard and apply it fairly. > [@gum](#): > > What’s with the comparison of other censorships? > Was anyone killed, were there bomb scares, death threads? There **were** in fact death threats from American Christians against the filmmaker Martin Scorsese when his 1988 movie _The Last Temptation of Christ_ was released. There were also threats to bomb theaters that showed the film. **Lochdale** is right that nobody actually got killed, but I do think that death threats and bomb threats by offended Christians are pretty much comparable, in kind if not in quantity, to the current threats of violence over the Muhammad cartoons. Alarmingly, if [this site](http://www.petergabriel.com/temptation/index.html) is to be believed, some of the Christian protesters even considered things like bomb threats to be standard and acceptable expressions of protest: :eek: > [@](#): > > “[W]hen directors with Mafia-sounding names make films about Jesus hanging out with whores just a stone’s throw from that wholesome Universal Studios family tour, it is time for action. Unfortunately, conventional protests such as picketing and telephoned bomb threats do not seem to be working.” – The Reverend Palsy, Texas (Emphasis added.) Similar threats of violence from Christian groups followed the release of a [2002 film in Mexico](http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2002/11/21/DD149054.DTL&type=movies): > [@](#): > > At two theaters in Southern California, picketers have greeted moviegoers at “El Crimen del Padre Amaro,” the new Mexican drama about a young, wayward priest who witnesses corruption in his small church, has sex with a 16-year- old parishioner, then steers her to have an abortion. […] > > At one point, [the director Carlos Carrera] walked around Mexico with bodyguards (provided by his movie studio) because of threats from a group called Soldiers of Christ of the 21st Century. The organization said it would put bombs in theaters where the movie was shown and would physically harm Carrera. ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2006, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/muslim-boycott-of-danish-goods/342209/93 "2006-02-02T17:11:53Z")
I don’t recall any nations with Christian majorities organizing boycotts of Martin Scorsese movies or other American products, or demands by those nations that offending filmmakers be punished by the American government. Just picked some nice chive Havarti cheese, product of Denmark. Doing my part to counter the boycott. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Lochdale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/edb3f5/32.png) [@Lochdale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lochdale)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2006, 5:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/muslim-boycott-of-danish-goods/342209/94 "2006-02-02T17:18:59Z")
With all due respect Kimstu, the fact that the creator of "piss Christ’ managed to survive untouched highlights the different threat levels faced. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2006, 5:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/muslim-boycott-of-danish-goods/342209/95 "2006-02-02T17:27:56Z")
> [@Jackmannii](#): > > Just picked some nice chive Havarti cheese, product of Denmark. Doing my part to counter the boycott. 😃 Good idea. Time to go shopping! ---
**Author:** ![Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ccd318/32.png) [@Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Paul_in_Qatar)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2006, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/muslim-boycott-of-danish-goods/342209/96 "2006-02-02T17:42:32Z")
> [@tagos](#): > > How do your colleagues feel about the issue? Us expats are odd birds. All the Americans (and the one Dane) I talked to thought it is a reasonable and measured response to what was a deliberate provocation. It will die out after a while, but the consumers here have sent their message. Nothing wrong with that. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2006, 5:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/muslim-boycott-of-danish-goods/342209/97 "2006-02-02T17:44:01Z")
> [@Lochdale](#): > > With all due respect Kimstu, the fact that the creator of "piss Christ’ managed to survive untouched highlights the different threat levels faced. I never claimed that the “threat levels” were identical in the two cases. I’m just pointing out that a death threat or bomb scare from a group of pissed-off Christians is a valid object of comparison with a death threat or bomb scare from a group of pissed-off Muslims. (Some of these “not comparable” comments are even giving the unfortunate—and, I hope and trust, inaccurate—impression of trying to **excuse** death threats and bomb scares from Christians. “Oh well, the Christian groups didn’t **actually** end up bombing or killing anybody, so their bomb scares and death threats shouldn’t really count!” Um, yeah, I think they should, actually.) ---
**Author:** ![Rune](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e68b1a/32.png) [@Rune](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rune)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2006, 8:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/muslim-boycott-of-danish-goods/342209/98 "2006-02-02T20:01:08Z")
The images have not been republished with the accept of the Danish newspaper or the Danish artists. The editor speculate they have gotten them from the Internet. I doubt anyone is going to file any copyright lawsuits, or perhaps they’re already practically in the public domain? I don’t mind the boycott - I’ll just boycott back. In fact Denmark send more in aid to the Middle East than it makes by trading with the Middle East. Boycott is an entirely legitimately way to protest - if somewhat misplaced that when the offending paper is private. I do mind the intermixed and underlying threats of violence. And from here it is very hard to distinguish the legitimate economic boycott from the other violent means of protests. A wonderful thing is starting to happened in Denmark directly as a result of this row. The protests in the Middle East didn’t start with the publishing of the cartoons - which happened more than four months ago. But only after a group of Imams which have been given stay in Denmark, decided to take it upon themselves to tour the Middle East trying to stir up resent against Denmark. Unfortunately in doing this, they not just exagerated a bit. They were in fact lying their ass of so as to present as bad a picture of Denmark as possible. Not only were the actual cartons not sufficiently insulting for their purpose. So they decided to take a number of others too, from God knows where - the consensus seems to be they draw them themselves. One featured Muhammed being fucked from behind by a dog. Another of Muhammed as a pig - which they presented as having been published in Denmark. They also told the newspaper was owned by the Danish state and that the Danish state was planning to publish a niced up censured edition of the Koran without key passages. And all kinds of other lies. All this, while they claimed to be the legitimate voice of Muslims in Denmark. Now a new organisation “Moderate Muslims” has now been created by a number of other muslims, which say they’re not represented by those Imams - they’re even demanding the Imams apologise to the Danish state for their behaviour. One of the founders is a world leading scientist in stem cell research (see, I didn’t even know Denmark had world famous scientist which was also an immigrant from the Middle East), another a leading politician, but most are just ordinary people. If all this noise is what it took to get these groups of Muslims up on the barricades and present another face and public voice of Muslims, it has all been worth it. The walk is always painful but this might yet turn out another win for frank in your face debate over pussyfooting. If only we had stem cell scientist to represent Muslims in Denmark rather than the same old talking heads of Imams preaching that women are themselves to blame for being raped and that stoning is good and well, etc. Then things would have looked much brighter here for a long time ago - and probably the cartoons would never have been published in the first place. ---
**Author:** ![Lochdale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/edb3f5/32.png) [@Lochdale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lochdale)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2006, 8:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/muslim-boycott-of-danish-goods/342209/99 "2006-02-02T20:15:37Z")
> [@Kimstu](#): > > I never claimed that the “threat levels” were identical in the two cases. I’m just pointing out that a death threat or bomb scare from a group of pissed-off Christians is a valid object of comparison with a death threat or bomb scare from a group of pissed-off Muslims. > > (Some of these “not comparable” comments are even giving the unfortunate—and, I hope and trust, inaccurate—impression of trying to **excuse** death threats and bomb scares from Christians. “Oh well, the Christian groups didn’t **actually** end up bombing or killing anybody, so their bomb scares and death threats shouldn’t really count!” Um, yeah, I think they should, actually.) Nothing wrong with highlighting the similarities but let’s be **very** clear that the threat levels are signifcantly different. That is, there is a very real chance that people will be killed over these pictures. As much as you may dislike the Christian right they are no where near the very real threat posed by radical Islam. Moreover, this current controversy goes to the very question as to whether moselms can integrate into western democratic society. The more I see, the further I question the wisdom of policies that allow significant numbers of moslems to emmigrate into western Europe. ---
**Author:** ![gum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/bbe5ce/32.png) [@gum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gum)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2006, 8:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/muslim-boycott-of-danish-goods/342209/100 "2006-02-02T20:46:45Z")
- 1989 - Iranian leader Ayatollah Ruhollah Khomeini calls on all Muslims to kill British author Salman Rushdie for blasphemy against Islam in his book “The Satanic Verses”. [Rushdie’s Japanese translator had been stabbed to death, its Italian translator was non-fatally knifed, and its Norwegian publisher survived being shot.] - 1994 - Taslima Nasreen flees Bangladesh for Sweden after court charges her with “maliciously hurting Muslim religious sentiments”. Some Muslims demand she be killed for her book “Lajja” (Shame), banned for blasphemy and suggesting free sex. \*Playwright Terence McNally, who is the victim of a fatwa calling for his execution should he ever enter an Islamic nation. His crime: portraying Jesus as gay in Corpus Christi. Since Jesus is a minor prophet in Islam, an offense unto him is now apparently grounds for for a Muslim death decree. - 1995 - Egyptian court brands academic Nasr Hamed Abu Zaid an apostate because of his writings on Islam and annuls his marriage on grounds that a Muslim may not be married to an apostate. Abu Zaid and his wife move to the Netherlands. - 2002 - Nigerian journalist Isioma Daniel incenses Muslims by writing in ThisDay newspaper that Prophet Mohammad would have approved of “Miss World” contest and might have wed a beauty queen. Muslim-Christian riots in northen city of Kaduna kill 200. Daniel flees Nigeria after fatwa urges Muslims to kill her. - 2004 - Dutch film maker Theo van Gogh is murdered after release of his film “Submission” about violence against women in Islamic societies. Ayaan Hirsi Ali, Somali-born member of Dutch parliament who wrote script, plans another film about Islam’s attitude to gays. She has also received death threats. - 2005 - London’s Tate Britain museum removes “God is Great sculpture” by John Latham from exhibition for fear of offending Muslims, citing “sensitive climate” after July suicide bombings. - It is too late to get the opinions of Islamist/feminist writer Konca Kuris, who was kidnapped, tortured, and killed by Hezbollah in the Turkish town of Konya in 1998, or of Turkish secularist and newspaper columnist Ahmet Taner Kislali, who died when a bomb went off beneath the hood of his car the following year. I’m calm, **Kimstu**. I can also compare. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/muslim-boycott-of-danish-goods/342209.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/muslim-boycott-of-danish-goods/342209.md?page=6)