# Mutinies **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [July 22, 1999, 3:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mutinies/2160 "1999-07-22T15:36:00Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 5\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![system](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/original/2X/e/e489c3b7d8fce19c4b355dd4fc3f88cc39c34b87.png) [@system](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/system)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 1999, 8:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mutinies/2160/21 "1999-07-25T20:44:00Z")
**TomnDebb** : yes, I should have explained the shot as being taken _from_ UGANDA. Here’s a better image: [http://www.islandnet.com/~kingdave/ugan2.jpg](http://www.islandnet.com/~kingdave/ugan2.jpg) Here is a photo of a burial at sea on UGANDA, during her trip to the South Pacific (the casualty died of disease, not enemy action): [http://www.islandnet.com/~kingdave/burial.jpg](http://www.islandnet.com/~kingdave/burial.jpg) **Monty** : Yup, I sure do know that Japan was an ally during the Great War; I’d better, because the coast artillery fort that I work at was protected from a German Pacific squadron (Von Spee) by the hasty despatch of two Japanese cruisers _Asama_ and _Idzumo_in August-September 1914. In fact, here’s a photo of officers of the Imperial Japanese Navy and Canadian sailors in Esquimalt, September, 1914: [http://www.islandnet.com/~kingdave/nippon.jpg](http://www.islandnet.com/~kingdave/nippon.jpg) (and I _still_ think it’s ironic that we sold UGANDA/QUEBEC to the Japanese for scrap, as she had seen service against them just a few years previously.) And finally, because you’ve all done so well, I hereby give the order to “Splice the Mainbrace!”: [http://www.islandnet.com/~kingdave/grog.jpg](http://www.islandnet.com/~kingdave/grog.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![system](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/original/2X/e/e489c3b7d8fce19c4b355dd4fc3f88cc39c34b87.png) [@system](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/system)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 1999, 8:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mutinies/2160/22 "1999-07-25T20:53:00Z")
[[“In 1797, sixteen ships of the British fleet anchored at Spithead off Portsmouth refused to obey orders to set sail. By the terms of the day, the action was called a mutiny. By modern understanding, it would be called a wildcat strike.” I beg to differ. Though it would not be called mutiny (unlawfully seizing control of a vessel)It would, in the U.S. navy, be refusing a direct order at best. In time of war, most likely: treason. The captains would be arrested, court martialed and replaced. The ships would then certainly get underway. ]] EvilGhandi Actually, just to be a nit-prick, it almost surely wouldn’t be treason (although it would be considered a serious offense nonetheless). As specified in the Constitution, treason consists “only in levying War against [the U.S.], or in adhering to their emenies, giving them Aid and Comfort.” A simple refusial to wage war on behalf of the U.S. would not seem to meet this test. ---
**Author:** ![system](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/original/2X/e/e489c3b7d8fce19c4b355dd4fc3f88cc39c34b87.png) [@system](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/system)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 1999, 10:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mutinies/2160/23 "1999-07-25T22:29:00Z")
I think, in the case of Spithead, desertion and refusal of a superior’s order is closer to the mark than treason. When they took over the ships and sent the officers ashore, it, undeniably, became mutiny. ---
**Author:** ![system](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/original/2X/e/e489c3b7d8fce19c4b355dd4fc3f88cc39c34b87.png) [@system](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/system)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 1999, 2:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mutinies/2160/24 "1999-07-26T02:59:00Z")
I realize that the Spithead Mutiny was, legally speaking, a mutiny. But it wasn’t what most people would think of as being a traditional mutiny. The sailors who refused to follow orders were not protesting against their officers or the Navy, they were simply refusing to work until they got a payraise. It was in that sense that I wrote it was more of a strike than a mutiny. A majority of the officers who were sent ashore, as well as most of the Navy leadership in London, felt the sailors had a valid point and argued for a pay increase to Parliament. ---
**Author:** ![system](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/original/2X/e/e489c3b7d8fce19c4b355dd4fc3f88cc39c34b87.png) [@system](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/system)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 1999, 2:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mutinies/2160/25 "1999-07-26T14:47:00Z")
\<\\> What never? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mutinies/2160.md?page=1)