# My babysitter's mother, fairly lame rant **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [June 11, 2006, 3:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-babysitters-mother-fairly-lame-rant/360306 "2006-06-11T15:27:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 7\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![Mama\_Tiger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/6de8d8/32.png) [@Mama\_Tiger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mama_Tiger)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2006, 10:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-babysitters-mother-fairly-lame-rant/360306/101 "2006-06-13T22:08:31Z")
Jeez, lighten up, Shayna. No, I actually read up on the tax laws that I was required to follow regarding my cleaning lady and reported and paid the taxes for her. I just never heard of a teenager exception to the rules, and I don’t recall reading it in any of the IRS publications that I, yes, READ at the time this was a concern to me. I’ve never claimed to be a lawyer or an accountant, simply an ordinary taxpayer who happened to have personal knowledge of how it applied to my situation some years back. For all I know, that teenager exception is a new addition to the tax laws since the time it was relevant to me (since I haven’t had a cleaning lady for over ten years now). Since I simply don’t recall ever reading about it or hearing about it at the time I _was_ investigating this issue, I thought it fair to warn the OP that it could potentially be a problem. I mentioned the media simply because that’s where most people get their knowledge about whether such rules apply to them, by laughing and pointing at politicians who get caught behaving hypocritically. So I guess thanking you for successfully fighting my ignorance isn’t suffiicient? Should I climb up on the cross now, too? Flay my skin from my body and throw it into a bonfire for your enjoyment? Good lord. If an acknowledgement that I’ve learned from what you pointed out isn’t sufficient, what the fuck _is_? ---
**Author:** ![Flyhalf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/ea5d25/32.png) [@Flyhalf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Flyhalf)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2006, 10:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-babysitters-mother-fairly-lame-rant/360306/102 "2006-06-13T22:16:46Z")
[QUOTE=Velma] Even if that was the case, she doesn’t need to apologize or feel bad for doing it. If I choose to pay for a babysitter so I can go do volunteer work, does that make me a bad parent? [/QUOTE] No, it does not. I never said otherwise. However, in case you missed the sentence below, this is where the confusion comes from. [QUOTE=WishIHadACoolName] If I had to pay her much more than I’m paying, there’d be no point in me even working. I’d stay home and demand $100 a week from hubby. [/QUOTE] Doesn’t this sound to you like **WIHACN** is already “this” close to staying home? FFS! Shayna, I have a couple of sincere questions. Let me state that I admit to having extremely limited knowledge of tax laws. Now, first off, how do we know that this girl is a dependent and does it matter if she is or is not a dependent (based on the other info you gave in your earlier post)? Also, would **WIHACN** need to consider state tax laws for her situation? ---
**Author:** ![Kalhoun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/3bc359/32.png) [@Kalhoun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kalhoun)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2006, 10:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-babysitters-mother-fairly-lame-rant/360306/103 "2006-06-13T22:46:55Z")
[QUOTE=Shayna] Sounds to me more like she got $120 cash; paid travel expenses, including food and lodging; and better than 50% of her time spent as vacation (seeing as how she only “worked” 20 out of approximately 48 hours). When I was in college (admittedly back in the bronze age), I got paid $25/day for staying with kids when their parents went away for the weekend. In today’s market, my boss pays his son’s nanny $100/day if she has to stay at the house when my boss travels. Sounds like your friend’s daughter got a pretty nice deal at $60 a day plus meals, expenses and vacation time. [/QUOTE] Listen…the mom went to an AA picnic. This girl doesn’t know or care about any of the people there. It’d BETTER be free travel expenses, since she didn’t choose the destination. Food and lodging on a business trip are always included. That isn’t part of her compensation. So out of 48 hours, she spent 20 working and 16 sleeping. Doesn’t leave much in the way of “vacation” time. ---
**Author:** ![Shayna](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shayna/32/17976_2.png) [@Shayna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shayna)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2006, 1:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-babysitters-mother-fairly-lame-rant/360306/104 "2006-06-14T01:43:16Z")
[QUOTE=Mama Tiger] Jeez, lighten up, Shayna. No, I actually read up on the tax laws that I was required to follow regarding my cleaning lady and reported and paid the taxes for her. I just never heard of a teenager exception to the rules, and I don’t recall reading it in any of the IRS publications that I, yes, READ at the time this was a concern to me. I’ve never claimed to be a lawyer or an accountant, simply an ordinary taxpayer who happened to have personal knowledge of how it applied to my situation some years back. For all I know, that teenager exception is a new addition to the tax laws since the time it was relevant to me (since I haven’t had a cleaning lady for over ten years now). Since I simply don’t recall ever reading about it or hearing about it at the time I _was_ investigating this issue, I thought it fair to warn the OP that it could potentially be a problem. I mentioned the media simply because that’s where most people get their knowledge about whether such rules apply to them, by laughing and pointing at politicians who get caught behaving hypocritically. So I guess thanking you for successfully fighting my ignorance isn’t suffiicient? Should I climb up on the cross now, too? Flay my skin from my body and throw it into a bonfire for your enjoyment? Good lord. If an acknowledgement that I’ve learned from what you pointed out isn’t sufficient, what the fuck _is_? [/QUOTE] Well, you might start with an apology to **Wish** for scaring her into thinking she was doing something illegal. Perhaps that’s why my reply today was so much harsher than yesterday’s – not only did you admit to ridiculously stupid reasons for the erroneous conclusions you drew, but **Wish** confirmed my concern that you did, indeed, cause her to worry about the legality of her actions. That’s why we have proscriptions here against dispensing medical advice. That’s why our resident attorneys always post disclaimers such as “I am not your attorney, I am not licensed in your state, this is not legal advice,” etc., etc. It is irresponsible to dispense professional advice you aren’t qualified to give. And it’s potentially hurtful and, frankly, rude, to make outright accusations of illegal behavior when you’re only guessing, based on 10-year-old information you learned as it related to an entirely different set of circumstances in your personal life. You didn’t qualify your post. You didn’t explain that you aren’t a lawyer or an accountant, or tell her that you were “simply an ordinary taxpayer who happened to have personal knowledge of how it applied to [your] [entirely different] situation” ten years ago. You didn’t merely “warn the OP that it could potentially be a problem,” you stated, as if it were fact, what she _should_ be paying in taxes. You admonished her not to talk about her lack of tax withholding because the IRS might take a dim view of that. You literally accused her of violating Federal tax laws. Laws which you not only haven’t studied as a profession, let alone refreshed your knowledge of in the last 10 years, but laws you didn’t even bother to _look up_ to see if they might even apply in this situation before you posted your “warning.” I apologize for coming across harshly. I just think this is a serious issue, and I could tell from your response to me today that although you acknowledged that you’d learned the facts you’d gotten wrong, you didn’t take any responsibility for the accusatory tone of that post or the effect it had on its target, **Wish**. [QUOTE=Flyhalf] Shayna, I have a couple of sincere questions. Let me state that I admit to having extremely limited knowledge of tax laws. Now, first off, how do we know that this girl is a dependent and does it matter if she is or is not a dependent (based on the other info you gave in your earlier post)? Also, would **WIHACN** need to consider state tax laws for her situation? [/QUOTE] Before I answer any further, let _me_ state that although I have an accounting degree, have prepared income tax returns for qualified families through the IRS’s VITA program, have taken continuing education courses in tax preparation, continue to do tax preparation for friends, and for the past 6 years have managed the finances and books for 6 business entities, **I am not a professional CPA. I am not _your_ accountant. For specific questions about tax laws in your state, consult with a professional accountant or tax attorney in your area.** I do, however, in addition to the aforementioned “qualifications,” know how to look things up on the IRS website to verify or confirm my knowledge. With that in mind. . . We know that this girl is a dependent because the OP told us she is a minor child who lives with her mother (and the mother’s boyfriend, with no financial support from bio-dad). If her mother does not claim her as a dependent on her tax return then she is a stupid idiot (which I guess we can’t rule out, come to think of it ;)). It only matters _to Heather_, whether or not she can be claimed as a dependent on her mother’s tax return, as filing a return with the Federal Government is _her_ responsibility, not her employer’s. Her employer (in this case **Wish** ), isn’t even obligated to withhold Federal Income Tax, even if Heather ended up owing any. See again [Publication 926](http://www.irs.gov/publications/p926/ar02.html#d0e799), which states: > [@](#): > > You are not required to withhold federal income tax from wages you pay a household employee. You should withhold federal income tax only if your household employee asks you to withhold it and you agree. The employee must give you a completed Form W-4, Employee’s Withholding Allowance Certificate. I couldn’t begin to answer questions about tax laws in specific states since they are all vastly different, but generally, yes, **Wish** would have to consider state tax laws as regards employment and unemployment taxes, as well as whether or not she might be required to carry worker’s comp insurance. But since **Mama Tiger’s** post only referred to Social Security tax and how the IRS (a Federal agency) might view **Wish’s** lack of withholding and/or payment of taxes, those were the only corrections I addressed. [QUOTE=Kalhoun] Listen…the mom went to an AA picnic. This girl doesn’t know or care about any of the people there. It’d BETTER be free travel expenses, since she didn’t choose the destination. Food and lodging on a business trip are always included. That isn’t part of her compensation. So out of 48 hours, she spent 20 working and 16 sleeping. Doesn’t leave much in the way of “vacation” time. [/QUOTE] $60 a day, plus food, plus at least _some_ free time still sounds like a reasonable compensation to me. Obviously mileage varies, but the girl took the job so I assume she was satisfied with the offered wage or she’d’ve declined or asked for more money. And now that she sees what the level of responsibility would be on such a trip, perhaps next time she will ask for more. Doesn’t mean she’ll get it or that the woman ripped her off at that wage, but she’s certainly free to negotiate. ---
**Author:** ![Flyhalf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/ea5d25/32.png) [@Flyhalf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Flyhalf)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2006, 2:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-babysitters-mother-fairly-lame-rant/360306/105 "2006-06-14T14:46:59Z")
[QUOTE=Shayna] We know that this girl is a dependent because the OP told us she is a minor child who lives with her mother (and the mother’s boyfriend, with no financial support from bio-dad). If her mother does not claim her as a dependent on her tax return then she is a stupid idiot (which I guess we can’t rule out, come to think of it ;)). [/QUOTE] Thanks for the info. I figured she was eligible to be claimed as a dependent but did/does the mother claim her as such (that’s where I was going with my question). Not that it impacts **WIHACN**. ---
**Author:** ![Velma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/85e7bf/32.png) [@Velma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velma)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2006, 7:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-babysitters-mother-fairly-lame-rant/360306/106 "2006-06-14T19:25:31Z")
[QUOTE=Flyhalf] No, it does not. I never said otherwise. However, in case you missed the sentence below, this is where the confusion comes from. [/quote] No confusion. I am responding to your idea that: “Unless they’re not worth more than a few extra bucks per week. I don’t know…” Is pretty much implying that you think she doesn’t value her kids since she is working for only a little extra money. I was pointing out that how much she comes home with does not have anything to do with what her kids are worth. How is she supposed to respond to that statement? No, my kids aren’t worth more than a couple bucks. You’re right. > [@](#): > > Doesn’t this sound to you like **WIHACN** is already “this” close to staying home? FFS! Sure. I just found your comments condescending. ---
**Author:** ![Flyhalf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/ea5d25/32.png) [@Flyhalf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Flyhalf)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2006, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-babysitters-mother-fairly-lame-rant/360306/107 "2006-06-14T19:29:26Z")
[QUOTE=Velma] Sure. I just found your comments condescending. [/QUOTE] Then you would be wrong. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-babysitters-mother-fairly-lame-rant/360306.md?page=5)