# My boss wants to keep me, but has to fire me **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [August 22, 2009, 4:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-boss-wants-to-keep-me-but-has-to-fire-me/507284 "2009-08-22T04:41:09Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![justrob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/a9adbd/32.png) [@justrob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/justrob)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2009, 8:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-boss-wants-to-keep-me-but-has-to-fire-me/507284/21 "2009-08-22T20:20:18Z")
> [@lissener](#): > > [ul] > [li]She refuses to float between the remaining two stores, even though that’s what my boss wants[/li][/ul] Forgive me if I’m being dense but why couldn’t **you** float between the remaining two stores until Celia leaves? ---
**Author:** ![Markxxx](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/5daacb/32.png) [@Markxxx](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Markxxx)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2009, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-boss-wants-to-keep-me-but-has-to-fire-me/507284/22 "2009-08-22T20:25:50Z")
I hate to say this so bluntly but your boss is trying to be nice to you. He wants YOU fired and is trying to give you a way to “save face” on the way to the unemployment line. So he’s making up a lame reason so you can go home blaming the “system” and not him Of course I could be wrong, after all he wouldn’t be the first idiot boss, but… ---
**Author:** ![Alex\_Dubinsky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dbc845/32.png) [@Alex\_Dubinsky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alex_Dubinsky)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2009, 8:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-boss-wants-to-keep-me-but-has-to-fire-me/507284/23 "2009-08-22T20:37:09Z")
How could this “uncomplicated” boss who’s not thinking through his employees’ economic value come to personally own three stores? Something’s not adding up. Maybe you’re underestimating his inability to lie. Did you pull any other pranks involving in-store displays? Did Celia ever seem like the type to cheat on her husband? ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2009, 8:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-boss-wants-to-keep-me-but-has-to-fire-me/507284/24 "2009-08-22T20:37:49Z")
> [@justrob](#): > > Forgive me if I’m being dense but why couldn’t **you** float between the remaining two stores until Celia leaves? Because **lissener** is neither a female, nor the oldest employee of the company. Other than that, he’d be happy to do it. The problem here is a boss who knows only enough of the law to be afraid of it. BTDT, got the pink slip. ---
**Author:** ![aruvqan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aruvqan/32/2891_2.png) [@aruvqan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aruvqan)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2009, 9:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-boss-wants-to-keep-me-but-has-to-fire-me/507284/25 "2009-08-22T21:36:11Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > You could just be honest. Tell him the things you posted in your OP: That Celia has a husband and is looking for another job, while you will be homeless if you lose your job. Point out that the customers like you. Tell him that this is more than a job and a paycheck to you. If he mentions seniority, then you can direct him to the State site. > > … > > . And point out it is an at will state, and HER store is the one that is closing. He can fire her because the store is being closed with no other explaination. ---
**Author:** ![handsomeharry](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e9c0ed/32.png) [@handsomeharry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/handsomeharry)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2009, 9:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-boss-wants-to-keep-me-but-has-to-fire-me/507284/26 "2009-08-22T21:53:45Z")
> [@Markxxx](#): > > I hate to say this so bluntly but your boss is trying to be nice to you. He wants YOU fired and is trying to give you a way to “save face” on the way to the unemployment line. > > So he’s making up a lame reason so you can go home blaming the “system” and not him Forget what I wrote earlier. \*\*Markxxx \*\*has it. ---
**Author:** ![UltraVires](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ecccb3/32.png) [@UltraVires](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UltraVires)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2009, 9:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-boss-wants-to-keep-me-but-has-to-fire-me/507284/27 "2009-08-22T21:58:50Z")
> [@handsomeharry](#): > > Forget what I wrote earlier. \*\*Markxxx \*\*has it. +2 ---
**Author:** ![lissener](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lissener/32/6139_2.png) [@lissener](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lissener)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2009, 10:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-boss-wants-to-keep-me-but-has-to-fire-me/507284/28 "2009-08-22T22:07:07Z")
> [@justrob](#): > > Forgive me if I’m being dense but why couldn’t **you** float between the remaining two stores until Celia leaves? I would; that was initially part of the expectations of that position after the fallout of the store closing. Her refusal means that my boss himself will have to work a couple days at the other store. Not his first choice, but it saves him two days of pay as well, so it almost balances out. He’ll get tired of it though and hire a part-timer, if past experience is any indication. ---
**Author:** ![lissener](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lissener/32/6139_2.png) [@lissener](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lissener)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2009, 10:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-boss-wants-to-keep-me-but-has-to-fire-me/507284/29 "2009-08-22T22:08:35Z")
> [@Markxxx](#): > > I hate to say this so bluntly but your boss is trying to be nice to you. He wants YOU fired and is trying to give you a way to “save face” on the way to the unemployment line. > > So he’s making up a lame reason so you can go home blaming the “system” and not him > > Of course I could be wrong, after all he wouldn’t be the first idiot boss, but… As I said, if you knew him you’d know this is not the case. ---
**Author:** ![lissener](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lissener/32/6139_2.png) [@lissener](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lissener)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2009, 10:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-boss-wants-to-keep-me-but-has-to-fire-me/507284/30 "2009-08-22T22:17:18Z")
> [@Alex\_Dubinsky](#): > > How could this “uncomplicated” boss who’s not thinking through his employees’ economic value come to personally own three stores? Something’s not adding up. Maybe you’re underestimating his inability to lie. Did you pull any other pranks involving in-store displays? Did Celia ever seem like the type to cheat on her husband? He started with an inherited store and then bought two more established stores. Before Netflix, when your local video store was an uncomplicated proposition, his stores did reasonably well. He’s not involved on a hands on, daily basis; when he is it messes things up and the stores’ respective managers have to step in and clean up after him. If he weren’t who he his, frankly, I think we’d have a better chance of riding out the Netflix tsunami: he’s unwilling to try any creative solutions, and just wants to “wait and see.” Hence the closing of one of his stores, IMO. He frequently makes decisions based on his immediate emotional response which turn out to be very bad decisions in the long run. Hence, again, the closing of the store. (I know I’m taking this too personally, but at what point will my judgment of the situation on the ground be taken at face value? Do I really have to educate you minutely on every conceivable detail and nuance of the situation before you won’t presume that your judgment, in the abstract, is probably better and clearer than mine, in the concrete?) ---
**Author:** ![lissener](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lissener/32/6139_2.png) [@lissener](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lissener)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2009, 2:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-boss-wants-to-keep-me-but-has-to-fire-me/507284/31 "2009-08-23T02:38:58Z")
> [@lissener](#): > > (I know I’m taking this too personally, but at what point will my judgment of the situation on the ground be taken at face value? Do I really have to educate you minutely on every conceivable detail and nuance of the situation before you won’t presume that your judgment, in the abstract, is probably better and clearer than mine, in the concrete?) Sorry, ^^this^^ was not aimed at the general helpfulness of the thread; only at the people who insist on telling me that I’m reading my boss wrong, and that he really does want to fire me, he’s just trying to let me down easy. Just because you can picture this happening in a speculative situation does not mean that that abstract possibility trumps my experience in the actual real world. Sorry if that’s pissy. But well, you know. ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2009, 2:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-boss-wants-to-keep-me-but-has-to-fire-me/507284/32 "2009-08-23T02:50:58Z")
> [@lissener](#): > > [li]My boss would rather keep me:[/li] His actions would indicate otherwise. [QUOTE] [li]It could of course have been coincidence, but sales dropped that month too[/li][/QUOTE] Unlikely unless you are actively selling your stores services. > [@](#): > > I’m currently homeless until I get another couple paychecks under my belt; if I lose this job next week I’ll be truly homeless > Celia has no real interest in movies; this has always just been a retail job for her > Celia is married, with a husband who works > > I objectively “need” this job more than Celia. Your ‘need’ is irrelevant to your bosses decision. His obligation is to his business. > [@](#): > > What are the options? You can sign up for unemployment and begin looking for another job. Ultimately, what your boss “should” do is lay off the employee who has the lowest performance. Since you work in a video store, short of lighting the place on fire or pissing on a customer, it is probably extremely difficult to differentiate between your performance. i.e. you aren’t billing hours or in direct sales or anything like that. Therefore, the employee with the least seniority is most likely to be let go and unfortunately that is you. > [@lissener](#): > > Sorry, ^^this^^ was not aimed at the general helpfulness of the thread; only at the people who insist on telling me that I’m reading my boss wrong, and that he really does want to fire me, he’s just trying to let me down easy. Just because you can picture this happening in a speculative situation does not mean that that abstract possibility trumps my experience in the actual real world. Sorry if that’s pissy. But well, you know. Based on our respective positions in the business world (well…when we are working. As of now they both happened to be “unemployed”), I think you should trust my advice on this one. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2009, 3:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-boss-wants-to-keep-me-but-has-to-fire-me/507284/33 "2009-08-23T03:43:59Z")
> [@aruvqan](#): > > And point out it is an at will state, and HER store is the one that is closing. He can fire her because the store is being closed with no other explaination. Presumably he’ll be keeping some of the other staff from the closing store, though. **lissener** , you may as well move on. It sounds like your job will be eliminated soonish whether it’s because Celia takes it or not. Netflix Prevails. ---
**Author:** ![lissener](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lissener/32/6139_2.png) [@lissener](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lissener)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2009, 4:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-boss-wants-to-keep-me-but-has-to-fire-me/507284/34 "2009-08-23T04:04:54Z")
> [@msmith537](#): > > His actions would indicate otherwise. > > Unlikely unless you are actively selling your stores services. > > Your ‘need’ is irrelevant to your bosses decision. His obligation is to his business. > > You can sign up for unemployment and begin looking for another job. > > Ultimately, what your boss “should” do is lay off the employee who has the lowest performance. Since you work in a video store, short of lighting the place on fire or pissing on a customer, it is probably extremely difficult to differentiate between your performance. i.e. you aren’t billing hours or in direct sales or anything like that. Therefore, the employee with the least seniority is most likely to be let go and unfortunately that is you. > > Based on our respective positions in the business world (well…when we are working. As of now they both happened to be “unemployed”), I think you should trust my advice on this one. The only way any of what you say makes sense is for you to strip the situation of all its actual, real-world truth and reduce to a total abstraction. I.e., while your assumptions about the situation may fit some kind of abstract average situation in a textbook universe, they are actually almost 100% incorrect here. In other words, all you’ve demonstrated is how unfamiliar you are with this situation, and how irrelevant–however well meant–your advice is, being based entirely on false assumptions. But thanks. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2009, 5:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-boss-wants-to-keep-me-but-has-to-fire-me/507284/35 "2009-08-23T05:20:44Z")
> [@lissener](#): > > (Mods this contains a legal question, but please move it if it contains too much other stuff.) [Moderating] I think the legal questions have been pretty much addressed. Since we now seem to be drifting into advice, I think it may be better to move this to IMHO. Colibri General Questions Moderator ---
**Author:** ![Washoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/ecae2f/32.png) [@Washoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Washoe)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2009, 5:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-boss-wants-to-keep-me-but-has-to-fire-me/507284/36 "2009-08-23T05:48:43Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > **lissener** , you may as well move on. It sounds like your job will be eliminated soonish whether it’s because Celia takes it or not. Netflix Prevails. Sadly, that’s exactly right. In the same way that Best Buy, Target, [amazon.com](http://amazon.com), etc. killed the independent record store ten years ago, NetFlix will ultimately drive the independent video store into extinction. In a few years neither will be left. Here in Simi Valley, a city of over 100,000 people, there’s only one independent video store remaining, and no record stores. ---
**Author:** ![Estilicon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/848f3c/32.png) [@Estilicon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Estilicon)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2009, 1:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-boss-wants-to-keep-me-but-has-to-fire-me/507284/37 "2009-08-23T13:24:45Z")
> [@msmith537](#): > > Since you work in a video store, short of lighting the place on fire or pissing on a customer, it is probably extremely difficult to differentiate between your performance. i.e. you aren’t billing hours or in direct sales or anything like that. Therefore, the employee with the least seniority is most likely to be let go and unfortunately that is you. Lissener, you don’t know me but I’ve read your threads in Cafe Society with pleasure. You Sir surely know your business. So, no matter what happens in the following weeks disregard Msmith comment. We can always distinguis between someone who knows and care and someone who doesn’t: we tend to conduct business with the second type. If your boss doesn’t see that, his loss. Good luck. ---
**Author:** ![UltraVires](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ecccb3/32.png) [@UltraVires](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UltraVires)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2009, 1:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-boss-wants-to-keep-me-but-has-to-fire-me/507284/38 "2009-08-23T13:36:39Z")
> [@lissener](#): > > The only way any of what you say makes sense is for you to strip the situation of all its actual, real-world truth and reduce to a total abstraction. I.e., while your assumptions about the situation may fit some kind of abstract average situation in a textbook universe, they are actually almost 100% incorrect here. > > In other words, all you’ve demonstrated is how unfamiliar you are with this situation, and how irrelevant–however well meant–your advice is, being based entirely on false assumptions. But thanks. The flip side of this is that when you are personally involved in the situation sometimes it is very easy to lose sight of the overall picture. In other words, you bust your ass and devote most of your waking life to your place of employment and you just can’t fathom that you boss doesn’t see that or respect the effort that you put forth. But it happens. Bottom line is that you are an expense line on a ledger. Sometimes being outside of the personalities of the situation will give a person a clearer picture.. ---
**Author:** ![Dave\_Hartwick](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/7feea3/32.png) [@Dave\_Hartwick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dave_Hartwick)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2009, 2:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-boss-wants-to-keep-me-but-has-to-fire-me/507284/39 "2009-08-23T14:02:28Z")
The OP has received some pretty good free legal advice from what I read. Here’s mine, but it’s more life advice: Get out of retail. I worked retail as stocker and manager and it sucks. You not only have no rights, you have no future. Working hard at retail (garden-variety, I don’t know about high end) is like working hard at being a furry, no matter how hard you work, no matter how much talent you pour into it, nobody respects you for it, they just wonder why you took a job you’re too good for. The OP can write, at least, it was all bullet-pointed and important looking and shit. Get a haircut and get a real job might be the best advice. You want to be in show biz? Go to school, learn to work a TV camera, I hear there (used to be) a demand for that. ---
**Author:** ![Isamu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/7c8e57/32.png) [@Isamu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Isamu)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2009, 2:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-boss-wants-to-keep-me-but-has-to-fire-me/507284/40 "2009-08-23T14:03:03Z")
> [@Markxxx](#): > > I hate to say this so bluntly but your boss is trying to be nice to you. He wants YOU fired and is trying to give you a way to “save face” on the way to the unemployment line. That’s how I read the situation too, until I read that his boss might have Asperger’s. The legal situation has been explained, there’s little else here but echo the recommendations to start a new job search, which is a shame, but (sh)it happens. And this is a good opportunity to remind people to always be your own best booster. You can be great at your job, and the customers can love you but if your boss doesn’t see that happening on a frequent basis, it’s worth nothing. For people who’s job it is to bring money into the company, you’re in the simplest position because your worth to the company in right there in black and white on the books every month. For people who add value in different ways, they have a harder time proving their worth, and to stay on top of _that_ game is worth spending at least 10% of your working day on. For lissener - best of luck. I’ve never had an aspie boss so I can’t offer any real counsel. The only thing I can say is that if you really want to keep this job, now is the time to get proactive. Sounds like your employer is between a rock and a hard place in that he has to close down one of the stores _just to keep the other two afloat_. You need to provide your boss with viable solutions to turning the business around. Actually, they don’t even have to be viable (in the short term) they just have to hit your boss’s switches. In the long term, they have to work if you want to stay employed there. Put on your thinking cap and don’t wallow in misery!! [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-boss-wants-to-keep-me-but-has-to-fire-me/507284.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-boss-wants-to-keep-me-but-has-to-fire-me/507284.md?page=3)