# My Business Has A Logo. Do I Need To Copyright It Or Something? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [April 2, 2009, 11:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-business-has-a-logo-do-i-need-to-copyright-it-or-something/491783 "2009-04-02T23:30:30Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 4\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2009, 3:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-business-has-a-logo-do-i-need-to-copyright-it-or-something/491783/21 "2009-04-03T15:13:05Z")
> [@SeanArenas](#): > > How do I know, and how does their site know, that the logo we design together doesn’t accidentally infringe an existing mark of some sort? Is it my responsibility to go to [uspto.gov](http://uspto.gov) and other sites and compare the mark before I spend money getting it printed on products? Yes, it’s your burden. Furthermore, it’s not enough to just check with the U.S. Patent and Trademark Office, because states also register marks and there are also enforceable unregistered marks. If you really want an unchallengeable mark, you have to hire someone to do a trademark search. For some businesses, it isn’t worth it, because if someone comes along and claims senior rights in a mark, it’s easier and cheaper just to change your own mark. It really depends on your specific business circumstances whether it’s important to you to have a mark you can defend in the long run. > [@](#): > > I assume the most likely response is just to tell me to stop, unless I continue after that point, right? That’s usually the first step, yes. > [@](#): > > **acsenray** , you point out in point 4 that business don’t register because they’re no point. One point might be so that it’s easy for other people to make sure they aren’t accidentally infringing you. It would suck for two people to accidentally be using a very, very similar mark because neither registered. Maybe both checked, but didn’t bother to register. Just wondering. _Some_ businesses don’t register because it doesn’t make any sense for them to. But registration is no guarantee that there won’t be clashes with other businesses. Whether or not you register, if you believe that it’s important for you to have a mark that you can keep in the long run, you have to be prepared to spend money defending that mark. ---
**Author:** ![mazinger\_z](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/5f9b8f/32.png) [@mazinger\_z](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mazinger_z)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2009, 3:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-business-has-a-logo-do-i-need-to-copyright-it-or-something/491783/22 "2009-04-03T15:48:42Z")
> [@SeanArenas](#): > > Anyhow, they charge me like $25 or something to download it, but I can use it for anything on their site for free. You should read the site to make sure that they don’t somehow also own the right to the mark, but also manage to pass on the liability to you. This is what we in the industry call “trying to pull a fast one.” > [@SeanArenas](#): > > How do I know, and how does their site know, that the logo we design together doesn’t accidentally infringe an existing mark of some sort? Is it my responsibility to go to [uspto.gov](http://uspto.gov) and other sites and compare the mark before I spend money getting it printed on products? To expand further on **ascenray’s** answer, the legal standard in the industry is to use Thompson or rather [Trademark.com](http://Trademark.com). Anyone who tells you that they do otherwise is, imo, not providing you with best in class service (did I really just type that? I’ve been working my corporate gig too long). Thompson is expensive which will further add to the cost to prosecute your trademark, but is much, much cheaper if you find yourself before the TTAB. A good average price for just the prosecution is about $1000. This can be much greater depending on the complexity of the mark and if mark will be used on different service classes. Btw, it’s also $275 for each additional class. Some firms charge an additional fee to do a search and provide an opinion, that could also be another $1000. A good average flat fee, all-in type service is between $1500-2000. In my experience at my private side practice, I find those who charge less provide questionable service, generally, and perhaps find different ways to charge fees. There can be a lot of liability involved (as evidenced by my insurance premiums) as well as actual work, so I really do question firms that charge basement fees. > [@SeanArenas](#): > > **acsenray** , you point out in point 4 that business don’t register because they’re no point. One point might be so that it’s easy for other people to make sure they aren’t accidentally infringing you. It would suck for two people to accidentally be using a very, very similar mark because neither registered. Maybe both checked, but didn’t bother to register. Just wondering. I’m of the opinion that it’s best to go through with the trademark, especially if one conducts a majority of business on the internet. I’ve had several clients become an overnight sensation. My company’s policy is to trademark everything, because the theory essentially boils down to “you never know.” ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2009, 3:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-business-has-a-logo-do-i-need-to-copyright-it-or-something/491783/23 "2009-04-03T15:50:24Z")
> [@SeanArenas](#): > > However, other people called then NetBooks (review sites, forums, etc.) and apparently the company moved to sue, etc. Just a further point here. It would be futile for them to sue review sites, forums, etc., for using the term “netbook” in a generic sense. A trademark holder does not have rights to prevent the general public from using a mark generically. They can write whiny letters, but they have no cause of action. Using a term in a review is not “use in commerce,” so it can’t be infringing. They only have the right to prevent people from using their trademark as an indicator of the origin of goods or services in a confusing manner. ---
**Author:** ![First\_Amongst\_Daves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/4491bb/32.png) [@First\_Amongst\_Daves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/First_Amongst_Daves)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2009, 6:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-business-has-a-logo-do-i-need-to-copyright-it-or-something/491783/24 "2009-04-04T06:42:49Z")
> [@acsenray](#): > > 1. You should consult an actual trademark lawyer to find out if you really need to register and what you need to register for. > > 2. A logo can be subject to both copyright law and trademark law. If it’s an original, creative work, then you can prevent anyone from using it in a manner that infringes your rights under the Copyright Act. If you are using it as an identifier of the source of goods and services then you can prevent anyone from using it in a manner that infringes your rights under state and federal trademark/consumer protection/unfair business practices laws. > > 3. Your rights in a trademark derive from “use in commerce.” In order to register, you have to prove that you have already accumulated (or that you intend to accumulate) such rights through use in commerce. > > 4. Your trademark rights are limited to the geographical area in which you offer your goods or services and in the specific line of business you are in. If you try to stop someone from using your mark, you have to show, among other things, that the other person (1) is using a mark that is confusingly similar to yours, (2) in your geographic area, (3) in your line of business. A lot of local businesses don’t bother to register their marks, because there’s no point, unless a direct competitor sets up essentially next door with the same name or logo. > > 5. Whether or not you register your mark, you can stop someone from using a similar mark in a manner that causes customer confusion. In both cases, you might have to take private legal action. There’s no “trademark police” that will step in and do it for you. It will howveer be raised as a citation by the USPTO examiners against subsequently applied for marks which are identical or substantially similar. So it does have a slight inherently defensive nature. You should definitely consult with an attorney on this. There are lots of aspects including what to do with the mark if you are exporting the goods or services, in relation to overseas protection. Just make sure you get someone with a track record - I have been fooled before by referring work to people who say they know what they’re doing only to find out they are patent litigators with no TM expertise. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-business-has-a-logo-do-i-need-to-copyright-it-or-something/491783.md?page=1)