# My husband gives his life to you and this is how you pay him? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [October 29, 2002, 1:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-husband-gives-his-life-to-you-and-this-is-how-you-pay-him/134396 "2002-10-29T13:53:51Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2002, 3:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-husband-gives-his-life-to-you-and-this-is-how-you-pay-him/134396/41 "2002-10-31T15:15:44Z")
So, basically, Narile, you’re either waffling or admitting that > [@](#): > > Money in the government is always slow to arrive if you are not some congressmans or four stars pet project. And woe betide you if you are actually good at what you do, cause they will try their best to ruin you. is bullshit. In other words you posted malarkey, a lie. For one thing: The vast majority of people who serve in the Armed Forces get paid on time. Those who don’t have more than one way of getting it fixed. There are the odd occasions where some incompetent gums up the works. However to state that the government’s out to ruin the Airman because he’s “not some congressmans [sic] or four stars [sic] pet project” is flat out bullshit. ---
**Author:** ![Sgt.J](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ec9cab/32.png) [@Sgt.J](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sgt.J)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2002, 4:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-husband-gives-his-life-to-you-and-this-is-how-you-pay-him/134396/42 "2002-10-31T16:16:22Z")
**Catstix** If you’re making 20K a year and have agreed to lay down your life as part of your job requirements I’ll add you to the Military/Fire Fighter/Police/ (insert job here)/ list. If not, these people are MORE deserving of being paid on time. They risk their lives **for the rest of us** for a pittance, they deserve AT LEAST to be paid on time. ---
**Author:** ![Gala\_Matrix\_Fire](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/4da419/32.png) [@Gala\_Matrix\_Fire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gala_Matrix_Fire)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2002, 8:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-husband-gives-his-life-to-you-and-this-is-how-you-pay-him/134396/43 "2002-10-31T20:01:07Z")
Well, you can be reassured that, should the worst happen and your husband lose his life in the service of his country, your friends and neighbors will console you with loving words such as, “That’s what he got paid for.” Because as you know, while civilians are always “innocent,” military personnel are all expendable. ---
**Author:** ![catsix](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e19b73/32.png) [@catsix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/catsix)\ **Post date:** [November 1, 2002, 12:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-husband-gives-his-life-to-you-and-this-is-how-you-pay-him/134396/44 "2002-11-01T00:45:45Z")
Hey, **Sgt. J** and **Gorgon Heap** : Up yours. I work hard for long hours and am just as fucking entitled to my pay as anybody else who earns their money. Who the fuck are you to tell me it’s not as big a deal if I can’t afford to eat because someone marked the wrong box on a time sheet? What’s your problem with the fact that people who work deserve to be paid for their work on their scheduled pay day and that being in the military doesn’t have any bearing on how much someone _deserves to have_ the money they earned _exactly when they’re scheduled to get it_? Do you think that if someone’s not in the military they can’t get evicted or be starving or hell, in my case be unable to afford the medicine that keeps them alive? Do you consider me a lesser person than you because I have a ‘civilian’ job? Because if that’s your attitude, I can tell you right now, I’m glad there are people who do the job you do, but telling me that I’m less entitled to being paid on time is being a jackass. ---
**Author:** ![Narile](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/71c47a/32.png) [@Narile](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Narile)\ **Post date:** [November 1, 2002, 1:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-husband-gives-his-life-to-you-and-this-is-how-you-pay-him/134396/45 "2002-11-01T01:38:34Z")
Since your reading comprehension is so poor **Monty** I will explain it to you in little words that you can understand. If you are good at what you do, the people up above will do their best to ruin you since it rocks the boat with regards to all those large glamourous projects that soak up funds and produce very little results. If however your current project is a 4star or congressmans baby, he can force the issue and actually get results money wise for you. This is because they can rock the boat worse if they are denied. But when your current project isn’t said congressman/generals baby, forget it. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [November 1, 2002, 2:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-husband-gives-his-life-to-you-and-this-is-how-you-pay-him/134396/46 "2002-11-01T02:35:31Z")
That ain’t the way our military works, Narile. Had you any actual knowledge instead of the bile you’ve been spouting in this thread, you would know that. ---
**Author:** ![MsRobyn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/90ced4/32.png) [@MsRobyn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MsRobyn)\ **Post date:** [November 1, 2002, 2:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-husband-gives-his-life-to-you-and-this-is-how-you-pay-him/134396/47 "2002-11-01T02:35:52Z")
**catsix** , when your paycheck is screwed up, you have recourse. You can take it up with your payroll office and probably have a check cut quickly. If not, you can take it to the state labor commission, who can make your payroll office jump for fear of a hefty fine. Airman does not have those options. His paycheck is completely at the mercy of an employee who does not have any interest whatsoever in whether her work is accurate or not. He can’t take disputes to the state, or even to the congressman. His division chief had to step in and **force** the payroll office to take responsibility for their mistakes. That’s right. Nothing would get fixed without a lot of pressure from the unit. This isn’t bonus money, or an advance, or anything “extra”. This is money that is owed him under the terms of the contract that he signed with the Guard. Now the Guard essentially isn’t living up to its end of the contract. This is what Dave does, in exchange for his pay: [ul] [li]Goes to work from 7:45 am to 4 pm[/li][li]Occasionally flies late in the day, or overnight or for a weekend.[/li][li]Goes to his drill weekends once a month. He does not make extra pay for that. If his unit can spare him, he gets an extra day off.[/li][li]Attends training schools out of state **at the Guard’s convenience**. If he misses Christmas (as he did last year for basic training), too damn bad. Right now, he’s in the Cascade Mountains in Washington State, freezing his buns off to learn how to survive capture. [/li][li]He can’t call in sick. If he doesn’t feel well, he has to go to work, go to sick call, and hope he can be sent home. [/li][li]He may have to go to war. I don’t want him to go, and I don’t think he’s too crazy about the idea himself. But it’s what the Air Force does.[/li][li]He’s required to meet weight and physical standards. If he can’t, for whatever reason, out he goes.[/li][li]If he’s accepted into the regular Air Force, he can be sent to some pretty lousy places, with or without his family.[/li][/ul] Now, you may argue that Dave knew what he was getting into when he joined. And he did. He loves what he does, and he loves that he is serving his country and keeping us all safe. Everything he does, he does for about two grand a month, plus intangible benefits (like college tuition [assuming he can find the time to use it] and free healthcare for himself and his family). Mistakes happen. I’m willing to accept that. A bonus might not be paid when expected, or travel reimbursement might be slow in coming. But for God’s sake, he gives a lot to his unit. And for that, he deserves the courtesy of an accurate paycheck, paid on time and with no hassle. Robin ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [November 1, 2002, 3:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-husband-gives-his-life-to-you-and-this-is-how-you-pay-him/134396/48 "2002-11-01T03:32:51Z")
Actually, Robin, the civilian employee does have a vested interest in getting Airman’s pay correct. There have been civilian employees fired for dereliction and incompetence. And Airman does have recourse: the infamous chain-of-command referred to earlier. And if nobody decides they’re going to do the right thing, a well-placed call to the local Congressman will get people fired up in a hurry. Not to mention that everyone, regardless of for whom they work, deserves to get paid accurately and on time. ---
**Author:** ![catsix](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e19b73/32.png) [@catsix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/catsix)\ **Post date:** [November 1, 2002, 3:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-husband-gives-his-life-to-you-and-this-is-how-you-pay-him/134396/49 "2002-11-01T03:39:58Z")
> [@](#): > > **said Monty** > _Not to mention that everyone, regardless of for whom they work, deserves to get paid accurately and on time._ Exactly my point. Thank you, Monty. ---
**Author:** ![techchick68](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ea5d25/32.png) [@techchick68](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/techchick68)\ **Post date:** [November 1, 2002, 6:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-husband-gives-his-life-to-you-and-this-is-how-you-pay-him/134396/50 "2002-11-01T06:00:10Z")
> [@](#): > > Why should you care that my husband is in Washington State, freezing his ass off, learning to eat bugs so if he goes into combat for you, he’ll make it home? Your paychecks are correct each time, I bet. When the end of the fiscal year comes, and the unit is out of money, your checks aren’t short. You don’t have to worry about a thing! On the other hand, my husband has to pay for his meals and housing out of his own pocket, then put in his voucher. This costs real money. He’s still got a family to support, and this costs real money, too. And, I’m looking into WIC to make sure our baby has enough to eat. Robyn, while I am a civilian, I have lived in an area that is filled with military most all my life. This is life in the military sweetie, so what are you expecting? Red carpets and limosines? You know I am pro you but life in the military is less than pretty. I have yet to personally know a person in the military that gets good treatment. While I sound harsh, this is not my intent, this is reality. Your hubby went into the Air Force with good intentions and he deserves a godl star but overall, they are treated like shit unless they have many stars behind their name. What I am saying is, he will not have a great and productive life until after he is out of the AF…I know personally, I have many friends and ex boyfriends that are ex military and the benefits are great while in civilian life. The time spent in the military sucks but if you can keep the retirement time in mind, you can live quite well. Crap, one of my best friends was with the AF for 9 years and gets $800 a month from them. (PS remember that I live in a city that the largest employer is Ft. Carson, a huge army depot along with Peterson Field, Shriever AFB, NORAD, and the Air Force Academy.) ---
**Author:** ![Gorgon\_Heap](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/f475e1/32.png) [@Gorgon\_Heap](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gorgon_Heap)\ **Post date:** [November 1, 2002, 1:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-husband-gives-his-life-to-you-and-this-is-how-you-pay-him/134396/51 "2002-11-01T13:27:55Z")
**techchick** , she very well knows better, but that doesn’t mean she can’t get angry about the shit and blow off some steam in the Pit. That’s the point of the thread. **catsix** , while I hate to rip into a newbie, perhaps you should take a step back and think before you start spouting working-man’s rhetoric just to hear yourself speak. > [@](#): > > I don’t think anything close to civilians being less-deserving of on-time pay has been implied As I stated above, but you conveniently forget about that so you can insult us. Fine. I can live with that, because I actually know what the hell I’m talking about. [sub]So y’all regulars know, I’m not in a good mood.[/sub] ---
**Author:** ![flyboy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/4da419/32.png) [@flyboy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/flyboy)\ **Post date:** [November 1, 2002, 2:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-husband-gives-his-life-to-you-and-this-is-how-you-pay-him/134396/52 "2002-11-01T14:28:26Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by techchick68 \* > \*\*I have yet to personally know a person in the military that gets good treatment. **I can say the exact opposite. I know many, both enlisted and officers, who get great treatment.** > [@](#): > > overall, they are treated like shit unless they have many stars behind their name.\*\* Totally untrue.\*\* > [@](#): > > What I am saying is, he will not have a great and productive life until after he is out of the AF…I know personally,…\*\* And I can personally say that this is a load of bs. > [@](#): > > \*\*one of my best friends was with the AF for 9 years and gets $800 a month from them. \*\* I’m assuming this is either a severance or medical payout, and not really a benefit. You don’t get retirement after 9 years. **techchick** , I usually agree with your posts. This one’s an exception. ---
**Author:** ![catsix](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e19b73/32.png) [@catsix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/catsix)\ **Post date:** [November 1, 2002, 2:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-husband-gives-his-life-to-you-and-this-is-how-you-pay-him/134396/53 "2002-11-01T14:55:49Z")
> [@](#): > > **said Gorgon Heap:** > _I don’t think anything close to civilians being less-deserving of on-time pay has been implied_ It most certainly has, by this guy: > [@](#): > > **said Sgt. J** > \*Catstix If you’re making 20K a year and have agreed to lay down your life as part of your job requirements I’ll add you to the Military/Fire Fighter/Police/ (insert job here)/ list. If not, these people are MORE deserving of being paid on time. \* > [@](#): > > \*What little money they get, they are “more entitled to arrurate pay”, as are others serving the community for little pay at great risk like police and firefighters. \* So no, it wasn’t ‘anything close to civilians being less-deserving of on-time pay’ being implied. **It was directly stated.** I didn’t ‘conveniently forget’ shit. I said that every employee is deserving of getting paid their due pay **on time** , and someone’s not ‘more deserving’ of that than someone else because of what job they do. If you took my post as saying that **Airman** doesn’t deserve to get paid what he’s owed when he’s owed it, you’re mistaken. All I said that being in the military isn’t the reason that accurate and on-time pay is deserved. ---
**Author:** ![Gorgon\_Heap](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/f475e1/32.png) [@Gorgon\_Heap](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gorgon_Heap)\ **Post date:** [November 1, 2002, 3:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-husband-gives-his-life-to-you-and-this-is-how-you-pay-him/134396/54 "2002-11-01T15:22:22Z")
No, I agree with that. And I say \*\*Sgt. J/b’s post belatedly. Though this is the Pit, I don’t care to stir up trouble. If he(?) feels that way, that’s all on him. That’s not my stance. ---
**Author:** ![catsix](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e19b73/32.png) [@catsix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/catsix)\ **Post date:** [November 1, 2002, 3:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-husband-gives-his-life-to-you-and-this-is-how-you-pay-him/134396/55 "2002-11-01T15:30:28Z")
**Gorgon Heap** Then I retract the ‘Up yours’ that I directed at you. Honestly, I am not posting ‘working man’s’ rhetoric just so that I can hear myself speak. I believe that EVERYONE who’s working for their living deserves to be paid on time, and I think that **Airman’s** got every right to chew the people who have been screwing him a new asshole for it. He’s entitled to the money he makes, and to be truthful, military people are not getting paid enough for the jobs they do. Please, please don’t think that I’m a ‘shit on the military’ type of person who thinks that the men and women who serve bitch needlessly. My family’s got a long military history, many of my friends are or were military, and I would’ve gone but they wouldn’t take me because of my auto-immune problem. ---
**Author:** ![Narile](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/71c47a/32.png) [@Narile](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Narile)\ **Post date:** [November 1, 2002, 3:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-husband-gives-his-life-to-you-and-this-is-how-you-pay-him/134396/56 "2002-11-01T15:34:24Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by flyboy88 \* > \*\*I can say the exact opposite. I know many, both enlisted and officers, who get great treatment \*\* A lot of it depends on who you have as a commanding officer, and the groupd you work for. ---
**Author:** ![Narile](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/71c47a/32.png) [@Narile](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Narile)\ **Post date:** [November 1, 2002, 3:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-husband-gives-his-life-to-you-and-this-is-how-you-pay-him/134396/57 "2002-11-01T15:37:22Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Monty \* > \*\*That ain’t the way our military works, Narile. Had you any actual knowledge instead of the bile you’ve been spouting in this thread, you would know that. \*\* I do know how the military works **Monty** As I earlier pointed out, my brother was a Naval aviator, my father retired a Lt.Col, and both my parents still work for the DoD as civil servants. You want to claim they don’t know how it works, you take it up with them, and the get ready to look for your ass. ---
**Author:** ![Narile](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/71c47a/32.png) [@Narile](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Narile)\ **Post date:** [November 1, 2002, 3:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-husband-gives-his-life-to-you-and-this-is-how-you-pay-him/134396/58 "2002-11-01T15:39:29Z")
Oh, and I work as a contractor for the DoD as well. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [November 1, 2002, 7:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-husband-gives-his-life-to-you-and-this-is-how-you-pay-him/134396/59 "2002-11-01T19:30:37Z")
So basically you’re going off of hearsay whilst I’m going off of actual experience. Thanks for the “enlightenment.” ---
**Author:** ![In\_Conceivable](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/4bbf92/32.png) [@In\_Conceivable](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/In_Conceivable)\ **Post date:** [November 1, 2002, 7:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-husband-gives-his-life-to-you-and-this-is-how-you-pay-him/134396/60 "2002-11-01T19:57:13Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by catsix \* > \*\*Hey, **Sgt. J** and **Gorgon Heap** : Up yours. > > I work hard for long hours and am just as fucking entitled to my pay as anybody else who earns their money. > > Who the fuck are you to tell me it’s not as big a deal if I can’t afford to eat because someone marked the wrong box on a time sheet? > > What’s your problem with the fact that people who work deserve to be paid for their work on their scheduled pay day and that being in the military doesn’t have any bearing on how much someone _deserves to have_ the money they earned _exactly when they’re scheduled to get it_? > > Do you think that if someone’s not in the military they can’t get evicted or be starving or hell, in my case be unable to afford the medicine that keeps them alive? Do you consider me a lesser person than you because I have a ‘civilian’ job? Because if that’s your attitude, I can tell you right now, I’m glad there are people who do the job you do, but telling me that I’m less entitled to being paid on time is being a jackass. \*\* You don’t get it **catsix**. If your employer doesn’t pay you then you can quit your job and work for someone who will. If someone in the military doesn’t get paid they can’t quit their job. **Airman** has to keep working if they pay him or not. He will be locked up if he doesn’t go to work. The government forces him to keep his end of his contract so they should have a higher duty to keep their end. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-husband-gives-his-life-to-you-and-this-is-how-you-pay-him/134396.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-husband-gives-his-life-to-you-and-this-is-how-you-pay-him/134396.md?page=4)