# My neighbor seems to despise me **URL:** \ **Category:** The Quarantine Zone\ **Tags:** covid-quarantine\ **Created:** [December 29, 2020, 2:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-neighbor-seems-to-despise-me/929177 "2020-12-29T14:36:18Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Moris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/moris/32/2846_2.png) [@Moris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Moris)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2020, 12:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-neighbor-seems-to-despise-me/929177/21 "2020-12-30T00:23:40Z")
Are you absolutely sure this is about the mask? He’s your neighbor. Perhaps your dog peed on his lawn, or you had a noisy birthday party last night? ---
**Author:** ![Bootb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e19b73/32.png) [@Bootb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bootb)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2020, 12:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-neighbor-seems-to-despise-me/929177/22 "2020-12-30T00:33:31Z")
> [@kayT](#): > > Yes. I think the amount of judginess that this virus has brought out is quite amazing. And discouraging. You’re just now learning about human nature? ---
**Author:** ![nelliebly](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/nelliebly/32/5422_2.png) [@nelliebly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nelliebly)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2020, 1:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-neighbor-seems-to-despise-me/929177/23 "2020-12-30T01:06:01Z")
For months, I didn’t wear a mask when walking outside because if I saw others coming toward me, I crossed the street. I started wearing a mask because it makes others feel more secure. I’m so used to wearing onenow that there’s no reason _not_ to wear one. I agree with the others that you’re making a BIG assumption here in thinking it’s about masks. You have no idea why he’s sneering…IF he’s sneering. Maybe that’s just his face (Bless his heart.). ---
**Author:** ![Roger\_That](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/roger_that/32/8505_2.png) [@Roger\_That](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Roger_That)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2020, 10:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-neighbor-seems-to-despise-me/929177/24 "2020-12-30T10:26:36Z")
No, it’s a small assumption. He consistently ignores (doesn’t return) my friendly gestures, (handwaving, nodding, eye contact) but consistently dons his own mask while shaking his head disapprovingly (broadly from side to side, as opposed to my greeting of up and down). Even if I’m reading him wrong, though, there ARE those who try to communicate their disapproval of non-mask-wearers. I’ve even been one of them on occasion–fact is, I almost got into a fistfight, my first in many years, with a declared non-wearer at a nature-preserve last month. (It started pouring so we got trapped in a tiny gazebo, where I asked him if he minded wearing the mask that was hanging around his neck, under his chin, and we almost came to blows) (!) In both situations, it seemed ironic that the only communication that could (and in the latter example, did) clarify the objector’s thinking was to have a conversation which is, of course, not recommended with a non-mask-wearer, so all verbal communication is out. ---
**Author:** ![Dinsdale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/97f17d/32.png) [@Dinsdale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dinsdale)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2020, 4:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-neighbor-seems-to-despise-me/929177/25 "2020-12-30T16:37:31Z")
Only you can assess the full situation. But there’s a guy who lives across the street and a couple of doors down from me. Multiple neighbors have described him as “the cranky guy.” After failed to respond to a couple of my attempts at “Hey, neighbor!”, I adopted the same assessment. Some people are just like that. So long as he maintains his property, is quiet, and doesn’t otherwise bother me, I can live just fine w/o his smile and wave. ---
**Author:** ![Ranch\_Dip](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ranch_dip/32/5238_2.png) [@Ranch\_Dip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ranch_Dip)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2020, 7:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-neighbor-seems-to-despise-me/929177/26 "2020-12-30T19:41:56Z")
> [@kayT](#): > > Yes. I think the amount of judginess that this virus has brought out is quite amazing. And discouraging. I think the amount of selfishness and non caring for your neighbors that this has revealed is shocking and disappointing. ---
**Author:** ![Duckster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/duckster/32/1244_2.png) [@Duckster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duckster)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2020, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-neighbor-seems-to-despise-me/929177/27 "2020-12-30T19:56:56Z")
Carry a mask and ignore him. Life is too short to be concerned about something that may not even exist. ---
**Author:** ![thorny\_locust](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thorny_locust/32/431_2.png) [@thorny\_locust](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thorny_locust)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2020, 9:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-neighbor-seems-to-despise-me/929177/28 "2020-12-30T21:23:55Z")
> [@Roger\_That](#): > > it’s a small assumption. He consistently ignores (doesn’t return) my friendly gestures, (handwaving, nodding, eye contact) but consistently dons his own mask while shaking his head disapprovingly (broadly from side to side, as opposed to my greeting of up and down). Even if I’m reading him wrong, though, It would be so, so easy to settle this question. Just carry a mask with you, and when you see him coming, put your mask on. If he continues to glare at you, it’s something else (at least, unless you’re glaring at him while you put it on.) If he looks much happier, then yes, he wants you to wear a mask when you’re near him. In which case, wear a mask when you’re near him. You may think you’re not near enough to matter, and you may even be right; but you have no idea what risk category he’s in; plus which, isn’t the nuisance of putting a mask on for two minutes worth it to make your neighbor comfortable? ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2020, 12:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-neighbor-seems-to-despise-me/929177/29 "2020-12-31T00:19:44Z")
What Thorny Locust said. First, the whole “six feet” thing turns out to have been wrong. It was based on the assumption that the virus is spread by large droplets that fall out of the air rapidly (so don’t travel more than 6 feet) and the evidence at this point is pretty strong that it is actually carried (mostly) by much smaller droplets, that can build up and linger in the air. It’s probably better to think of the risk as being like the “risk” of smelling your neighbor’s cigarette smoke than of being a six foot radius. Second, masks reduce the amount of virus you spread into the communal air. Yeah, obviously, if you never get close to anyone, it doesn’t really matter whether you are exhaling virus like a champ or not. But if you are walking directly in someone’s exhaust stream, there is some risk to you – just as if you were walking well behind a smoker, but happened to be walking through the lingering smoke. And odds are you are making your neighbor anxious. Why do stuff that makes others anxious, and might possibly put them at risk? Just wear a mask and don’t worry about it. Or carry one, and put it on if you see anyone. FWIW, I don’t wear a mask doing yardwork on my property (except for a week during the peak pollen season, when I did) but I don a mask every time I step off my property. I wear a light, comfy mask if I am just walking around the neighborhood, and a serious N90 mask with a silicone seal if I’m actually planning to be close to people, or in a place where people have been lingering, like going grocery shopping. Most of the time when I’m wearing that light mask, I’m not anywhere near anyone else. In fact, typically there’s not another person in sight. But heck, it gives me a little protection against the guy who walked down this road a minute before me, and it gives a lot of protection to the person walking after me. And it doesn’t cost me anything more than a tiny extra item in the washing machine. ---
**Author:** ![Melbourne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b5e925/32.png) [@Melbourne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Melbourne)\ **Post date:** [January 1, 2021, 5:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-neighbor-seems-to-despise-me/929177/30 "2021-01-01T17:24:58Z")
> [@puzzlegal](#): > > First, the whole “six feet” thing turns out to have been wrong. It was based on the assumption that the virus is spread by large droplets that fall out of the air rapidly (so don’t travel more than 6 feet) and the evidence at this point is pretty strong that it is actually carried (mostly) by much smaller droplets, that can build up and linger in the air. It’s probably better to think of the risk as being like the “risk” of smelling your neighbor’s cigarette smoke than of being a six foot radius. > > Second, masks reduce the amount of virus you spread into the communal air. Thirdly, the whole mask thing is based on the assumption that the virus is spread by large droplets, that can be masked out … It’s probably better to think of the risk as being like the “risk” of smelling your neighbors cigarette smoke than of something a mask can contain. ---
**Author:** ![DMC](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dmc/32/18049_2.png) [@DMC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DMC)\ **Post date:** [January 1, 2021, 6:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-neighbor-seems-to-despise-me/929177/31 "2021-01-01T18:12:21Z")
> [@Melbourne](#): > > Thirdly, the whole mask thing is based on the assumption that the virus is spread by large droplets, that can be masked out Are you making the claim that masks are ineffective against COVID-19? I’m finding it hard to read that any other way. ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [January 1, 2021, 11:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-neighbor-seems-to-despise-me/929177/32 "2021-01-01T23:35:50Z")
> [@Melbourne](#): > > > [@puzzlegal](#): > > > > First, the whole “six feet” thing turns out to have been wrong. It was based on the assumption that the virus is spread by large droplets that fall out of the air rapidly (so don’t travel more than 6 feet) and the evidence at this point is pretty strong that it is actually carried (mostly) by much smaller droplets, that can build up and linger in the air. It’s probably better to think of the risk as being like the “risk” of smelling your neighbor’s cigarette smoke than of being a six foot radius. > > > > Second, masks reduce the amount of virus you spread into the communal air. > > Thirdly, the whole mask thing is based on the assumption that the virus is spread by large droplets, that can be masked out … It’s probably better to think of the risk as being like the “risk” of smelling your neighbors cigarette smoke than of something a mask can contain. Not true. The whole mask thing is based on the observed effects of masks in reducing spread. Also, just like a stack of chain link fences will stop water from spraying through them, despite the fact that a water drop can easily get through, all sorts of filters reduce the amount of tiny particles that you leak into the room at large. ---
**Author:** ![Melbourne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b5e925/32.png) [@Melbourne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Melbourne)\ **Post date:** [January 1, 2021, 11:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-neighbor-seems-to-despise-me/929177/33 "2021-01-01T23:58:38Z")
> [@puzzlegal](#): > > Not true. The whole mask thing is based on the observed effects of masks in reducing spread. Here’s what the Mayo clinic website has to say: **Surgical masks** Also called a medical mask, a surgical mask is a loose-fitting disposable mask that protects the wearer’s nose and mouth from contact with droplets, splashes and sprays that may contain germs. A surgical mask also filters out large particles in the air." **Cloth masks** A cloth mask is intended to trap droplets that are released when the wearer talks, coughs or sneezes. = = = = I’d call COVID “extremely infective”, except that I’m not sure those words have any meaning. I don’t discount droplet transmission or surface transmission just because they are known to be not the only forms of transmission. Droplet transmission may not be the most significant form of transmission: if so, masking to prevent it may not be the most significant protection. I have not read the numbers about the observed effects of masks in reducing spread, so anybody with links please post as reply. ---
**Author:** ![DMC](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dmc/32/18049_2.png) [@DMC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DMC)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2021, 12:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-neighbor-seems-to-despise-me/929177/34 "2021-01-02T00:10:22Z")
> [@Melbourne](#): > > Here’s what the Mayo clinic website has to say: In the year 2021 we’re still debating this? Seriously? It would have been nice of you to post the link to the Mayo cite you provided. This appears to be your source: > **[Can face masks protect against COVID-19?](https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/coronavirus/in-depth/coronavirus-mask/art-20485449)** > > Face masks can help slow the spread of coronavirus disease 2019 (COVID-19). Learn about mask types, which masks to use and how to use them. It would also have been nice if you had read the first paragraph in that cite you quoted: > Can face masks help slow the spread of the coronavirus (SARS-CoV-2) that causes COVID-19? Yes, face masks combined with other preventive measures, such as frequent hand-washing and social distancing, help slow the spread of the virus. Seriously? ---
**Author:** ![Melbourne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b5e925/32.png) [@Melbourne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Melbourne)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2021, 12:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-neighbor-seems-to-despise-me/929177/35 "2021-01-02T00:47:31Z")
You apparently want to debate the wisdom of face masks, not cite their effectiveness, nor acknowledge their mode of action. I don’t apologize for having a wider interest, nor for pointing out the obvious contradiction in the post I replied to. ---
**Author:** ![DMC](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dmc/32/18049_2.png) [@DMC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DMC)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2021, 12:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-neighbor-seems-to-despise-me/929177/36 "2021-01-02T00:55:31Z")
> [@Melbourne](#): > > You apparently want to debate the wisdom of face masks, not cite their effectiveness, nor acknowledge their mode of action. I have no desire to debate the wisdom of face masks, as I don’t consider it to be particularly debatable at this point. On the other hand, I’m perfectly willing to make myself aware of which posters consider mask wearing extremely ineffective, for the sake of future reference. ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2021, 12:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-neighbor-seems-to-despise-me/929177/37 "2021-01-02T00:57:28Z")
Here’s a very wide-ranging article on the subject. [https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-020-02801-8](https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-020-02801-8) You can cherry pick it and find that it says evidence is imperfect, which is completely true. You can also find a lot of cites of observational and other studies showing masks appear to help. ---
**Author:** ![SayTwo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e56c9b/32.png) [@SayTwo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SayTwo)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2021, 7:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-neighbor-seems-to-despise-me/929177/38 "2021-01-02T07:49:01Z")
> [@puzzlegal](#): > > You can also find a lot of cites of observational and other studies showing masks appear to help. Can one also find a lot of observational studies showing masks appear not to help? ---
**Author:** ![Heffalump\_and\_Roo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/heffalump_and_roo/32/7691_2.png) [@Heffalump\_and\_Roo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Heffalump_and_Roo)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2021, 11:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-neighbor-seems-to-despise-me/929177/39 "2021-01-02T11:41:39Z")
> [@Roger\_That](#): > > No, it’s a small assumption. He consistently ignores (doesn’t return) my friendly gestures, (handwaving, nodding, eye contact) but consistently dons his own mask while shaking his head disapprovingly (broadly from side to side, as opposed to my greeting of up and down). You’re giving out mixed signals. You’re indicating to your neighbor that you want to engage by making gestures yet you’re making it risky to do so by not wearing a mask. If you don’t want to engage, don’t communicate with your neighbor. If you want to engage, put on a mask. Your neighbor can’t tell you what he wants, so he’s trying to communicate with his eyes, or at least that’s what I’d be doing. But you’re giving me some ideas of some hand gestures that might communicate what I want. But they may be misinterpreted. ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2021, 1:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-neighbor-seems-to-despise-me/929177/40 "2021-01-02T13:10:05Z")
> [@SayTwo](#): > > > [@puzzlegal](#): > > > > You can also find a lot of cites of observational and other studies showing masks appear to help. > > Can one also find a lot of observational studies showing masks appear not to help? Read the link i posted. There aren’t any controlled studies because they would be ethically inappropriate. (“There are no controlled studies of the efficacy of parachutes”) but the gist is that the experts who have studied this all believe masks help, based on the available evidence. Of course we have decades of experience of surgeons wearing masks to protect their patients from infection. There probably aren’t controlled studies there, either, but enough medical professionals believe it that every person in the operating theater always wears a mask. That, of course, has been the belief that masks reduce spread-from, not infection-to. But on a population basis, reducing spread-from makes a huge difference. The surprisingly low impact of the black lives matter rallies on covid spread, which had been extensively studied, was the first real data in favor of the efficacy of random cloth masks. There’s one unpublished study where some participants were urged to wear masks and given masks and others weren’t. The authors say they aren’t prepared to release results, yet. Given that people in both groups listened to the same media, and could buy masks, i wonder how different the behavior of the two groups would have been. But it hasn’t been published. There are several studies looking at rate of spread in counties with and without mask rules, in various places, and those point to benefits from masks. I’m pretty sure there was an observational study allowing that people who claimed to have worn make were less likely to catch it. If course, those people were generally more cautious in other ways, too. (Attend fewer gatherings, washing hands). That’s a confounding factor in the “country” studies, too. There’s the animal study with surgical masks places between cages (or not), showing a large benefit. Of course, on real life masks leak around the edges. But there are also small human studies looking at how much masks actually leak, and they show that mostly masks actually do contain a lot of aerosols, as well as larger particles. So… No one clear killer study. But a lot of evidence supporting the idea that masks work, along with theory supporting it. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-neighbor-seems-to-despise-me/929177.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-neighbor-seems-to-despise-me/929177.md?page=3)