# my odd notion: negative poll tax **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [May 3, 2019, 1:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-odd-notion-negative-poll-tax/833403 "2019-05-03T01:24:53Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 11\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2019, 8:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-odd-notion-negative-poll-tax/833403/41 "2019-05-03T20:01:51Z")
I seem to remember a song about John Brown. ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2019, 10:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-odd-notion-negative-poll-tax/833403/42 "2019-05-03T22:05:26Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > 😕 Really? How about > [ul][li] The 74 year-old woman in Pennsylvania who has been voting for decades, but is no longer able to vote. Her birth certificate contains a misspelling so she can’t get photo ID. After she and her grandson spend two days and two tanks of gasoline trying to fix this, she’s told to try again next week.[/li][li] John J. Brown, a resident of South Carolina who is turned away on Election Day, because he might be the John J. Brown registered in Kansas, and be trying to vote twice. “Should’a checked your mail, boy.”[/li][li] A student in Texas who is turned away because her government-university issued student ID isn’t valid for voting, though gun permits _are_ valid for voting.[/li][li] Voters at an urban precinct in Ohio who have to wait in queue for _hours_ to use a voting machine, while suburban voters have no wait.[/li][li] Et cetera.[/li][/ul] > In previous threads you have sided with the Republican Party, IIRC. Are you now renouncing that allegiance? Suppressing the votes mentioned above is the absolutely central theme of their party platform. I am not in 100% agreement with any party or person. Not even myself some days. ---
**Author:** ![I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/i_love_me_vol.i/32/521_2.png) [@I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/I_Love_Me_Vol.I)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2019, 11:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-odd-notion-negative-poll-tax/833403/43 "2019-05-03T23:49:52Z")
> [@Jasmine](#): > > Rather than punishment, how about a reward? If someone registers and then votes, they get set deduction on their income tax like, say, a thousand dollar deduction. That’s a big incentive. Problem: wealthy people don’t need the money. How ya gonna get the GOPies on board? ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2019, 8:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-odd-notion-negative-poll-tax/833403/44 "2019-05-04T08:23:27Z")
BTW, one “feature” of the Kansas Crosscheck Voter Suppression Program is that [Blacks tend to have common surnames](https://names.mongabay.com/data/black.html). 38% (514,000) of the Joneses in the U.S. Census are black, as are 34% (477,000) of the Browns, and a whopping 53% (353,000) of the Jacksons. Thus the very algorithm that senses spurious ‘duplicates’ also zeros in on blacks. This malicious software also does a good job of screwing Asians, who also tend to vote Democratic —There are over a million Americans, almost all of them Asian, with one of the seven surnames: Nguyen, Kim, Patel, Tran, Chen, Wong, Yang. As I mentioned, voter suppression, [like the pernicious Crosscheck system](https://publicintegrity.org/accountability/america-scrubs-millions-from-the-voter-rolls-is-it-fair/), to tilt the electorate and make it easier to steal from the public has become the _central tenet_ of the Republican Party. I’d like to hear stronger denunciations than “I am not in 100% agreement” with the GOP. > [@eschereal](#): > > I seem to remember a song about John Brown. Do you mean [this John Brown](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bSSn3NddwFQ) ? I’m proud of my collateral descent from this heroic martyr, and to think that some of the black Browns adopted a surname to commemorate him. However that prize goes to Washington: 90% (147,000) of the Washingtons in the U.S. Census are black! TL;DR: Yes, making it easier to vote is a good idea. But let’s first concentrate on ridding ourselves of the deliberate efforts by the Republican Party to make it _much harder to vote._ ---
**Author:** ![Anny\_Middon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/bc79bd/32.png) [@Anny\_Middon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anny_Middon)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2019, 5:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-odd-notion-negative-poll-tax/833403/45 "2019-05-04T17:27:58Z")
> [@Shoeless](#): > > What they need to do is move Election Day from Tuesday to Sunday, so that (many) people don’t need to try to arrange time off of work to go vote. Plus, they could set up polling places in or near churches so that people can hit the polls before or after church. But of course we all know that anything that improves voter turnout is going to get snuffed by the GOP, because they know they can’t win an election that isn’t rigged somehow. I worked as an election judge the last two elections. The polling place I was assigned to was a church. We were pretty slow at the election in April and I spent a few minutes talking to the pastor of the church. I’m pretty sure they wouldn’t agree to be a polling place on a Sunday. They are happy to provide their facilities on a Tuesday even though it’s kind of a hassle for them – they see it as supporting their community. But on Sundays they need that space for their regular church activities. My own idea, which unfortunately is virtually impossible to enforce, is to make voting a requirement for complaining about what your government is doing. You want to publicly express your opinion about the invasion of whatever country, or how your taxes are used, or your town’s building codes, or whatever, then show that you voted. If you can’t, then STFU. ---
**Author:** ![UltraVires](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ecccb3/32.png) [@UltraVires](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UltraVires)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2019, 11:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-odd-notion-negative-poll-tax/833403/46 "2019-05-05T11:21:21Z")
I’ve never understood this push for compulsory voting. If you do not care enough to vote, forcing you to vote will not make you more informed on the issues and elect better candidates. Frustrated people who are forced to vote will either turn in blank ballots, draw little rectangle designs on the bubble forms or vote for the convicted felon joke candidate. Further, rights and freedoms are both positive and negative. The First Amendment doesn’t mandate that I speak, go to church, or print something. The Second does not require I own a gun. The Fourth doesn’t prevent me from allowing a search of my house. The Fifth doesn’t prevent me from waiving a right to indictment and the Sixth doesn’t prevent me from waiving a jury trial or representing myself. If I qualify for food stamps, I don’t have to sign up for them, nor do I have to play at the public park the city allows me to use. I doubt it would be Constitutional as it is forced servitude merely for living and being of voting age. Unlike the draft and jury service, it has no deeply rooted common law tradition. ---
**Author:** ![thorny\_locust](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thorny_locust/32/431_2.png) [@thorny\_locust](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thorny_locust)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2019, 2:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-odd-notion-negative-poll-tax/833403/47 "2019-05-05T14:17:41Z")
It occurs to me that there’s a problem with Sunday (or Saturday) voting, even if set up in secular locations: members of some religious groups won’t do secular business on the Sabbath. This covers a lot less of the population than it used to; but it still seems to me unfair, and might well be unconstitutional, to prevent these people from voting. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2019, 2:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-odd-notion-negative-poll-tax/833403/48 "2019-05-05T14:52:26Z")
So make “Voting Day” Saturday _and_ Sunday. Even aside from those folks with a religious objection, that’d be good practice anyway, to make it more accessible to people who have other scheduling conflicts with one of those days. ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2019, 3:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-odd-notion-negative-poll-tax/833403/49 "2019-05-05T15:14:39Z")
> [@UltraVires](#): > > I’ve never understood this push for compulsory voting. If you do not care enough to vote, forcing you to vote will not make you more informed on the issues and elect better candidates. Frustrated people who are forced to vote will either turn in blank ballots, draw little rectangle designs on the bubble forms or vote for the convicted felon joke candidate. You don’t have to guess. There’s a modern western country, Australia, that has compulsory voting. AFAIK, they do have a couple extra joke parties but they aren’t getting 30-40% spoiled ballots and convicted felon votes. ---
**Author:** ![penultima\_thule](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/penultima_thule/32/3833_2.png) [@penultima\_thule](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/penultima_thule)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2019, 4:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-odd-notion-negative-poll-tax/833403/50 "2019-05-07T04:07:16Z")
> [@Oakminster](#): > > Horrible idea. Frankly, artificially increased voter participation is not a good thing. People that don’t care enough to vote of their own volition are likely low information voters that will vote for whoever is favored by their church/social group/people that drive them to the polls. Pick your poison, artificially increased voter participation vs artificially decreased voter participation. Would you accept the notion that the former is a damm sight better on any number of levels than the second? 'Cause I’m not certain there is any basis for the claim that the “low information voter” will cast less considered ballots than those cast by the perpetually rusted on, “will always vote the way my granddaddy voted” demographic. Mandatory enrolment and voting as conducted on this side of the puddle works because exhaustive efforts are made to ensure it is as easy as practical to do so. You can vote at any polling booth in your home state. You can vote absentee at any polling in the country. The biggest single polling booth operating is the Australian embassy in London. From my patch in Sydney suburbia there are four polling stations within a 5 minute walk. If you are in hospital, a mobile polling station goes through the wards etc. You can vote early either in person or by post if on election day you: •are outside the electorate where you are enrolled to vote •are more than 8km from a polling place •are travelling •are unable to leave your workplace to vote •are seriously ill, infirm or due to give birth shortly (or caring for someone who is) •are a patient in hospital and can’t vote at the hospital •have religious beliefs that prevent you from attending a polling place •are in prison serving a sentence of less than three years or otherwise detained •are a silent elector •have a reasonable fear for your safety. Early voting centres operate from a month prior to a State or Federal election. Over 10% of the national electorate will use the option. Add in the postal votes and absentee votes and in some electorates a greater proportion of Australians vote pre-poll than might be expected to vote in the US mid-terms. ---
**Author:** ![Melbourne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b5e925/32.png) [@Melbourne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Melbourne)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2019, 9:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-odd-notion-negative-poll-tax/833403/51 "2019-05-08T21:41:09Z")
> [@kunilou](#): > > My freedom to vote for anyone without consequence includes my freedom to not vote for anyone without consequence. Line here in Aus: you don’t have to vote for anyone. You’re just supposed to get your name ticked off. Which you can do by turning up, or by signing a postal ballot envelope. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-odd-notion-negative-poll-tax/833403.md?page=2)