# My personal experience with mandatory Covid vaccinations **URL:** \ **Category:** The Quarantine Zone\ **Tags:** covid-quarantine\ **Created:** [September 10, 2021, 6:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-personal-experience-with-mandatory-covid-vaccinations/950473 "2021-09-10T18:03:08Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 9
**Author:** ![Gorsnak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gorsnak/32/7587_2.png) [@Gorsnak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gorsnak)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2021, 9:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-personal-experience-with-mandatory-covid-vaccinations/950473/162 "2021-10-07T21:20:34Z")
You are correct. Even professional riders can’t keep bicycles upright. Witness last weekend’s Paris Roubaix, for example: [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/yF-mFHk5Ve4/maxresdefault.jpg "COMPILATION CADUTE PARIGI ROUBAIX") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yF-mFHk5Ve4) ---
**Author:** ![nelliebly](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/nelliebly/32/5422_2.png) [@nelliebly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nelliebly)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2021, 3:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-personal-experience-with-mandatory-covid-vaccinations/950473/163 "2021-10-08T03:42:38Z")
> [@tofor](#): > > But the human body is complicated. Medicine and immunity is complicated. We don’t know what we don’t know until we learn it. Yep, complicated. And there are still things we don’t understand about it, but there are myriad functions and processes we understand thoroughly and with certainty. As a layperson, I understand less about them than scientists do, so until I learn and understand, its functions and processes might _seem_ more complex and unknowable than they actually are to scientists. mRNA and how it works are not unknowable. Scientists have been studying it since it was first isolated 60 years ago, so we _do_ understand thoroughly how it works. [Furthermore](https://ec.europa.eu/research-and-innovation/en/horizon-magazine/five-things-you-need-know-about-mrna-vaccine-safety), > Human trials of cancer vaccines using the same mRNA technology have been taking place since at least 2011. ‘If there was a real problem with the technology, we’d have seen it before now for sure,’ said Prof. Goldman. We’ve had 10 years’ experience with mRNA vaccines. That should be reassuring. ---
**Author:** ![EllisDee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ellisdee/32/4531_2.png) [@EllisDee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EllisDee)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2021, 1:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-personal-experience-with-mandatory-covid-vaccinations/950473/164 "2021-10-10T01:33:08Z")
> [@tofor](#): > > A video from Veritasium 8 months ago went through the various theories on how bicycles stay upright, and the experiments that show none of them is a full explanation: Fun video, thanks for sharing. My takeaway from that video is that the reason we don’t have a complete scientific theory for bicycles isn’t because it’s complicated, but rather that nobody cares. There’s no funding. The other takeaway I got from it is that the bicycle puzzle was fully solvable through just trial and error, and we successfully did that over a hundred years ago. No underlying theory required. Thus the lack of interest in funding research to uncover the theory. ---
**Author:** ![Kropotkin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kropotkin/32/18045_2.png) [@Kropotkin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kropotkin)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2021, 1:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-personal-experience-with-mandatory-covid-vaccinations/950473/165 "2021-10-10T01:56:32Z")
Is it worth noting that “nurse” is a big category that includes RNs with BSc degrees and care aids who may not have a high school diploma? And that practical nurses and care aids get paid badly, are overworked, and get no respect? All things that might make someone angry and hurt and ready to lash out, if in stupid, stupid, ways, like “asserting their autonomy” by not getting vaccinated. Not a justification, but when we create shitty jobs, people don’t become more reasonable and thoughtful ---
**Author:** ![BippityBoppityBoo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bippityboppityboo/32/5745_2.png) [@BippityBoppityBoo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BippityBoppityBoo)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2021, 3:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-personal-experience-with-mandatory-covid-vaccinations/950473/166 "2021-10-10T03:16:24Z")
> [@Kropotkin](#): > > Is it worth noting that “nurse” is a big category that includes RNs with BSc degrees and care aids who may not have a high school diploma? And that practical nurses and care aids get paid badly, are overworked, and get no respect? In the US the only people legally entitled to call themselves nurses are LPNs, with a year of specialized education and RNs, with anywhere from 2 years of community college to 4 years of college. The N in both LPN and RN represent ‘nurse’. If you don’t have the education and haven’t subsequently passed the appropriate licensing exam and gained licensure, you don’t get to represent yourself as a nurse, practical or otherwise. Aids can be anything from self-declared to CNAs, which in my state requires 40-80 hours of classroom and practical experience, then they can register with the state and become a Certified Nurses Aid. ---
**Author:** ![Kropotkin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kropotkin/32/18045_2.png) [@Kropotkin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kropotkin)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2021, 11:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-personal-experience-with-mandatory-covid-vaccinations/950473/167 "2021-10-10T11:47:56Z")
That is roughly true in BC as well, but people here may refer to all of the categories of work as “nurses,” even when technically incorrect. And while education is not a vaccination against ignorance, selfishness, or debilitating, unfocused anger, here very few of the anti-vaxxers with public profiles working in health care are RNs but rather people with fewer qualifications and troubled histories with the medical profession. My point is simply that marginalized, hurt people and people with economic insecurity are often less likely to make good decisions when they have the chance to assert some autonomy, leading them to take ridiculous and counter-productive stands. Such stands of course are not limited to such people, but their deprivation and anger make such people vulnerable. ---
**Author:** ![Tamerlane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tamerlane/32/7602_2.png) [@Tamerlane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tamerlane)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2021, 12:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-personal-experience-with-mandatory-covid-vaccinations/950473/168 "2021-10-10T12:13:16Z")
> [@BippityBoppityBoo](#): > > In the US the only people legally entitled to call themselves nurses are LPNs, with a year of specialized education and RNs, with anywhere from 2 years of community college to 4 years of college. The N in both LPN and RN represent ‘nurse’. Or higher - i.e. a nurse practitioner typically has a two year master’s degree on top of that (and many graduate programs require a minimum of two years work experience before admittance) up to a DNP ( Doctor of Nursing Practice, another year or three). Plus the panoply of other advanced nursing specialists or academic PhDs. Of course even a PhD (or MD for that matter) isn’t necessarily a perfect shield against irrationality. Humans being crazy and all. ---
**Author:** ![EllisDee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ellisdee/32/4531_2.png) [@EllisDee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EllisDee)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2021, 12:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-personal-experience-with-mandatory-covid-vaccinations/950473/169 "2021-10-10T12:25:48Z")
PhD is actually one of the big anti-vax demographics. Not in absolute numbers but by percentage. Has anyone formulated a hypothesis explaining that one? Seems weird to me. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2021, 1:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-personal-experience-with-mandatory-covid-vaccinations/950473/170 "2021-10-10T13:00:35Z")
PhD are easier to get now, as there are more institutions that offer them and they might be considered a stepping stone in some fields. Requirements for getting them almost certainly vary considerably from one institution to the next – my WAG anyway. ---
**Author:** ![Fretful\_Porpentine](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fretful_porpentine/32/2873_2.png) [@Fretful\_Porpentine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fretful_Porpentine)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2021, 1:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-personal-experience-with-mandatory-covid-vaccinations/950473/171 "2021-10-10T13:06:50Z")
> [@EllisDee](#): > > PhD is actually one of the big anti-vax demographics. Not in absolute numbers but by percentage. > > Has anyone formulated a hypothesis explaining that one? Seems weird to me. IIRC, this was based on a single survey, and people with PhDs are a small minority of the population, so it’s plausible that there could have been some sampling issues. ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2021, 1:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-personal-experience-with-mandatory-covid-vaccinations/950473/172 "2021-10-10T13:08:35Z")
> [@EllisDee](#): > > PhD is actually one of the big anti-vax demographics. Not in absolute numbers but by percentage. > > Has anyone formulated a hypothesis explaining that one? Seems weird to me. cite? I saw someone claim that on another forum, and it turned out his source was an anonymous internet poll in which people self-reported their educational status. That poll featured a lot of irregularities, like people reporting that their pronouns were “transgender is a made-up category”. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2021, 1:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-personal-experience-with-mandatory-covid-vaccinations/950473/173 "2021-10-10T13:09:20Z")
> [@Kropotkin](#): > > My point is simply that marginalized, hurt people and people with economic insecurity are often less likely to make good decisions when they have the chance to assert some autonomy, leading them to take ridiculous and counter-productive stands. Such stands of course are not limited to such people, but their deprivation and anger make such people vulnerable. The marginalized in many cases are also likely marginalized in no small part because they’re less educated, and being less educated in an economy that is increasingly complex and information-based makes them less competitive. Just to be clear, my point isn’t ‘They deserve to be poor,’ but there’s often a relationship between education and economic outcomes. But as one poster already remarked, there’s at least anecdotal evidence that vaccine resistance is a phenomenon that we’re seeing even among people with advanced levels of education. This is more baffling, but as I said earlier, I suspect that this is partly attributable to the democratization of advanced degrees. I also blame it on social media. It’s just easier to consume bad information these days. ---
**Author:** ![Fretful\_Porpentine](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fretful_porpentine/32/2873_2.png) [@Fretful\_Porpentine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fretful_Porpentine)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2021, 1:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-personal-experience-with-mandatory-covid-vaccinations/950473/174 "2021-10-10T13:20:45Z")
> [@puzzlegal](#): > > I saw someone claim that on another forum, and it turned out his source was an anonymous internet poll in which people self-reported their educational status. That poll featured a lot of irregularities, like people reporting that their pronouns were “transgender is a made-up category”. OK then, there were at least two surveys, because I think I just found [one of the original sources for this claim](https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.07.20.21260795v1.full.pdf), and there’s no question about pronouns on the survey (and the number of PhDs in the sample was way higher than I thought it would be, much too high for a few quirky people to skew the results). That said, some of the issues about self-reporting may still apply. ---
**Author:** ![Kimera757](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kimera757/32/3765_2.png) [@Kimera757](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimera757)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2021, 1:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-personal-experience-with-mandatory-covid-vaccinations/950473/175 "2021-10-10T13:24:46Z")
The information about this experience with mRNA vaccines should be spread. But who could spread that info to the vaccine hesitant? ---
**Author:** ![Tfletch1](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tfletch1/32/5340_2.png) [@Tfletch1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tfletch1)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2021, 1:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-personal-experience-with-mandatory-covid-vaccinations/950473/176 "2021-10-10T13:37:41Z")
Exactly. Even the authors of that poll found discrepancies suggesting dishonesty in the answers. > **[Fact check: Setting the record straight on claims about vaccine hesitancy...](https://www.wnct.com/news/north-carolina/fact-check-setting-the-record-straight-on-claims-about-vaccine-hesitancy-among-ph-d-s/)** > > The Ph.D. group does not include medical doctors or nurses. ---
**Author:** ![susan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/susan/32/17537_2.png) [@susan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/susan)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2021, 1:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-personal-experience-with-mandatory-covid-vaccinations/950473/177 "2021-10-10T13:42:20Z")
I read Medscape updates every day, an the comments by people who at least purport to be medical professionals are a very mixed bag. ---
**Author:** ![EllisDee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ellisdee/32/4531_2.png) [@EllisDee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EllisDee)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2021, 1:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-personal-experience-with-mandatory-covid-vaccinations/950473/178 "2021-10-10T13:46:06Z")
> [@puzzlegal](#): > > turned out his source was an anonymous internet poll Yep, looks like that was it. Better than a hypothesis, an actual answer. Here’s a cite that goes into details: > **[Fact check: Setting the record straight on claims about vaccine hesitancy...](https://www.wnct.com/news/north-carolina/fact-check-setting-the-record-straight-on-claims-about-vaccine-hesitancy-among-ph-d-s/)** > > The Ph.D. group does not include medical doctors or nurses. > [@](#): > > A sensitivity analysis found some people answered in the extreme ends of some demographic categories to throw off some of the numbers. King said it appeared to be a “concerted effort” that “did make the hesitancy prevalence in the Ph.D. group look higher than it really is.” > > For example, they observed higher hesitancy rates than expected in the oldest age group — 75 and over — as well as the top end in terms of education level. ---
**Author:** ![Kropotkin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kropotkin/32/18045_2.png) [@Kropotkin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kropotkin)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2021, 3:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-personal-experience-with-mandatory-covid-vaccinations/950473/179 "2021-10-10T15:14:59Z")
Even HR people realize that job stress can make people irrational and angry, and I cannot help but think that is part of what fuels the anti-maskers. No-job stress too. [An angry worker can do a lot of damage - Post Bulletin | Rochester Minnesota news, weather, sports](https://www.postbulletin.com/business/small-business/7217268-An-angry-worker-can-do-a-lot-of-damage) ---
**Author:** ![DMC](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dmc/32/18049_2.png) [@DMC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DMC)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2021, 5:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-personal-experience-with-mandatory-covid-vaccinations/950473/180 "2021-10-10T17:03:18Z")
Sure, but an angry ex-worker can help us with shortages at fast food establishments (just stick to drive through if this is how things play out). [![](https://i2.wp.com/www.dailycartoonist.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/10/tmdsh211007.png) ](https://i2.wp.com/www.dailycartoonist.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/10/tmdsh211007.png) ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2021, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-personal-experience-with-mandatory-covid-vaccinations/950473/181 "2021-10-10T19:29:26Z")
Burn! I love it. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-personal-experience-with-mandatory-covid-vaccinations/950473.md?page=8) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-personal-experience-with-mandatory-covid-vaccinations/950473.md?page=10)