My September 11 Thoughts

[XT]

Yes, I realise this has been done many times before, and indeed I searched for some earlier threads and even found that one had been closed within a few posts, but I think I’ll bring something different to the topic, so hopefully the moderators will allow this one.

Sadly, you haven’t brought anything new to the topic that hasn’t been beaten to death already.

However when I looked into the topic in depth this year, I changed my mind: I have concluded that the controlled demolition conspiracy theorists are right, and that the attacks were arranged and co-ordinated by the CIA or a larger section of the US government.

The controlled demo theory has been discussed endlessly in the various threads on this ridiculous topic that’s come up before. It’s all been debunked over and over. The videos have been discussed…over and over. You claim to have searched the topic, so you should have seen this for yourself already. You remain unconvinced, and instead are convinced by idiots like Steven Jones, who is a freaking radio talk show host and an idiot of biblical proportions (nice tie in to your name I thought :p).

So, since you remain unconvinced by the debunking, you believe idiots who are clueless gets, I have to ask…what’s the point of this thread? It’s all been said already. You aren’t going to be convinced by arguments already used, regardless of how much sense they make, so why go through this again? The controlled demo theory has literally been talked about in EVERY FUCKING 9/11 CT THREAD TO DATE.

The websites that particularly swayed me are 9-11 research, and the paper by Steven Jones, both of which I read in their entirety. Also helpful were this and this, among other things. This is a good video I found just as I was writing this. One of the main clinchers for me is the rate at which the towers fell.

All of this BS has been addressed in the past, including what seems to be the clincher for you, the rate of fall. Oh, I could tell you that controlled demos initiate the destruction of buildings from the bottom up, and not from the point of impact of an air craft, that clearly you can see the building collapsed from that point of impact, and that the rate of fall has been debunked multiple times, etc etc, blah blah blah, but, again, what’s the point? You’ve brought nothing new to the table and all of this has been discussed to death. Literally we’ve beaten the horse to death mid-stream while endlessly shifting 9/11 CT riders and shown, over and over again that the 9/11 Truther non-sense is no gift horse, so check the mouth. It does no good to beat what’s left of this poor fucking horse anymore at this point…let the bastard lay in peace mid-stream and rot in peace for the sake of the gods! Please!

The reason I’ve written this is because I think this is an enormous, reprehensible lie, and I think, perhaps inevitably, it has ruined the world. It’s like, the balance is out, you know? The image of the crumbling towers has been seared into people’s minds as the evils of terrorism, represented by impoverished bearded guys in caves. People seem to have lost their sense of legal rights, replaced by a presumption that the authorities are always to be obeyed, and those that don’t obey are suspicious. Culture generally is deteriorating. The right thing to happen is for the lie to be revealed, to everyone, and I suppose the best way for that to happen is via the mainstream media. I don’t know whether you hear about it much in the US, but in my country we never hear of the alternate theories on TV or in newspapers. If more people get talking about it, and it gets into the media, then hopefully those who know some inside information will feel more confident about coming forward about it, and it can gather momentum from there. I don’t want to live in a “prison planet” anymore (to take from one of the more nonsensical websites).

Good grief, this is the same refrain that every 9/11 Truther CT nut recites when bringing us yet another Must See Video™ that will totally convince…er…no one but the fools already convinced by this idiotic CT. You aren’t going to convince anyone here. You are obviously immune to counter convincing. Just keep your delusions and go in peace. I’d say do no more evil, but you are the freaking Anti-Christ after all.

About the username, I’m not trying to say I’m evil or something, it was more relevant to stuff I was posting a while ago. I’d get it changed but I probably won’t be posting much anyway.

Seriously dude, no one cares what your user name is. This board has a huge number of atheists and agnostics (and even one Agnatheist ;)). The fact that you are already backing off with the caveat that ‘I probably won’t be posting much anyway’ just front loads the usual trajectory of this thread to be like all the other 9/11 Truther threads…drop a steaming pile, maybe make a few additional posts, then flee when the laughter and eye rolling becomes overwhelming.

[Bryan_Ekers]

I’m also a non-American and the conspiracy theories are pernicious bullshit.

[The_Antichrist]

I want to tell you that there is no shame in having being fooled, and that there is no honor in having fooled someone.

[Bryan_Ekers]

@The_Antichrist

I want to tell you that there is no shame in having being fooled, and that there is no honor in having fooled someone.

Well, then you have nothing to be ashamed of but Steven Jones does.

[Great_Antibob]

@The_Antichrist

I want to tell you that there is no shame in having being fooled

Disagree.

There is no shame in being fooled if insufficient evidence were available for proper assessment. That’s not the case here. There’s buckets of physical evidence. Everybody is entitled to their own opinion. Nobody is entitled to their own personal laws of physics.

Anybody who still buys into the moon landing hoax conspiracy theory or any of the JFK assassination conspiracy theories or 9/11 conspiracy theories should be ashamed at this point. The physical evidence is there and the laws of physics haven’t changed. Getting physics wrong years and years after the event and willfully ignoring it IS shameful.

[Stringbean]

@Great_Antibob

Disagree.

There is no shame in being fooled if insufficient evidence were available for proper assessment. That’s not the case here. There’s buckets of physical evidence. Everybody is entitled to their own opinion. Nobody is entitled to their own personal laws of physics.

Anybody who still buys into the moon landing hoax conspiracy theory or any of the JFK assassination conspiracy theories or 9/11 conspiracy theories should be ashamed at this point. The physical evidence is there and the laws of physics haven’t changed. Getting physics wrong years and years after the event and willfully ignoring it IS shameful.

I thought one of the laws of physics is that an object falls through the path of least resistance. I was unaware that the basement and 120 floors of each tower represented less total resistance than the empty air on all sides. Isn’t it odd both towers fell through the path of greatest resistance, at near the speed of gravity? The idea that an object falls through the path of greatest resistance, at nearly the same speed it would otherwise fall if there were no resistance, is a head-scratcher. Where did that resistance go, and how did it manage to dissipate in a uniform manner, allowing the towers to fall straight down rather than off to one side?

Of course, the long, convoluted explanations given by NIST may well be accurate, but less logical a premise than the simplest answer: resistance being blown out uniformly in a highly-controlled demolition.

[Calatin]

I really need to befriend more high-level government officials, because apparently they can really keep a secret.

I tell my close friends about a secret flirtation with someone, and all of a sudden everyone knows.

That’s what blows my mind about conspiracy theorists - how have no “top-ranking” officials ever come clean, be it by deathbed confession or some other reason?

[Great_Antibob]

@Stringbean

Isn’t it odd both towers fell through the path of greatest resistance, at near the speed of gravity?

The simple answer is the best/true one: they didn’t.

Incidentally, this particular debunking has been repeated on these boards several times this year alone.

Again, you are entitled to your own opinion, not to your own laws of physics (especially ones that don’t match reality).

[TonySinclair]

@Stringbean

I thought one of the laws of physics is that an object falls through the path of least resistance.

Well, there’s your problem.

[chacoguy]

The 911 attacks are the most documented event in human history, both in terms of a live audience as well as the media.

You can’t fool all of the people all of the time.

Let’s do Bigfoot and Crittercams next.

[Great_Antibob]

Something I should add.

Even if there were explosives involved, the pieces wouldn’t fall freely anyway. There’s stuff in the way which would slow things down anyway. Lots of impacts and collisions that would arrest the downward fall. Things like entire floors worth of stuff.

So, not only did the stuff NOT reach free fall speed (well documented not to, actually), it wouldn’t have anyway even with explosives - at least if physics works the way we’ve posited for centuries. The whole scenario fails on multiple levels. You’d think these guys could come up with something a high school student wouldn’t be able to debunk.

[Robot_Arm]

@Stringbean

I thought one of the laws of physics is that an object falls through the path of least resistance.

No. An object will move in the direction of the force(s) acting on it. Gravity pulls things down (well, toward the center of the Earth). For a few decades, the structure of the building pushed back up with an equal force, and so everything stayed where it was. When the impact and fire weakened the girders such that they could no longer supply the necessary force, gravity won out.

Buildings are not trees. They do not fall in the way that trees do.

[buddha_david]

@The_Antichrist

I want to tell you that there is no shame in having being fooled, and that there is no honor in having fooled someone.

Out of curiosity, what’s your opinion of Sandy Hook – lone nutjob, or CIA false flag operation?

The world waits breathlessly for your answer.

[Snowboarder_Bo]

@The_Antichrist

When the September 11 attacks happened, at first I presumed that the official story on the topic was all true, and regardless there were apparently no alternative theories around at the time. As the years went by, and as a non-American, the topic gradually slid from my consciousness. However in recent years, I have learnt a little of Muslim culture, and also become more anti-authoritarian in my thinking, and I guess it is these things that have lead me to question the story. On comtemplating the matter, I came to the conclusion that Muslim terrorism, as practised internationally, is essentially a hoax, where they are told what to do by the US government, and other western governments, and given money or other incentives for what they do.

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!! Oh my COW that’s hilarious!

[Northern_Piper]

Trees fall over sideways either because:

a) there is a strong wind, blowing sideways, that overcomes their root system, so they fall over in the direction the wind is blowing;

b) someone (human or beaver) is cutting away at the base of the tree, weakening its support usually more on one side than another, so it falls in the direction of the weakened support.

Neither of those types of force occurred in the case of the twin towers.

[DWMarch]

Here’s a thing that always gets me about conspiracy theorists. In the world they live in:

The US government, under George W. Bush, pulled off the greatest deception in history.
This government also manufactured all kinds of evidence that is so convincing it could almost be actual science!
This government also murdered thousands of its own people.

Let me repeat that last bit: The US government mass murdered, without picking and choosing who was going to die, thousands of its own citizens. Rich ones too. All that murder without a second thought. Thousands of dedicated conspirators who have not cracked under pressure of conscience, money, ideology or boredom in the years since the event.

And here is another seeker of the truth announcing his presence to this trigger-happy government. Posting from an IP address that will lead right back to his house. Spitting right in the face of people who kill for fun and profit.

This is the world you live in. It’s also a world in which we know courtesy of the Snowden leaks that not only does the US government know what you had for breakfast, they also know what color and texture it was when it came out.

Now in the world that I live in I can’t reconcile Obama. All this conspiracy stuff happened under a Republican administration. If Obama could prove it was a conspiracy he could destroy his political opponents for all of time and eternity. But he doesn’t do so. Is he in on it too? Is American politics just grand theater being played out for the masses while secret backroom deals cover up these endless murders? Republicans and Democrats secretly agree on the need to cow the population with fear and terrorism? And still no one talks? I mean, who would, knowing how readily this government assassinates people. But still… Obama has no reason to play along. Or does he? How deep down the rabbit hole do you want to go here?

[Ludovic]

@The_Antichrist

I did some physics at university, and have taken an interest in science since I was very young

Have you seen quite a few shops in your day?

[Broomstick]

Really, it’s getting quite tedious with the regular arrival of these guys who are trying to impart their revelations to the masses. They’re like Jehovah’s witnesses, absolutely convinced in their own minds but clueless how nonsensical their dogma is to the rest of the world.

[C_K_Dexter_Haven]

In sorting Cecil’s mail, I get one or two of these every few months, still clinging to their conspiracy theory. I have one answer that, in my mind, overwhelms all their pseudo-science: if this were a government plot, George Bush would have come out of it looking like a hero. Upon being told of the situation, he would have immediately made a televised speech, taken a role of leadership, come across as the Hero of the Day. Instead, he was confused and bewildered and looks like a frightened rat, and was shuffled off to hide.

[Smeghead]

Well, your mistake there is assuming GWB was in on the conspiracy, when, of course, in reality*, he was just yet another unwitting puppet of the Illuminati/Space Jews/Reptile people/reverse vampires/Stonecutters/Mafia/PepsiCo conspiracy.

Ugh. Writing that made me feel dirty. I need to go beat up a few creationists to feel better.