# My son was jumped by a couple of punks at school today **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [May 28, 2011, 4:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-son-was-jumped-by-a-couple-of-punks-at-school-today/583530 "2011-05-28T04:51:45Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![gladtobeblazed](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/85f322/32.png) [@gladtobeblazed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gladtobeblazed)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2011, 12:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-son-was-jumped-by-a-couple-of-punks-at-school-today/583530/61 "2011-05-29T00:12:21Z")
Why the hell were they playing with a soccer ball in the bathroom of all places? ---
**Author:** ![The\_Hamster\_King](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8edcca/32.png) [@The\_Hamster\_King](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Hamster_King)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2011, 12:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-son-was-jumped-by-a-couple-of-punks-at-school-today/583530/62 "2011-05-29T00:18:10Z")
> [@gladtobeblazed](#): > > Why the hell were they playing with a soccer ball in the bathroom of all places? Because they were ditching class and if they’d played in the halls or the yard an adult would have noticed them. ---
**Author:** ![Chimera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Chimera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chimera)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2011, 12:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-son-was-jumped-by-a-couple-of-punks-at-school-today/583530/63 "2011-05-29T00:38:03Z")
Couldn’t we just lock the stupid bastards in a cell with Carrot Top for about 12 hours, while telling them it will be for 30 days? :eek: “Kids, you keep pulling this shit and you’ll be spending _ten years_ with Carrot Top. Do you want that? Do you _really_ want that, you little shits? If you do, then keep doing what you’re doing. Otherwise straighten the fuck up already.” ---
**Author:** ![treis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bc79bd/32.png) [@treis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/treis)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2011, 12:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-son-was-jumped-by-a-couple-of-punks-at-school-today/583530/64 "2011-05-29T00:52:20Z")
> [@LurkerInNJ](#): > > Their life isn’t going to be ruined. They aren’t going to be forced onto a chain gang or sent to some “Born Innocent” type facility over this. I realize this: > [@treis](#): > > Police intervention is not really going to be that effective. Let’s be realistic here. These kids aren’t going to jail for this. There will probably be a faux trial in front of some sort of peer court. There will be lots of abstract threats about futures and jail that these kids don’t really have the mental ability to fully grasp. It’s a long, drawn out process, which basically doesn’t work with kids. My statements were in response to the “toss them in juvie” crowd. > [@LurkerInNJ](#): > > If it isn’t worked out before court, they will get some sort of lite punishment, the point of which will be that actions have consequences. It is unclear to me why the school can’t demonstrate this point. It is unclear to me when we started to need cops to punish kids. ---
**Author:** ![MsWhatsit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/eb8c5e/32.png) [@MsWhatsit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MsWhatsit)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2011, 1:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-son-was-jumped-by-a-couple-of-punks-at-school-today/583530/65 "2011-05-29T01:03:10Z")
When kids started breaking the law at school. Back in ye olden days of the 1990s, the cops were called to my high school one day just because some kid brought an unloaded gun to school and stashed it in his locker. (The nerve of the school, calling the cops for that! The kid didn’t even shoot anybody! Harmless fun, I tell you.) Cops getting called to schools to deal with serious infractions is not new. ---
**Author:** ![LurkerInNJ](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ed655f/32.png) [@LurkerInNJ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LurkerInNJ)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2011, 1:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-son-was-jumped-by-a-couple-of-punks-at-school-today/583530/66 "2011-05-29T01:13:12Z")
> [@treis](#): > > It is unclear to me why the school can’t demonstrate this point. It is unclear to me when we started to need cops to punish kids. Because over the last 25 years or so, it’s become bad form in many circles to control your child’s behavior. People don’t accept responsibility the way they used to, and that includes the responsibilty of disciplining your children. Now schools have to do it, and if the school can’t or won’t, it’s up to the courts. ---
**Author:** ![treis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bc79bd/32.png) [@treis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/treis)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2011, 1:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-son-was-jumped-by-a-couple-of-punks-at-school-today/583530/67 "2011-05-29T01:15:31Z")
> [@MsWhatsit](#): > > When kids started breaking the law at school. Are you contending that playground fights are a new phenomenon? > [@MsWhatsit](#): > > Back in ye olden days of the 1990s, the cops were called to my high school one day just because some kid brought an unloaded gun to school and stashed it in his locker. (The nerve of the school, calling the cops for that! The kid didn’t even shoot anybody! Harmless fun, I tell you.) Cops getting called to schools to deal with serious infractions is not new. Yeah, I can totally see the parallels between bringing a gun to school and a minor playground fight. ---
**Author:** ![treis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bc79bd/32.png) [@treis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/treis)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2011, 1:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-son-was-jumped-by-a-couple-of-punks-at-school-today/583530/68 "2011-05-29T01:17:54Z")
> [@LurkerInNJ](#): > > Because over the last 25 years or so, it’s become bad form in many circles to control your child’s behavior. People don’t accept responsibility the way they used to, and that includes the responsibilty of disciplining your children. Now schools have to do it, and if the school can’t or won’t, it’s up to the courts. I see no reason to think that this school, or any generic school in the USA, can’t or won’t properly respond to this type of incident. ---
**Author:** ![MsWhatsit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/eb8c5e/32.png) [@MsWhatsit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MsWhatsit)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2011, 1:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-son-was-jumped-by-a-couple-of-punks-at-school-today/583530/69 "2011-05-29T01:24:46Z")
> [@treis](#): > > Are you contending that playground fights are a new phenomenon? No. Look, you can refer to it as a “minor incident” or a “scuffle” or a “tap on the noggin” or a “tickle fight” as much as you want but it doesn’t change the facts as posted in the OP, which resemble deliberate assault, and not a cute lil’ playground scuffle. As for your assertion that any school in the US could readily handle this sort of incident, well. I don’t know about that. But the OP’s kid’s school handled it quite well, in my opinion. ---
**Author:** ![Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ccd318/32.png) [@Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Paul_in_Qatar)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2011, 1:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-son-was-jumped-by-a-couple-of-punks-at-school-today/583530/70 "2011-05-29T01:28:44Z")
What does “pressing charges” really mean? In the long run, isn’t it the state (or the police or the school or someone) who decides to give these thugs the full-court press? ---
**Author:** ![treis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bc79bd/32.png) [@treis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/treis)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2011, 1:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-son-was-jumped-by-a-couple-of-punks-at-school-today/583530/71 "2011-05-29T01:36:49Z")
> [@MsWhatsit](#): > > No. Then you didn’t answer my question. When did we start to need cops to discipline children? > [@MsWhatsit](#): > > Look, you can refer to it as a “minor incident” or a “scuffle” or a “tap on the noggin” or a “tickle fight” as much as you want but it doesn’t change the facts as posted in the OP, which resemble deliberate assault, and not a cute lil’ playground scuffle. And you can blow it out of proportion as much as you’d like, but the fact remains this was a minor fight between children. There is a vast gulf between a “tickle fight” and an incident requiring police intervention. This incident clearly falls in the range of “serious, but easily handled by the school”. > [@MsWhatsit](#): > > As for your assertion that any school in the US could readily handle this sort of incident, well. I don’t know about that. But the OP’s kid’s school handled it quite well, in my opinion. No they didn’t. Having the cops come and haul the other kids away isn’t the school handling it. It’s passing the buck onto the court system, and likely will result in a worse outcome. ---
**Author:** ![Clothahump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/51bf81/32.png) [@Clothahump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Clothahump)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2011, 1:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-son-was-jumped-by-a-couple-of-punks-at-school-today/583530/72 "2011-05-29T01:39:27Z")
> [@treis](#): > > Look in the mirror. You feel that costing the parents a couple grand for a lawyer is a good thing. Yet you don’t seem to consider the implications of this. Not many families nowadays have a couple grand laying around. Having to hire a lawyer for Billy might mean that little Timmy doesn’t get piano lessons this year, or little Suzie has to quit the hockey team. > > And what exactly does Juvie mean for this kid? Do you really think kids go into Juvie and come out well adjusted adults? Of course not. Juvie is full of real delinquents. The kids that are in gangs or are putting other kids in the hospital. Those are the influences this kid will be exposed to, and that sure as shit isn’t going to help his behavior. To continue further, what will the disruption of his school and social life going to do to this kid? No school sports, no school band, no activities that could be a positive influence on the kids life. > > No, the people in this thread are the ones who aren’t thinking this through. Putting a kid in the court system is very damaging and serious, and should only be considered as a last resort. > > Everyone is wildly overreacting to this incident. A kid limping for a couple hours after a fight doesn’t need to be taken to a doctor or interviewed by cops. He needs to get some ice cream and be taken to a movie. A kid being a bully doesn’t need to be arrested and tossed into juvie. He needs to have detention and be suspended. A middle school does not need a police officer. It needs a principal. You are so far wrong you’re not even in the same zip code as right. This was an assault. Period, end of statement. It was a criminal act and is correctly being treated as such. I’ll be willing to bet these jerks have a long history of being bullies and being treated EXACTLY the way you advocate. There were no consequences to their actions, so they learned it’s perfectly okay to jump on other kids. So it’s gonna cost the families of the criminals some money? Sucks to be them - they should have kept their apes on a leash and taught them some basic manners. > [@](#): > > A couple stories from my school career: > > (1) In 5th or 6th grade, IIRC, I made fun of some kid and compared his ‘girlfriend’ to a warthog. He decided to start a fight on the playground. It’s too bad this little Hitler didn’t get tossed into jail for the rest of his life. Or maybe I should have been arrested for harassment and defamation. > > (2) 7th grade. I walked up to some kid in the hall and punched him in the spine. Why? I haven’t the slightest idea. I barely knew the kid, he hadn’t done anything to me, and I wasn’t mad. Maybe I just thought it was funny, I dunno. I suppose I should consider myself lucky that I didn’t have a middle school cop to taze me and toss me into Juvie. > > (3) Freshman year of high school. We were required to show our IDs to get on the bus to go home. I made some commented to the effect of, “If I was going to bomb a school bus I wouldn’t forget my ID”. That got me two days of in school suspension. Guess I am lucky I didn’t rendered to Gitmo and waterboarded. I take it back. You’re not even in the same state as right, much less a zip code. ---
**Author:** ![MsWhatsit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/eb8c5e/32.png) [@MsWhatsit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MsWhatsit)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2011, 1:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-son-was-jumped-by-a-couple-of-punks-at-school-today/583530/73 "2011-05-29T01:40:00Z")
> [@treis](#): > > Then you didn’t answer my question. When did we start to need cops to discipline children? When kids started breaking the law at school. Didn’t I just say that up-thread? Well, maybe you missed it. My point is, this isn’t new. ---
**Author:** ![treis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bc79bd/32.png) [@treis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/treis)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2011, 1:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-son-was-jumped-by-a-couple-of-punks-at-school-today/583530/74 "2011-05-29T01:54:18Z")
> [@MsWhatsit](#): > > When kids started breaking the law at school. Didn’t I just say that up-thread? Well, maybe you missed it. > > My point is, this isn’t new. And my point is that getting the cops involved is new. So what has changed? Why do we now need cops to handle these incidents when we didn’t need them before? ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2011, 1:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-son-was-jumped-by-a-couple-of-punks-at-school-today/583530/75 "2011-05-29T01:56:59Z")
Because we are finally treating criminal acts by minors as criminal acts and not mischief. ---
**Author:** ![treis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bc79bd/32.png) [@treis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/treis)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2011, 1:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-son-was-jumped-by-a-couple-of-punks-at-school-today/583530/76 "2011-05-29T01:59:07Z")
> [@Clothahump](#): > > You are so far wrong you’re not even in the same zip code as right. > > This was an assault. Period, end of statement. It was a criminal act and is correctly being treated as such. I’ll be willing to bet these jerks have a long history of being bullies and being treated EXACTLY the way you advocate. There were no consequences to their actions, so they learned it’s perfectly okay to jump on other kids. > > So it’s gonna cost the families of the criminals some money? Sucks to be them - they should have kept their apes on a leash and taught them some basic manners. Okay… I don’t understand why you think detention and suspension aren’t consequences, but whatever. Maybe you can answer the question MsWhasit has been unable to. When did we start to need cops to discipline children? ---
**Author:** ![treis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bc79bd/32.png) [@treis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/treis)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2011, 2:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-son-was-jumped-by-a-couple-of-punks-at-school-today/583530/77 "2011-05-29T02:00:23Z")
> [@runner pat](#): > > Because we are finally treating criminal acts by minors as criminal acts and not mischief. And why are we doing that? ---
**Author:** ![SciFiSam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/47e85d/32.png) [@SciFiSam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SciFiSam)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2011, 2:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-son-was-jumped-by-a-couple-of-punks-at-school-today/583530/78 "2011-05-29T02:18:49Z")
Glad your kid’s doing OK. As horrible as it must have been, at least now he knows his classmates have his back. Reporting it to the cops is pretty much the same as ‘having sheriff Dan have a word with the young troublemaker.’ These kids aren’t going to go to jail, but they are going to be in trouble, which will be on record, and their parents will definitely know about it; IME as a teacher and parent, parents do not actually always know about and condone the fact that their children are bullies. At least, not to that extent. It’s actually the perfect age to intervene - they’re still just young enough for ‘being told off’ to have some effect before they start to not give a shit about what the adults think, then getting into the sort of trouble they can’t get out of. ---
**Author:** ![AlsoNamedBort](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alsonamedbort/32/3213_2.png) [@AlsoNamedBort](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AlsoNamedBort)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2011, 3:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-son-was-jumped-by-a-couple-of-punks-at-school-today/583530/79 "2011-05-29T03:02:20Z")
> [@treis](#): > > Okay… > > I don’t understand why you think detention and suspension aren’t consequences, but whatever. I don’t understand why you think “lets make the kids take a glorified time-out” is an acceptable punishment for beating a kid up. ---
**Author:** ![twickster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ec9cab/32.png) [@twickster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/twickster)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2011, 3:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-son-was-jumped-by-a-couple-of-punks-at-school-today/583530/80 "2011-05-29T03:22:13Z")
If people want to debate the pros and cons of how schools, public or private, treat physical fights among their kids, start a new thread in Great Debates. If you want to call each other sociopaths, take it to the Pit. This thread is for the specifics of **Hamster Kid** ’s experience, and that’s it. Any further off-topic comments, as I have just defined them, will get warnings. **twickster** , MPSIMS moderator [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-son-was-jumped-by-a-couple-of-punks-at-school-today/583530.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-son-was-jumped-by-a-couple-of-punks-at-school-today/583530.md?page=5)