# My son was jumped by a couple of punks at school today **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [May 28, 2011, 4:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-son-was-jumped-by-a-couple-of-punks-at-school-today/583530 "2011-05-28T04:51:45Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![MeanOldLady](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/meanoldlady/32/10737_2.png) [@MeanOldLady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MeanOldLady)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2011, 9:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-son-was-jumped-by-a-couple-of-punks-at-school-today/583530/121 "2011-06-08T21:45:14Z")
Are you guys the same people who call the cops because your neighbor’s stereo is too loud? Cops? Lawyers? Courts? Juvie? Holy shit, why don’t you just send the kids to the chair because obviously any middle schooler who beats someone up on the playground is a hardened criminal who is done for. Don’t even bother to throw away the key. Fry 'em! For fuck’s sake, this pile on is absurd. **treis** is right. I guess that makes me a former schoolyard bully sticking up for the bad guys, too. > [@jz78817](#): > > Kids who do stuff like this without any tangible consequences keep doing this shit in the adult world. at least until they end up in a real prison, or dead. Your definition of tangible consequence for this scuffle is going to juvie? > [@MsWhatsit](#): > > Exactly, so they won’t go to jail. They’ll go before a judge and get the appropriate consequence for someone in their age group. Sensible. Ridiculous. Go before a judge… Why don’t they go before the principal like every other kid in the universe who beats someone up at school? ---
**Author:** ![treis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bc79bd/32.png) [@treis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/treis)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2011, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-son-was-jumped-by-a-couple-of-punks-at-school-today/583530/122 "2011-06-08T22:09:06Z")
> [@Yeticus\_Rex](#): > > What seems to you as a minor playground fight was actually **TWO** kids beating up on **ONE** kid…that’s not a minor playground fight…that’s being _jumped_. At least a few other 11 year-old kids knew the difference as well, and intervened because they _knew_ that that was no ordinary “playground fight”. > > Heh, 11 year-olds that had more sense than a guy twice their age. Refreshing to hear. > > Had they thought, “Hmph…just another playground fight.”, and did nothing, do you think we would have heard something worse than some bruises, scrapes and a broken toe from **THK**? Do you honestly think that those 2 kids would have just stopped at a broken toe, or keep beating him up until they were too tired to throw another punch? No, clearly these two sadists had planned to beat the kid into submission, flay him live, and then wear his skin as a jacket as a warning to every other kid who might tattle on them. ---
**Author:** ![jz78817](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jz78817/32/1028_2.png) [@jz78817](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jz78817)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2011, 10:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-son-was-jumped-by-a-couple-of-punks-at-school-today/583530/123 "2011-06-08T22:23:33Z")
> [@MeanOldLady](#): > > Are you guys the same people who call the cops because your neighbor’s stereo is too loud? maybe, but that’s far, far better than being a person who can’t tell the difference between playing a stereo too loud and _having two people beat down another person without provocation._ Yes, I’m talking about you. > [@](#): > > Holy shit, why don’t you just send the kids to the chair because obviously any middle schooler who beats someone up on the playground is a hardened criminal who is done for. Don’t even bother to throw away the key. Fry 'em! I hope someone’s around to give you a hand up once you’re done sliding down that slippery slope. > [@](#): > > Your definition of tangible consequence for this scuffle is going to juvie? given the reaction of relief by the school administration when the OP said they’d press charges, I think juvie is _long overdue_ for these two shitwipes. > [@](#): > > Ridiculous. Go before a judge… Why don’t they go before the principal like every other kid in the universe who beats someone up at school? because it OBVIOUSLY DOESN’T DO ANYTHING TO ADDRESS THE BEHAVIOR! ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2011, 11:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-son-was-jumped-by-a-couple-of-punks-at-school-today/583530/124 "2011-06-08T23:00:13Z")
> [@MeanOldLady](#): > > Are you guys the same people who call the cops because your neighbor’s stereo is too loud? Cops? Lawyers? Courts? Juvie? This isn’t a simple fight between 2 kids. It involved multiple bullies and a real injury. That’s a pretty clear line crossed regardless of the venue. And yes, I’ve called the cops when the neighbor next store deliberately cranked up her stereo and left the house. She did it to piss off the other renter. to hell with her. ---
**Author:** ![MeanOldLady](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/meanoldlady/32/10737_2.png) [@MeanOldLady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MeanOldLady)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2011, 12:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-son-was-jumped-by-a-couple-of-punks-at-school-today/583530/125 "2011-06-09T00:17:20Z")
> [@jz78817](#): > > I hope someone’s around to give you a hand up once you’re done sliding down that slippery slope. You’re the on who made with the lunacy about kids who pick fights but don’t see “tangible consequences,” by which you apparently mean being locked up, go on to assault people in adult life before ultimately being sent off to prison. Maybe I should find all those kids I went to school with who picked fight and become their prison pen pals. > [@Magiver](#): > > This isn’t a simple fight between 2 kids. It involved multiple bullies and a real injury. That’s a pretty clear line crossed regardless of the venue. No, it was a simple fight between 3 kids that resulted in some scratches and a stubbed toe. ---
**Author:** ![Drain\_Bead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e47774/32.png) [@Drain\_Bead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Drain_Bead)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2011, 1:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-son-was-jumped-by-a-couple-of-punks-at-school-today/583530/126 "2011-06-09T01:29:22Z")
> [@MeanOldLady](#): > > Ridiculous. Go before a judge… Why don’t they go before the principal like every other kid in the universe who beats someone up at school? That’s how it was when we were kids. It’s not that way now. I’m a juvenile defense attorney, and a substantial minority of my cases are school fights. The schools often don’t give the victim’s parents the choice that the OP got–they just call the cops outright. ---
**Author:** ![treis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bc79bd/32.png) [@treis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/treis)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2011, 2:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-son-was-jumped-by-a-couple-of-punks-at-school-today/583530/127 "2011-06-09T02:00:12Z")
> [@Drain\_Bead](#): > > That’s how it was when we were kids. It’s not that way now. I’m a juvenile defense attorney, and a substantial minority of my cases are school fights. The schools often don’t give the victim’s parents the choice that the OP got–they just call the cops outright. What usually happens to these defendants? ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2011, 2:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-son-was-jumped-by-a-couple-of-punks-at-school-today/583530/128 "2011-06-09T02:11:55Z")
> [@Cicero](#): > > Sounds like Angels With Dirty Faces [Sounds like this?](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GZieCw0nLQI)😃 . ---
**Author:** ![needscoffee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/needscoffee/32/1076_2.png) [@needscoffee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/needscoffee)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2011, 6:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-son-was-jumped-by-a-couple-of-punks-at-school-today/583530/129 "2011-06-09T06:14:47Z")
> [@Drain\_Bead](#): > > That’s how it was when we were kids. It’s not that way now. I’m a juvenile defense attorney, and a substantial minority of my cases are school fights. The schools often don’t give the victim’s parents the choice that the OP got–they just call the cops outright. > [@treis](#): > > What usually happens to these defendants? I can’t speak for Drain Bead, but I can tell you what would happen if the prosecutor determines it’s serious, yet not serious enough for juvenile court. I’m a court advisor to a juvenile diversion board, meaning I sit in on and oversee the cases brought before a neighborhood juvenile diversion board and, along with three or four trained community volunteers per board, assign punishment. The kids \*might \*qualify for diversion IF it was a first offense, the kids were middle school-aged (up through 8th grade here), no one was seriously injured, and the medical expenses incurred were less than $900. If conditions exceeded those parameters, it would probably go to juvenile court. In juvenile diversion, the kid might be assigned something like: **·** 20 to 30 hours of community service at a local nonprofit approved of by the diversion monitor; **·** 10 hours of counseling if we feel the kid needs it after we confer with him and with his parents; **·** Monetary restitution for the victim’s expenses; **·** No contact with the victim; and **·** A letter of apology if the victim has requested it. If the kid fails on any of these assignments, the case goes back to juvenile court. If he succeeds, there is no criminal record, as he was diverted from prosecution, and he’s accurately described as never having been convicted of a crime. His criminal diversion history is destroyed when he turns 18. Same thing as for teen shoplifting, tagging, and other minor crimes. In addition to a home suspension, the school could also impose an in-school suspension for a longer period of time, meaning during all free time and during lunch, the student remains confined to the office, cleans cafeteria tables, carries chairs up and down floors, whatever the house administrator comes up with. ISTR a certain member of my household assigned to lunch cafeteria duty for a month for infractions. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2011, 6:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-son-was-jumped-by-a-couple-of-punks-at-school-today/583530/130 "2011-06-09T06:49:50Z")
> [@CitizenPained](#): > > Im going to assume that the juvie was a temporary holding center. But fir 10 to 13 year olds? Jesus, they’re punks, not career criminals. > > Sigh. If I were 12 again and some brat said, “You’re gonna get busted!” I would probably have threatened to bust her face as I had a thing with authority at that age and perceived threats were taken seriously. > > I’m not excusing what the boys did. We don’t know what happened in that bathroom any more than we know what happens in their day to day lives. > > The kid got jumped for a reason. Not a good one, but a reason. That reason should be addressed. I hope the school counselor recognized that. No. That isn’t a reason, and you are blaming the victim. Telling someone that they would get in trouble if they get caught is not remotely wrong, and is not something anyone should be addressing. The fact that it would have pissed you off as a kid is your problem, and hopefully one you dealt with. Oh, and just because you can sort of empathize with the bullies doesn’t mean the kid is a liar. No, it is very possible for someone to be hurt by other people through no fault of their own. The way people are reacting about pressing charges on these kids, they really are this messed up. ---
**Author:** ![MeanOldLady](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/meanoldlady/32/10737_2.png) [@MeanOldLady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MeanOldLady)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2011, 1:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-son-was-jumped-by-a-couple-of-punks-at-school-today/583530/131 "2011-06-09T13:48:01Z")
> [@Drain\_Bead](#): > > That’s how it was when we were kids. It’s not that way now. I’m a juvenile defense attorney, and a substantial minority of my cases are school fights. The schools often don’t give the victim’s parents the choice that the OP got–they just call the cops outright. People are lawyering up over playground slap fights? What kind of limp-wristed, delicate-snowflake-having, everybody’s-a-winner, milquetoast, overly-litigious bullshit is this? It is absolute insanity to sic attorneys on people because because two eleven year olds beat up another eleven year old on the schoolyard over some perceived threat of tattling. What is this, Revenge of the Nerds? > [@BigT](#): > > No. That isn’t a reason, and you are blaming the victim. Is this the new catchphrase of the SDMB? “Blaming the victim?” I’ve noticed any time someone remarks on an attack with anything other than “The offender is an irredeemable monster!” throngs of shrieking little girls cry out that somebody’s blaming the victim. Where, exactly, did \*\*Citizen \*\*blame the victim for any of this in that post? What I read in his post is it doesn’t seem accurate to paint the bullies here, because they beat up the OP’s kid, as a team of roving thugs who go around beating up other students randomly and for absolutely no reason. The kids were indeed assholes, and I don’t see anyone denying that, but let’s not start with this “blaming the victim” fall-back line because someone pointed out that the two kids didn’t just spot a passer-by and decide to attack. ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2011, 1:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-son-was-jumped-by-a-couple-of-punks-at-school-today/583530/132 "2011-06-09T13:52:54Z")
> [@MeanOldLady](#): > > What kind of limp-wristed, delicate-snowflake-having, everybody’s-a-winner, milquetoast, overly-litigious bullshit is this? The law is how adults attack each other. Nothing milquetoast about it. ---
**Author:** ![MeanOldLady](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/meanoldlady/32/10737_2.png) [@MeanOldLady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MeanOldLady)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2011, 2:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-son-was-jumped-by-a-couple-of-punks-at-school-today/583530/133 "2011-06-09T14:07:33Z")
So children should behave exactly as adults, and when they do not, they should be treated exactly like adults? Okay. ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2011, 2:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-son-was-jumped-by-a-couple-of-punks-at-school-today/583530/134 "2011-06-09T14:30:25Z")
So you say that assaults should not be prosecuted? Okay. ---
**Author:** ![MeanOldLady](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/meanoldlady/32/10737_2.png) [@MeanOldLady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MeanOldLady)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2011, 2:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-son-was-jumped-by-a-couple-of-punks-at-school-today/583530/135 "2011-06-09T14:34:03Z")
Little kids hitting other little kids? Of course not. Juvies would be filled to the brim if everyone called in cops and lawyers for every schoolyard dust-up. ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2011, 2:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-son-was-jumped-by-a-couple-of-punks-at-school-today/583530/136 "2011-06-09T14:37:06Z")
Yeah, my milquetoast heart bleeds for the little shits who assault children. Wait, I’m not the person who wants to shrug it off with “boys will be boys”. That would be a coddling attitude if I thought that. ---
**Author:** ![MeanOldLady](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/meanoldlady/32/10737_2.png) [@MeanOldLady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MeanOldLady)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2011, 2:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-son-was-jumped-by-a-couple-of-punks-at-school-today/583530/137 "2011-06-09T14:45:31Z")
Ha ha! Okay - you got me! Because I find it silly to drag a bunch of children into court because they slapped somebody around (not even in the face), I think we ought to cue up the violins for violent criminals who assault children. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2011, 3:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-son-was-jumped-by-a-couple-of-punks-at-school-today/583530/138 "2011-06-09T15:07:18Z")
And what do we think would have happened if the student, parents and school had just “let it go”? The two kids didn’t let the incident go after they’d all left the bathroom; they continued it outside later. That’s not just a bit of opportunistic bullying; that’s premeditation. Let them get away with _planning_ an assault and what kind of message are you teaching them? ---
**Author:** ![MeanOldLady](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/meanoldlady/32/10737_2.png) [@MeanOldLady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MeanOldLady)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2011, 3:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-son-was-jumped-by-a-couple-of-punks-at-school-today/583530/139 "2011-06-09T15:14:37Z")
Is this even a serious question? Are you going to pretend that the only two responses to misbehaving children are to send them to jail or to “let it go”? ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2011, 3:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-son-was-jumped-by-a-couple-of-punks-at-school-today/583530/140 "2011-06-09T15:25:40Z")
> [@MeanOldLady](#): > > Is this even a serious question? Are you going to pretend that the only two responses to misbehaving children are to send them to jail or to “let it go”? …says the person who characterized the incident as “slapping someone around” and a “schoolyard dustup”. I didn’t say, and don’t think, that they should be sent to jail. But I do think that as described this was more than some minor scrap that would have been over and done with on its own. Official intervention and punishment were fully warranted. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-son-was-jumped-by-a-couple-of-punks-at-school-today/583530.md?page=6) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/my-son-was-jumped-by-a-couple-of-punks-at-school-today/583530.md?page=8)