# Mystery Mafia -- Game Thread **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [August 17, 2011, 2:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mystery-mafia-game-thread/593025 "2011-08-17T14:03:37Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 112
**Author:** ![NAF1138](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/naf1138/32/3245_2.png) [@NAF1138](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NAF1138)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2011, 2:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mystery-mafia-game-thread/593025/2222 "2011-08-23T14:48:25Z")
> [@Blaster\_Master](#): > > I just saw this from posting, so… I’ll bite. > > Silver Jan > TexCat > Gnarlycharlie > Dancecat > Blaster Master > That’s conditional on the fact that I’m still a few hundred posts behind so I haven’t seen all of the developments. Ok, see. Seriously you have two claimed masons listed as potentially more scummy than Dancecat? This is the kind of posting that I was talking about. (I am looking for others, I promise, but I am easily distracted today.) Jan may or may not be a cop, it may or may not be a redirect claim, but dammit, you have to take that claim into account until you know more. There are more scum out there. If TexCat and Gnarlycharlie are both scum I will eat my hat and if either of them are scum…I don’t something slightly less than eating my hat but more than shrugging it off. Dancecat, who I think is likely town, HAS to be seen as more suspicious than that. ---
**Author:** ![lilflower](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ecccb3/32.png) [@lilflower](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lilflower)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2011, 2:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mystery-mafia-game-thread/593025/2223 "2011-08-23T14:49:47Z")
> [@Scuba\_Ben](#): > > I just now got back. I haven’t been able to catch up from post 1501 on, due to day job and very very tired. I feared I’d be checking in and resigning myself to being lynched. > > Instead I find I’m now 3rd, with Silver Jan first. > > I wish to repeat the message I received overNight: I was informed that Silver Jan is a Villager. > > If Jan flips Wolf then either I am lying about my message or my message is lying to me. There’s more information to be gained by lynching me – should I flip Town (and I will) it demonstrates that I am accurately reporting my message AND strongly indicates that Idle accurately reported HIS message about Dancecat. > > I need to review the case on gnarlycharlie, buried somewhere in the last 10 pages. For now, I prefer to see GC hang than Jan, because I consider Jan confirmed Town. > > \*\*unvote Weedy > vote gnarlycharlie > \*\* > > And now to look at the posts voting on GC and Jan. I’m not completely caught up but I don’t know if I’ll make it to the end of this thread to unvote before the end of this Day! I don’t like the vote on **gnarly** , which reminds me \*\* unvote gnarlycharlie\*\* After all the discussion that has been going on about the claims, I don’t think \*\*gnarly \*\*(or anyone in the list of 5 that has been floating around) should be lynched toDay. I think that we could probably sort this out better toMorrow because I’m hoping more players will be able to come forward with more information. I want to change my vote to **Scuba Ben** toDay because I like the case against him. And why does you flipping town confirm **Idle** ’s message? I also feel like the scum are probably sitting back laughing at all of us so vehemently discussing which (very likely) townie we are going to vote toDay and are also likely to be the quietest among us right now. Plus, **Scuba Ben** was the one on the chopping block before all of this started. **vote Scuba Ben** ---
**Author:** ![Scuba\_Ben](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/278dde/32.png) [@Scuba\_Ben](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scuba_Ben)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2011, 2:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mystery-mafia-game-thread/593025/2224 "2011-08-23T14:49:49Z")
I’m up to 1879. A question keeps sticking in my head. - Jan submitted a target (undisclosed) and a backup target (gnarlycharlie). - She got no result on her target. - She got a message of Wolf on her backup target. I tentatively conclude that Jan got a random message the same way several other people did (including me). Further, if we have any normal cops that get the results of their own investigations, - They would get results, not messages. - They should NOT claim Today unless absolutely necessary. And another question I just thought of. **TexCat** and **gnarlycharlie** , you said you got your full role PMs. I want to double check something – did the full PMs say your roles were both Mason? Was the Night action that you’d find a Mason and get your roles if you did? Or something else? ---
**Author:** ![peekercpa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/8baadc/32.png) [@peekercpa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/peekercpa)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2011, 2:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mystery-mafia-game-thread/593025/2225 "2011-08-23T14:50:26Z")
> [@Gadarene](#): > > **MODERATOR NOTE** > > There are no jesters in the game, donuts. And to repeat what I said last page, because 'tis important for everyone’s sanity and enjoyment: please assume that the rules of this game have been carefully designed to be fair and internally consistent for most values of both terms. yaknow i am going to make a ruling that probably gets me modkilled. the fucking kidz are enjoyng the music and whooping it up. i’d counsel let it be. i think we can figure it out. ---
**Author:** ![Askthepizzaguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/askthepizzaguy/32/9405_2.png) [@Askthepizzaguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Askthepizzaguy)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2011, 2:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mystery-mafia-game-thread/593025/2226 "2011-08-23T14:51:24Z")
> [@Scuba\_Ben](#): > > AOP @ PizzaGuy: I think you need to sharpen your razor. Occam’s Razor does NOT suggest that there are not 7 Jester roles in a game. It says to not assume 7 Jester roles until all simpler explanations of the given facts have been disproven by either logic, testing, or more facts. I may need to sharpen my razor, because I generally **don’t use it.** Scumbags love presenting simpler, more believable explanations for things. Occam’s Razor typically leads directly into scum traps. ---
**Author:** ![lilflower](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ecccb3/32.png) [@lilflower](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lilflower)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2011, 2:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mystery-mafia-game-thread/593025/2227 "2011-08-23T14:51:40Z")
> [@Drain\_Bead](#): > > \ > It might be worth it for anyone who targeted **gnarlycharlie** last Night to come out now…do we think the Scum would take a shot at a possible Insane or Paranoid Cop, given all the other targets? What do you guys think of this idea? I don’t like this idea. If \*\*Texcat \*\*and \*\*gnarly \*\*are telling the truth, a doc targeted gnarly last Night and I don’t think we should be outing any protectors right now. ---
**Author:** ![Scuba\_Ben](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/278dde/32.png) [@Scuba\_Ben](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scuba_Ben)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2011, 2:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mystery-mafia-game-thread/593025/2228 "2011-08-23T14:52:13Z")
> [@lilflower](#): > > I want to change my vote to **Scuba Ben** toDay because I like the case against him. And why does you flipping town confirm **Idle** ’s message? > > I also feel like the scum are probably sitting back laughing at all of us so vehemently discussing which (very likely) townie we are going to vote toDay and are also likely to be the quietest among us right now. Plus, **Scuba Ben** was the one on the chopping block before all of this started. > > **["]vote Scuba Ben[/]** I’m still catching up. Me flipping Town no longer confirms anything about Idle or his message. It would only confirm that I accurately reported my message. It would also increase the likelihood that other people are accurately reporting their messages. As for “quietest among us right now” – I like to think I’ve been pretty active for the last hour or so. I disagree with your value of “right now.” ---
**Author:** ![Askthepizzaguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/askthepizzaguy/32/9405_2.png) [@Askthepizzaguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Askthepizzaguy)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2011, 2:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mystery-mafia-game-thread/593025/2229 "2011-08-23T14:53:04Z")
> [@Gadarene](#): > > **MODERATOR NOTE** > > There are no jesters in the game, donuts. And to repeat what I said last page, because 'tis important for everyone’s sanity and enjoyment: please assume that the rules of this game have been carefully designed to be fair and internally consistent for most values of both terms. Yeah no jesters, just using it as a rhetorical device. As for fair and consistent, Dethy is pretty fair and very consistent. Hell, it even favors the TOWN over the mafia, as confusing as it is. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Scuba\_Ben](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/278dde/32.png) [@Scuba\_Ben](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scuba_Ben)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2011, 2:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mystery-mafia-game-thread/593025/2230 "2011-08-23T14:53:48Z")
> [@lilflower](#): > > I don’t like this idea. If \*\*Texcat \*\*and \*\*gnarly \*\*are telling the truth, a doc targeted gnarly last Night and I don’t think we should be outing any protectors right now. Preview doesn’t help today, we’re all moving too fast. By my count, two people have claimed feelings of protection last Night: - NAF - septimus Has anybody else, **gnarlycharlie** in particular, made such a claim? ---
**Author:** ![Gadarene](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Gadarene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gadarene)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2011, 2:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mystery-mafia-game-thread/593025/2231 "2011-08-23T14:55:13Z")
**UPDATED DAY TWO VOTE COUNT** Through post #2229 Silver Jan (5): Zeriel [1126], [del]Blaster Master [1759][/del], Weedy [1812], Giraffe [1820], [del]Idle Thoughts [1825][/del], Drain Bead [1936], brewha [2159] gnarlycharlie (4): [del]Weedy [1279][/del], [del]lilflower [1720][/del], [del]Idle Thoughts [1723][/del], [del]brewha [1732][/del], [del]Silver Jan [1735][/del], [del]NAF1138 [1737][/del], [del]Drain Bead [1738][/del], [del]Giraffe [1768][/del], [del]septimus [1771][/del], [del]Blaster Master [1813][/del], [del]Scathach [1872][/del], Astral Rejection [1971], Inner Stickler [2111], Precambrianmollusc [2123], Scuba\_Ben [2173] Scuba\_Ben (4): [del]Blaster Master [1109][/del], [del]Drain Bead [1190][/del], Suburban Plankton [1449], [del]Weedy [1452][/del], [del]Scathach [1499][/del], [del]Idle Thoughts [1507][/del], Scathach [1895], Idle Thoughts [1904], lilflower [2222] Blaster Master (3): sachertorte/DonkTimesFour [1135], [del]septimus [1367][/del], septimus [1808], NAF1138 [2187] Dancecat (2): Askthepizzaguy [1969], Silver Jan [2154] Giraffe (1): [del]Normal Phase [1157][/del], [del]peekercpa [1267][/del], [del]Askthepizzaguy [1341][/del], [del]Astral Rejection [1547][/del], [del]Askthepizzaguy [1548][/del], [del]peekercpa [1588][/del], peekercpa [1927] peekercpa (1): [del]Giraffe [1320][/del], bufftabby [1646], [del]septimus [1664][/del] Precambrianmollusc (1): [del]Idle Thoughts [1143][/del], crackedquads [2143] Inner Stickler (1): TexCat [2204] Brewha (1): [del]Askthepizzaguy [1256][/del], [del]Askthepizzaguy [1472][/del], Normal Phase [2209] Episkey (0): [del]crackedquads [1552][/del] DonkTimesFour (0): [del]peekercpa [1663][/del] TexCat (0): [del]Dancecat [1787][/del], [del]Askthepizzaguy [1929][/del] Askthepizzaguy (0): [del]peekercpa [1524][/del] Weedy (0): [del]Scuba\_Ben [1586][/del], [del]Askthepizzaguy [1590][/del] Please PM me with any corrections. DAY ENDS IN ~4 HOURS. ---
**Author:** ![NAF1138](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/naf1138/32/3245_2.png) [@NAF1138](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NAF1138)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2011, 2:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mystery-mafia-game-thread/593025/2232 "2011-08-23T14:57:09Z")
By the way BlaM can you reconcile the thinking in [THIS POST](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=14169869) with [THIS POST](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=14172488). Please explain, because I certainly can’t. ---
**Author:** ![TexCat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/texcat/32/9041_2.png) [@TexCat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TexCat)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2011, 2:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mystery-mafia-game-thread/593025/2233 "2011-08-23T14:57:33Z")
[473](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=14151915&postcount=473) Inner’s vote on me yesterday. No comment, no opinion, just a vote. He later said he didn’t like me voting for a bad idea. Quite a few people voted for NAF’s bad idea, and yet, Inner didn’t see fit to vote for them, or comment on them. Did he ever even voice an opinion on them? I don’t think so. He has voiced almost no opinions on anything this game. And now he is voting GnarlyCharlie who I know is town and most of you think is likely to be town. ---
**Author:** ![NAF1138](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/naf1138/32/3245_2.png) [@NAF1138](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NAF1138)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2011, 2:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mystery-mafia-game-thread/593025/2234 "2011-08-23T14:58:29Z")
That first post that I linked to was the post that finally put me over the edge to voting for you BTW, the second one has made me feel a lot better about my vote. ---
**Author:** ![NAF1138](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/naf1138/32/3245_2.png) [@NAF1138](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NAF1138)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2011, 3:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mystery-mafia-game-thread/593025/2235 "2011-08-23T15:00:04Z")
> [@TexCat](#): > > [473](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=14151915&postcount=473) Inner’s vote on me yesterday. No comment, no opinion, just a vote. He later said he didn’t like me voting for a bad idea. Quite a few people voted for NAF’s bad idea, and yet, Inner didn’t see fit to vote for them, or comment on them. Did he ever even voice an opinion on them? I don’t think so. He has voiced almost no opinions on anything this game. And now he is voting GnarlyCharlie who I know is town and most of you think is likely to be town. Huh, I like this case actually. I will throw my support behind a lynch of Sticky too. BlaM Sticks Ed are my lynch preferences for the Day as it stands right now. I will vote for whichever is most likely to actually get lynched. ---
**Author:** ![Scuba\_Ben](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/278dde/32.png) [@Scuba\_Ben](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scuba_Ben)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2011, 3:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mystery-mafia-game-thread/593025/2236 "2011-08-23T15:00:47Z")
After some more thinking, and reading **lilflower** in #1883, I have to agree that lynching a claimed mason with a corroborating mason claim is Not Good Play. **unvote gnarlycharlie** AOP. Defensive, self-preservation vote, as I will be AFK for the last hour of the Day: **vote Silver Jan** and hope that I got a false message. I’m blaming **lilflower** for forcing me to cast a self-preservation vote. ---
**Author:** ![peekercpa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/8baadc/32.png) [@peekercpa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/peekercpa)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2011, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mystery-mafia-game-thread/593025/2237 "2011-08-23T15:01:56Z")
hey, **mykbot** you fully loaded and ready to roll? ---
**Author:** ![NAF1138](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/naf1138/32/3245_2.png) [@NAF1138](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NAF1138)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2011, 3:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mystery-mafia-game-thread/593025/2238 "2011-08-23T15:02:51Z")
While I am at it, let’s look at [THIS POST](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=14169547) in conjunction with the other two of BlaM’s that I linked to. ---
**Author:** ![Blaster\_Master](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/cab0a1/32.png) [@Blaster\_Master](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blaster_Master)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2011, 3:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mystery-mafia-game-thread/593025/2239 "2011-08-23T15:03:09Z")
> [@Askthepizzaguy](#): > > **Recommend lynching one of the folks we were going to lynch this round before all the claims hit us.** > > Those were suspects for standard mafia-suspicion-related reasons. It’s going to give you a better shot at figuring out who is full of crap regardless of if you hit scum or townie with those lynches. > > If you lynch away everyone involved in this cop/whisper/mason debacle, I can almost guarantee you, everyone you lynch will be townie. > > I repeat the advice I give every game: Do not rely on power roles to save the game for you. > > You know how easy this game would be if there were ZERO results to work with? As in, everyone was vanilla? We’d use our natural scum-finding instincts to find the scum. And who flips scum helps us figure out who else is scum. > > The power roles are actually a hindrance to our discussion, and our reliance on our better scum-finding method, which is by behavior. > > Please, power roles are icing on the cake. They SUCK without a cake to put it on. The cake is behavioral analysis. The CAKE is not a lie. > > Focus on the cake. The icing comes later. > > **Does anyone support the go-back-to-before-the-claims plan? I do.** I can agree with this. At this point, we have a plethora of data points, but no meaningful way to connect them. After Tonight, we ought to have roughly twice the number of points, plus anywhere from 1-4 more alignments to play into it and so we can potentially work out usable information. At this point, if we lynch **Silver Jan** , even if she is town, we can’t be sure we can trust her message, but we might be able to make more sense of that message and what it says about all the other people who were affected by claimed messages. That said, unless things change, I’ll return to my original case. At least to this point, I still haven’t seen a response from **Scuba\_Ben** on my case and, while he claims to have received a message, he also claims it wasn’t part of his role, so I think any risk of hitting a cop is low. **Vote Scuba\_Ben** ---
**Author:** ![lilflower](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ecccb3/32.png) [@lilflower](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lilflower)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2011, 3:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mystery-mafia-game-thread/593025/2240 "2011-08-23T15:04:20Z")
> [@Scuba\_Ben](#): > > Preview doesn’t help today, we’re all moving too fast. > > By my count, two people have claimed feelings of protection last Night: > > - NAF > - septimus > > Has anybody else, **gnarlycharlie** in particular, made such a claim? Yes. It’s been mentioned a few times but I don’t have the exact posts right now. Frankly, I’m starving and need to get back to work and I really have to walk away. Right . . . . now! ---
**Author:** ![Scuba\_Ben](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/278dde/32.png) [@Scuba\_Ben](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scuba_Ben)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2011, 3:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mystery-mafia-game-thread/593025/2241 "2011-08-23T15:05:49Z")
Screw what I was going to post, and that I’m only up to 1901. I see on preview that BlaM is still gunning for me. It’s time for me to jump back to 1424 and reply to his post. There should only be 27 thousand more posts once I’m done with that. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mystery-mafia-game-thread/593025.md?page=111) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mystery-mafia-game-thread/593025.md?page=113)