# Mystery Mafia -- Game Thread **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [August 17, 2011, 2:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mystery-mafia-game-thread/593025 "2011-08-17T14:03:37Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 247
**Author:** ![Scuba\_Ben](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/278dde/32.png) [@Scuba\_Ben](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scuba_Ben)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2011, 8:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mystery-mafia-game-thread/593025/4922 "2011-09-07T20:31:23Z")
> [@crackedquads](#): > > Obv anything I say should be viewed with skepticism, but here’s how this is going to go down from my pov: > > I just need to survive til the end of the game. I have a certain number of lives to help me do this, and I can also vig whoever I want. I can be roleblocked though, and my targets can be angeled. I won’t use my power anymore if I’m left alone. For every day the village tries to lynch me, I’ll kill vig one person each night who was voting for me. If the wolves try to nightkill me, I’ll vig my biggest wolf read that night. I am told everytime an attempt on my life is made. So you’re claiming Neutral/Survivor/Vigilante, with a dash of Paranoid Gun Owner from your claim that you are told when you are attacked at Night. Curious. Now here’s the part I _really_ don’t get: You say you won’t use your power any more if you’re left alone. The rules of this game require us to attempt our action every Night. How do you plan to not use your power? So I’m tagging you as claiming Survivor/Crazy Killer for lack of a better term. And I describe your shot at pwnsall as crazy; you could’ve shot at potential Scum and positioned yourself as pro-Town. After all, you can win with either side. Instead, you shot semi-confirmed Town “in a rage”. That’s very Scummy, and I’ll consider your lynch at my leisure. Alternately, I can think of a few interesting suggestions for various other players to consider Tonight. On the other hand, your claim counters concerns of a Day-angel role. So we can proceed to lynch Episkey Today. AOP @ lilflower: You’re right, CQ has been acting Neutral/Serial Killer with eir claimed targets and reasons. I am at a loss to understand why a Survivor would kill soft-confirmed Town players when a Scum kill is far from certain. That makes CQ a good target for EVERYBODY. ---
**Author:** ![Scuba\_Ben](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/278dde/32.png) [@Scuba\_Ben](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scuba_Ben)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2011, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mystery-mafia-game-thread/593025/4923 "2011-09-07T20:34:35Z")
> [@Normal\_Phase](#): > > About the only thing I’m sure about right now is that CQ is bullshitting about having multiple lives. I partially disagree. CQ survived a lynch attempt. Therefore e has multiple lives. CQ _could_ be bullshitting about how many lives e has remaining. IIRC, back in Lost Mafia, someone claimed Limited-kill Vig early (Day 2 IIRC). They spent a few Days taunting everybody about whether or not they had any shots remaining, after killing on N1. Turned out they were bullshitting us, they had only one shot. Anyhow… CQ, you said you are informed of Night attacks on you. Have you received any such info, on which Nights, and with what additional info? ---
**Author:** ![Suburban\_Plankton](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/suburban_plankton/32/219_2.png) [@Suburban\_Plankton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Suburban_Plankton)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2011, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mystery-mafia-game-thread/593025/4924 "2011-09-07T20:38:55Z")
> [@crackedquads](#): > > My targets: > > N1: special ed > N2: Dancecat > N3: lilflower > N4: LightFoot > N5: pwnsall > > I was not successful N1 or N3. Lil was probably angeled N3 which is pretty lol considering how wolfy you were. I think I was roleblocked N1. Let’s look at who’s been shot, and what our known and claimed vigilante roles did on various Nights Night 1 (Mahaloth was shot): Guiri shot Mahaloth brewha was blocked or his target was protected crackedquads targeted Ed but was blocked Night 2 (Dancecat was shot by “multiple people” and Inner Stickler was shot with "Guiri’s gun): brewha crackedquads shot Dancecat Masons? Night 3 (gnarlycharlie was shot): brewha shot gnarlycharlie crackedquads targeted lilflower and was unsuccessful Night 4 (LightFoot was shot): crackedquads shot Lightfoot Night 5 (pwnsall was shot): crackedquads shot pwnsall The only real problem here is with Night 2. The reveal for Inner Stickler says > [@](#): > > Elsewhere, someone found Guiri’s gun and decided to put it to use. They felt that the guy who had been loitering around on the street corner was obviously shifty. Unfortunately, they didn’t see his uniform until it was too late. > > Inner Stickler has been shot! This implies that Inner was killed by someone who was definitely not Scum, and I think implies that the kiler was in fact Town. The reveal for Danecat says > [@](#): > > Multiple people caught up to Dancecat while she was tolerating a Mets game in a local donut shop. > > “But…wait a second,” she said. “I’m actually a villager this time!” > > “We know,” they replied. > > Dancecat has been shot! the color implies that ‘they’ knew Dancecat was Town, meaning ‘they’ would have to be Scum. In any case, it implies that ‘they’ were working in concert, which would not apply to crackedquads and anybody else, since crackedquads is a PFK. So if we read meaning into the color, it seems like crackedquads wasn’t responsible for either of the shootings on Night 2. _If_ we read meaning into the color. ---
**Author:** ![Normal\_Phase](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Normal\_Phase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Normal_Phase)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2011, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mystery-mafia-game-thread/593025/4925 "2011-09-07T20:43:03Z")
> [@Scuba\_Ben](#): > > I partially disagree. CQ survived a lynch attempt. Therefore e has multiple lives. > > CQ _could_ be bullshitting about how many lives e has remaining. That’s what I mean. A single lynch survival/any death survival is a decent addition for a mafioso (rules issues aside) and an excellent one for any given third party. Two such, or multiple such, would risk ruining the game, and I don’t believe it for a second. ---
**Author:** ![Scuba\_Ben](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/278dde/32.png) [@Scuba\_Ben](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scuba_Ben)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2011, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mystery-mafia-game-thread/593025/4926 "2011-09-07T20:43:41Z")
Thanks for the info, Suburban. From your list I infer that Scum would be VASTLY overpowered with two Night kill roles, thereby soft-supporting CQ’s claim of Third-party killer. ---
**Author:** ![Scuba\_Ben](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/278dde/32.png) [@Scuba\_Ben](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scuba_Ben)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2011, 8:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mystery-mafia-game-thread/593025/4927 "2011-09-07T20:45:31Z")
NETA: Ah, Normal, now I see what you mean. Yes, just as two killing roles on a team with a group kill would probably unbalance the game, being able to survive two kills as a feature of a role would also probably unbalance the game. I am disinclined to believe CQ’s threat. Nevertheless, I keep my vote on Episkey. ---
**Author:** ![Scathach](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Scathach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scathach)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2011, 8:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mystery-mafia-game-thread/593025/4928 "2011-09-07T20:55:30Z")
I’m ok with either vote at this stage. ---
**Author:** ![Suburban\_Plankton](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/suburban_plankton/32/219_2.png) [@Suburban\_Plankton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Suburban_Plankton)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2011, 8:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mystery-mafia-game-thread/593025/4929 "2011-09-07T20:56:31Z")
While we all ruminate over how much, if any, of **crackedquads** ’ story to believe, let me redirect your attention back to \*\*Episkey \*\*for a moment. Setting aside for a moment the Day Angel issue, can anyone see any reason why Episkey should not be lynched? My case on him was back in [Post 4869](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=14228973&postcount=4869). Is there any flaw in the argument that allows for him to be Town? ---
**Author:** ![Scathach](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Scathach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scathach)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2011, 9:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mystery-mafia-game-thread/593025/4930 "2011-09-07T21:00:42Z")
> [@Suburban\_Plankton](#): > > While we all ruminate over how much, if any, of **crackedquads** ’ story to believe, let me redirect your attention back to \*\*Episkey \*\*for a moment. Setting aside for a moment the Day Angel issue, can anyone see any reason why Episkey should not be lynched? > > My case on him was back in [Post 4869](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=14228973&postcount=4869). Is there any flaw in the argument that allows for him to be Town? Scuba ben could be scum? A lot of his results got directed back to him so there’s no guarantee of truth. I will say that I find that hugely unlikely. BlasterMaster (confirmed scum) was leading the lynch case on him on day one, and I doubt scum would try a gambit like that so early. ---
**Author:** ![Scuba\_Ben](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/278dde/32.png) [@Scuba\_Ben](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scuba_Ben)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2011, 9:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mystery-mafia-game-thread/593025/4931 "2011-09-07T21:10:30Z")
> [@Scathach](#): > > Scuba ben could be scum? A lot of his results got directed back to him so there’s no guarantee of truth. > > I will say that I find that hugely unlikely. BlasterMaster (confirmed scum) was leading the lynch case on him on day one, and I doubt scum would try a gambit like that so early. I have claimed one result was redirected on me, supported by Drain Bead claiming to have targeted me on that Night (N1), and Drain Bead and Idle Thoughts both claiming Drain Bead to be a Reflector. I have also claimed one Night where I intentionally targeted myself. That’s out of five claimed targets in four Nights. Where do you get “a lot” from? :dubious: (For the record, I have not claimed any targets last Night, only that I was blocked.) Yes, it’s possible that BlaM was bussing me on D2 (not D1 as you said). But I believe my conduct since then makes it unlikely that I’m Scum. What can I say? I’m a popular D2 target. ---
**Author:** ![Scathach](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Scathach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scathach)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2011, 9:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mystery-mafia-game-thread/593025/4932 "2011-09-07T21:19:44Z")
> [@Scuba\_Ben](#): > > I have claimed one result was redirected on me, supported by Drain Bead claiming to have targeted me on that Night (N1), and Drain Bead and Idle Thoughts both claiming Drain Bead to be a Reflector. > > I have also claimed one Night where I intentionally targeted myself. > > That’s out of five claimed targets in four Nights. Where do you get “a lot” from? :dubious: > > (For the record, I have not claimed any targets last Night, only that I was blocked.) > > Yes, it’s possible that BlaM was bussing me on D2 (not D1 as you said). But I believe my conduct since then makes it unlikely that I’m Scum. > > What can I say? I’m a popular D2 target. I’m not saying you didn’t target/get reflected on yourself, I’m saying you could have lied with those results. But, as I said, I really don’t think you’re scum. It’s just a faint possibility if, and only if, Episkey flips town. ---
**Author:** ![Episkey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7ba0ec/32.png) [@Episkey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Episkey)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2011, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mystery-mafia-game-thread/593025/4933 "2011-09-07T21:37:21Z")
> [@Suburban\_Plankton](#): > > While we all ruminate over how much, if any, of **crackedquads** ’ story to believe, let me redirect your attention back to \*\*Episkey \*\*for a moment. Setting aside for a moment the Day Angel issue, can anyone see any reason why Episkey should not be lynched? > > My case on him was back in [Post 4869](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=14228973&postcount=4869). Is there any flaw in the argument that allows for him to be Town? In regards to your case and potential flaws in your argument (I’ll speak as a third party here to refrain from the “I can read my pm” “prove it” “can’t obv” arguments of the past few days): 1. Your case relies entirely on the belief that one - and only one - of AskThePizzaGuy’s results were correct. 2. Your case does not factor in potential alterations to a whisper cause by a party other than my/ben’s role. This can include - but is not limited to - the wolves having a framer (They target a player, if that player is peeked it will return wolf). 3. Your case relies entirely on whispers that have been proven false on multiple occasions by players other than myself (Blaster is a townie was one I believe). 4. You also have not factored in the slight possibility that I could be a miller (I peek as a wolf), which would be a fine counterbalance to another seer-type player. I cannot fault you for your conclusions though. You’ve worked through the situation and have made plenty of intelligent deductions about what events are likely and what they mean. My main issue is that these whispers - which again have been proven false before - well, thats all that there is in a case against me. I could understand the focus on myself more if I had of been remotely scummy, but I cannot recall a single time someone has called me out for a scummy action regarding anything other than the messages. I also believe I have made intelligent arguments showcasing why a lot of the cases and reasons for voting me have been poor (From my breakdown of this role everyone assumes I have as scum being a pretty pro-town role in the long run all the way to the response of mine to Silver Jan highlighting how she cleared CQ for doing the exact same thing I did, yet voted me). It’s pretty shitty from my spot, because I believe I can adequately defend myself to any form of normal argument. In all my games over on POG (which by now is probably close to 20 after the last few I’ve played over there) I have never once been mislynched. I can’t figure out how to defend against something like “some weird mechanic that none of us can understand points to you being a wolf, and so you should be one” though. I don’t know how except to continuously jump up and down trying to explain everything I know about this game. ---
**Author:** ![Episkey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7ba0ec/32.png) [@Episkey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Episkey)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2011, 9:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mystery-mafia-game-thread/593025/4934 "2011-09-07T21:40:02Z")
As for Cracked Quads, I’ma mull this over. My initial reaction is he doesn’t claim if he has another life, but going to ponder for a bit. ---
**Author:** ![lilflower](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ecccb3/32.png) [@lilflower](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lilflower)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2011, 10:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mystery-mafia-game-thread/593025/4935 "2011-09-07T22:07:31Z")
Here is a thought: what if Drain Bead targets CQ and PCM (who claimed watcher, right?) watches Drain Bead to see if anyone tries to block or redirect her. It seems to me that it would be scummy to prevent CQ from dying at this point. CQ does not seem interested in helping town and has admitted to killing two players who he thought were town. Thoughts? ---
**Author:** ![Suburban\_Plankton](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/suburban_plankton/32/219_2.png) [@Suburban\_Plankton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Suburban_Plankton)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2011, 10:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mystery-mafia-game-thread/593025/4936 "2011-09-07T22:22:00Z")
> [@Episkey](#): > > In regards to your case and potential flaws in your argument (I’ll speak as a third party here to refrain from the “I can read my pm” “prove it” “can’t obv” arguments of the past few days): > > 1. Your case relies entirely on the belief that one - and only one - of AskThePizzaGuy’s results were correct. > > 2. Your case does not factor in potential alterations to a whisper cause by a party other than my/ben’s role. This can include - but is not limited to - the wolves having a framer (They target a player, if that player is peeked it will return wolf). > > 3. Your case relies entirely on whispers that have been proven false on multiple occasions by players other than myself (Blaster is a townie was one I believe). > > 4. You also have not factored in the slight possibility that I could be a miller (I peek as a wolf), which would be a fine counterbalance to another seer-type player. 1. No, my case does not rely on that belief. The fact that Ben has consistently given ‘true’ results and that you have consistently given ‘false’ ones, combined with the assumption that NAF is Town, point to that being the case. 2. True. My case does not factor in additional unknown parties intercepting and possibly modifying whispers. 3. I don’t know what you’re saying here. Yes, Blaster Master apparently gave a false whisper to Giraffe on Night 1. What of it? Dancecat also apparently gave a true whisper to Idle. I haven’t considered that either because it’s irrelevant, and none of that has anything to do with my case. 4. No Millers in this game, per The Rules. ---
**Author:** ![Episkey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7ba0ec/32.png) [@Episkey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Episkey)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2011, 10:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mystery-mafia-game-thread/593025/4937 "2011-09-07T22:29:26Z")
> [@Suburban\_Plankton](#): > > 1. No, my case does not rely on that belief. The fact that Ben has consistently given ‘true’ results and that you have consistently given ‘false’ ones, combined with the assumption that NAF is Town, point to that being the case. > > 2. True. My case does not factor in additional unknown parties intercepting and possibly modifying whispers. > > 3. I don’t know what you’re saying here. Yes, Blaster Master apparently gave a false whisper to Giraffe on Night 1. What of it? Dancecat also apparently gave a true whisper to Idle. I haven’t considered that either because it’s irrelevant, and none of that has anything to do with my case. > > 4. No Millers in this game, per The Rules. 1 and 2 go hand in hand. 1 is basically the set up. And yes, your entire case is reliant on that belief. “ATPG got two messages, both said wolf, NAF is town and we can’t account for how the 2nd can be false, so you’re a wolf” IS your case. Please correct me if I’m misinterpreting it. 2 is apparently the key then (if 4 isn’t a possibility. It’s weird to not have to account for millers/godfather. I think I like it though, less of a headdesk), which you do admit you haven’t factored in. 3 is simply evidence that we can’t take these whispers at face value blindly. Those messages themselves don’t factor in at all, just the fact that false messages are in the game, so why would it be a stretch to assume alterations are? Like I said, I don’t blame you for your conclusions. I’m laying out what your case is and explaining some guesses on why it’s wrong (like you asked people to do). ---
**Author:** ![special\_ed](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5ac83/32.png) [@special\_ed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/special_ed)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2011, 10:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mystery-mafia-game-thread/593025/4938 "2011-09-07T22:41:20Z")
Posting as I catch up > [@Suburban\_Plankton](#): > > Night 1: > Ben targeted gnarlycharlie, but was reflected back onto himself (by Drain Bead). He was told that Silver Jan is Town > Episkey targeted Silver Jan. Jan was told that gnarly is Scum (FALSE) > > Night 2: > Ben targeted Giraffe and Askthepizzaguy (having been doubled by Ed). Giraffe was told that pwnsall was Town (TRUE) and Pizza was told that Episkey and NAF were Scum. > Episkey targeted Pizza. Pizza was told that Episkey and NAF were Scum. > > Night 3: > Ben targeted himself. he was told that Weedy is town (TRUE). > Episkey targeted gnarly. gnarly was killed, so we don’t know what he would have been told. > > Night 4: > Ben targeted Drain Bead. Drain was told that Ed is Town. > Episkey targeted pwnsall, but Drain redirected him to himself. He was told that he is Scum. > > Ben has been responsible for true results on Nights 2 and 3. > Episkey has been responsible for a false result on Night 1. > > If we presume that the messages sent to Pizza on Night 2 came from Ben and Episkey, then Ben cannot be a Naive Cop, since we generated a ‘Scum’ result. Therefore he must be a True Cop. In that case, he must be responsible for the Episkey result, since we know NAF is Town (per Zeriel). That mans that Episkey is Scum. Bingo, and all of his other reported results are mumbo jumbo redirects, etc. garbage. Here’s a simple and large request: **Day Angel, if you are Town , please let us know. Your power can only steal our lynch. It’s not a pro-Town power. P\_lease claim and let us know you target last Night so that we won’t lynch that person. If you’re Scum, then die. die, die.** ---
**Author:** ![special\_ed](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5ac83/32.png) [@special\_ed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/special_ed)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2011, 10:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mystery-mafia-game-thread/593025/4939 "2011-09-07T22:43:55Z")
> [@crackedquads](#): > > Which I’ve done so shut the fuck up. > > My targets: > > N1: special ed > N2: Dancecat > N3: lilflower > N4: LightFoot > N5: pwnsall > > I was not successful N1 or N3. Lil was probably angeled N3 which is pretty lol considering how wolfy you were. I think I was roleblocked N1. > > Guess what happened to everyone else? > > They died. > > Drum roll pleaseeeeeeeeee: > > I’m a neutral vigilante > > My win condition is to survive until one side is victorious. It does not matter which side it is. I don’t remember why I targeted special ed, but I targeted dancecat cus I wanted to kill a 2p2er who could solve the game, N3 I wanted to balance it out and kill a wolf, thought lil flower was wolfy, and she was protected. N4 I almost targeted lilflower again but remember I couldn’t do it two nights in a row, so targeted Lightfoot instead. Last night I targeted pwnsall for pushing my wagon so hard and having you guys waste one of my lives. Crap, I’m dead? ---
**Author:** ![Episkey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7ba0ec/32.png) [@Episkey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Episkey)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2011, 10:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mystery-mafia-game-thread/593025/4940 "2011-09-07T22:43:57Z")
> [@special\_ed](#): > > Posting as I catch up > > Bingo, and all of his other reported results are mumbo jumbo redirects, etc. garbage. > > Here’s a simple and large request: > > **Day Angel, if you are Town , please let us know. Your power can only steal our lynch. It’s not a pro-Town power. P\_lease claim and let us know you target last Night so that we won’t lynch that person. If you’re Scum, then die. die, die.** " Episkey was redirected" “Episkey was roleblocked” Ed: “BINGO! Plus his other results are mumbo jumbo redirects, etc. garbage” 😕 ---
**Author:** ![Episkey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7ba0ec/32.png) [@Episkey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Episkey)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2011, 10:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mystery-mafia-game-thread/593025/4941 "2011-09-07T22:45:10Z")
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