# Names of Countries, but in other languages. **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [April 10, 2003, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/names-of-countries-but-in-other-languages/167808 "2003-04-10T15:51:46Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 18\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Floater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/dc4da7/32.png) [@Floater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Floater)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2003, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/names-of-countries-but-in-other-languages/167808/61 "2003-04-11T16:07:46Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by essohbee \* > Tyskland is Germany in Swedish and Norwegian, and quite possible in Danish as well. Quite correct on all three points. ---
**Author:** ![GargoyleWB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gargoylewb/32/199_2.png) [@GargoyleWB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GargoyleWB)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2003, 6:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/names-of-countries-but-in-other-languages/167808/62 "2003-04-11T18:55:27Z")
When I was studying Chinese, their rule of thumb for naming countries was a combination of trying to alliterate with the foreign word, while still keeping a literal sense in the language (in that each phoneme should also represent a literal word/idea). So “mei guo ren” for American, which is about as close as you can get phonetically to make a word in Chinese make sense out of an English word that has its meaning/derivation obscured by the mists of time. So even though the Chinese could phonetically say " american", it would be so nonsensical from their perspective that it would be useless. The often do it with brand names as well, for example Coca Cola being altered to sound phonetically similar, but using Chinese phonemes that also give it meaning. Now, as to why it’s Istanbul and not Constantinople, that’s no body’s business but the Turks. ---
**Author:** ![futureman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3da27b/32.png) [@futureman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/futureman)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2003, 5:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/names-of-countries-but-in-other-languages/167808/63 "2003-04-12T05:48:07Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by BwanaBob \* > \*\*There’s a difference with the USA’s name. There are direct translations for the words UNITED and STATES in other languages. I see no problem with Germany calling us Vereinigten Staaten von Amerika, etc. I’d have an issue if they had a new word for AMERICA. There no such “thing” as a “CANADA”,beyond that nations name, so no one has an excuse to call that country anything but CANADA. > > The OP about SVERIGE/SWEDEN is valid; in English there’s no reason to create a new word for Sverige. I’m not certain on its correct Swedish pronunciation, but I’m sure there’d be a reasonable close English approximation. Ditto for Suomi/Finland. > > You could find so many examples of this: Why isn’t the word for > Spain “Espania” in English? Certainly looks pronounceable and darn close to the Spanish? > > But I digress: in short, if it’s reasonably pronounceable, use the same damn word as the natives; shows much more respect.😉 \*\* This is a little crazy, because most languages don’t have all of the same sounds. There are certain words that are always translated, like prophets in the bible, the royal family and names of countries. In spain, you don’t hear about of Prince William of England, you hear about el Principe Guillermo de Inglaterra. It all depends on the country, really, because we don’t call Juan Carlos II, John Charles II, so its kind of a mixed bag. I see it like this: Every word in english is subject to translation for various reasons, be they cultural, phonetical, or historical. So our word for the country USA doesn’t need to be the same in every language. Our word for United States of America may be un-pronouncable to another language. What if, hypothetically, there was an indian word for the continent of America, if there were such a culture that existed. Would you say that they should call America by our name? Why? they were there first? Or, if an indian culture in Mexico had a name for North America if they knew of the landmass as a concept. If this hypothetical culture still existed, would they be wrong in using the old name? ---
**Author:** ![bonzer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/45deac/32.png) [@bonzer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bonzer)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2003, 11:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/names-of-countries-but-in-other-languages/167808/64 "2003-04-12T11:12:50Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by arjee \* > Also, do countries maintain official documents stating the names it uses to refer to other countries? The UK Government presumably uses the names as given in the [country profiles](http://www.fco.gov.uk/servlet/Front?pagename=OpenMarket/Xcelerate/ShowPage&c=Page&cid=1007029394365) pages on the Foreign & Commonwealth Office website. I don’t see any specific statement that these are the official UK names, but in [the obvious controversial case of Burma/Myanmar](http://www.fco.gov.uk/servlet/Front?pagename=OpenMarket/Xcelerate/ShowPage&c=Page&cid=1007029394365&a=KCountryProfile&aid=1018965307901) the page explains why they’ve adopted the official usage they have. The US State Department has a [similar listing](http://www.state.gov/s/inr/rls/4250.htm). In this case, it turns out that there is an explicit official policy about placenames (scroll to the bottom of the page). It doesn’t quite state that the country names on the page are also mandated, but I would assume so from the context. ---
**Author:** ![shep\_proudfoot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/90db22/32.png) [@shep\_proudfoot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/shep_proudfoot)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2003, 11:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/names-of-countries-but-in-other-languages/167808/65 "2003-04-12T11:41:25Z")
In Chinese, America is called Mei Guo £¨ÃÀ¹ú), Japan is called Ri Ben £¨ÈÕ±¾£©and England is called En Guo and India is Yin-doo. China in Chinese is Öйú¡£ ¹ú means “nation”, mostly. SP ---
**Author:** ![sotally\_tober](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/46a35a/32.png) [@sotally\_tober](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sotally_tober)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2003, 1:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/names-of-countries-but-in-other-languages/167808/66 "2003-04-12T13:42:50Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by shep proudfoot \* > \*\*In Chinese, America is called Mei Guo £¨ÃÀ¹ú), Japan is called Ri Ben £¨ÈÕ±¾£©and England is called En Guo and India is Yin-doo. > > China in Chinese is Öйú¡£ ¹ú means “nation”, mostly. > > SP \*\* erm…actually, England is ‘eng-ge-lan’ (ying1 ge2 lan2) in Mandrin and eng guo actually means the UK. And in chinese, many countires’ names end in ‘guo’ or country/nation because it is a shortened version. Btw, **shep proudfoot** i don’t know what chinese software you are using but i can’t read it apparently. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2003, 2:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/names-of-countries-but-in-other-languages/167808/67 "2003-04-12T14:13:58Z")
sotally tober: Set your browser encoding on Chinese Simplified. That should make it legible for you. ---
**Author:** ![tonbo0422](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b5e925/32.png) [@tonbo0422](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tonbo0422)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2003, 2:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/names-of-countries-but-in-other-languages/167808/68 "2003-04-12T14:36:48Z")
One of the weirdest has to be “Nihon.” Even the Japanese don’t know what they call themselves. Some older folk will say “Nippon” (a variant on the pronunciation) but it’s very far from “Japan,” (which some say came from some Chinese name, “Zipangu,” the origins of which are now lost in the mists of time.) But it DOESN’T mean “rising sun.” “Ni” means “day” (variant on “nichi,” meaning day) and “hon” means “original”, or “true,” as in “authentic.” It’s true that the character for “day” can also mean “sun,” but the word for “sun” is sometimes pronounced “hi” and I’ll warrant “hihon” would be difficult to pronounce even for Japanese. (Whoops. The word for “day” is also sometimes pronounced “hi.” Now do you know why Japanese is one of the most difficult languages to learn for westerners?) So one could reasonably call Japan “Authentic day.” But then one would be being unreasonable. My (digressional) question is: why do so many countries’ names end in “a”? ---
**Author:** ![tonbo0422](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b5e925/32.png) [@tonbo0422](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tonbo0422)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2003, 2:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/names-of-countries-but-in-other-languages/167808/69 "2003-04-12T14:41:36Z")
The Chinese “guo” must correspond to the Japanese “koku” (meaning country.) The Japanese usually call The U.S. “A-me-ri-ka” but they have their own term for it: beikoku, which literally means “country of rice.” ---
**Author:** ![Dreaming\_of\_Maria\_Callas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/f14d63/32.png) [@Dreaming\_of\_Maria\_Callas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dreaming_of_Maria_Callas)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2003, 2:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/names-of-countries-but-in-other-languages/167808/70 "2003-04-12T14:44:02Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by tonbo0422 \* > **But it DOESN’T mean “rising sun.” “Ni” means “day” (variant on “nichi,” meaning day) and “hon” means “original”, or “true,” as in “authentic.” It’s true that the character for “day” can also mean “sun,” but the word for “sun” is sometimes pronounced “hi” and I’ll warrant “hihon” would be difficult to pronounce even for Japanese.** The standard Chinese name for Japan, ri4ben3, can be seen as meaning “sun origin”. I wonder how much influence that had on the Japanese name Nippon. > [@](#): > > \*\*My (digressional) question is: why do so many countries’ names end in “a”? \*\* Many countries end in -a or -ia because countries names in Latin - a language which Western explorers and empire makers knew something of - end mostly in -ia. UnuMondo ---
**Author:** ![tonbo0422](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b5e925/32.png) [@tonbo0422](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tonbo0422)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2003, 2:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/names-of-countries-but-in-other-languages/167808/71 "2003-04-12T14:48:29Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Finite Elephant \* > \*\*Tae Han Min Guk = Republic of Korea > > The name “Korea” comes from the name of the Dynasty that was in power when Korea first made contact with Europeans and Middle Easterners. The name in various forms just stuck from there. > > In the ROK, they refer to themselves as “han-guk” while in the DPRK they use the older “choson,” perhaps to bolster their claim of being the True Korea. > > And as always, I apologize for inept romanization of han-guk mal. \*\* Interesting. When I was teaching in Japan the North Korean students would refer to themselves as “Chosen-jin” (“Chosen” people) but the Japanese would mutter that that was racist, and to call them “Kankoku-jin”, or “Koreans.” Dunno the character for “kan” as in “kankoku.” ---
**Author:** ![tonbo0422](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b5e925/32.png) [@tonbo0422](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tonbo0422)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2003, 2:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/names-of-countries-but-in-other-languages/167808/72 "2003-04-12T14:50:36Z")
;???iginally posted by UnuMondo \* \*\*The standard Chinese name for Japan, ri4ben3, can be seen as meaning “sun origin”. I wonder how much influence that had on the Japanese name Nippon. Many countries end in -a or -ia because countries names in Latin - a language which Western explorers and empire makers knew something of - end mostly in -ia. UnuMondo \*\* [/QUOTE] Aaah.😃 ---
**Author:** ![tonbo0422](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b5e925/32.png) [@tonbo0422](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tonbo0422)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2003, 2:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/names-of-countries-but-in-other-languages/167808/73 "2003-04-12T14:52:31Z")
The Chinese “guo” must correspond to the Japanese “koku” (meaning country.) The Japanese usually call The U.S. “A-me-ri-ka” but they have their own term for it: beikoku, which literally means “country of rice.” ---
**Author:** ![Charlie\_Tan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/charlie_tan/32/12582_2.png) [@Charlie\_Tan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Charlie_Tan)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2003, 11:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/names-of-countries-but-in-other-languages/167808/74 "2003-04-14T11:50:01Z")
**Let’s clear up Sweden = Sverige, shall we** The country that became Sweden was originally three countries: Eastern and Western Gothia and the Kingdom of Svea. TO simplify, these countries were ruled by diferent clans. The Swedish Name for kingdom is **rike** (compare with German _reich_. A thousand years ago, it was spelled **rige** and when Sweden was united, incorporating the two Gothias (where goth comes from, obviously) it came under one name: Svea Rige (Kingdom of Svea). This later got transformed to **Sverige**. So where did **Sweden** come from? Iceland. Their name for the _people_ of Svea (the Swedish) was **Svitiod** , pronounced (more or less) Sveet-yod. From there, the transformation to Sweden is more reasonable, than trying to get Sverige to Sweden. The people living on the British Islands had a lot of contact with the Icelanders and they in turn, being Scandinavian, had contact with the Vikings. ---
**Author:** ![Finite\_Elephant](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/a88e57/32.png) [@Finite\_Elephant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Finite_Elephant)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2003, 12:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/names-of-countries-but-in-other-languages/167808/75 "2003-04-14T12:19:59Z")
In Bruce Cumings’ book, _Korea’s Place in the Sun_, he passes on the theory (based on historical records from the Koryea dynasty) that the word “Nippon” was what the Koreans called people from those islands to the east. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2003, 6:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/names-of-countries-but-in-other-languages/167808/76 "2003-04-14T18:15:12Z")
In Hebrew, the U.S. is called Artzot HaBrit, which translates, more or less to “Lands of the Alliance”. I don’t know why - the UN is called HaUmot HaMeuchadot, which translates to directly to the United Nations. That aside, most names either follow the Latin - Anglia, Italia, Germania - or the English pronounciation. Exceptions include Tzarfat (France), Sfarad (Spain) or Yavan (Greece), with the last being a particularly ancient name; I really don’t know where they’re from. Sweden, BTW, is called Shvedia, while China is Sin. ---
**Author:** ![Richard](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f0a364/32.png) [@Richard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Richard)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2003, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/names-of-countries-but-in-other-languages/167808/77 "2003-04-15T15:40:50Z")
When I lived in Holland, I was surprised to find that some cities there have no English names, at least as far as I could find out. Of course, for places like Amsterdam and Rotterdam, there’s no problem with using the Dutch names. The capital, 'sGravenhage, has a name which is basically unpronouncable in English (even the Dutch typically call it just “den Haag”), so it has the English name of “the Hague”. However, another city with a similar name, 'sHertogenbosch, has no English name that I could find. On most non-Dutch maps it seems to be identified by the French name, “Bois le Duc”, but that’s almost as hard to pronounce in English. The Dutch shorten it to “den Bos”, and that’s easy enough to pronounce, but that doesn’t seem to be a name that is used in English. I wouldn’t expect every small village to have an English name, but den Bos is a pretty important city. ---
**Author:** ![Ryan\_Liam](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ryan_liam/32/3965_2.png) [@Ryan\_Liam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ryan_Liam)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2003, 4:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/names-of-countries-but-in-other-languages/167808/78 "2003-04-15T16:13:53Z")
Bharat=India [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/names-of-countries-but-in-other-languages/167808.md?page=3)