# Nastygram for absence **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [June 12, 2015, 9:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nastygram-for-absence/722388 "2015-06-12T21:18:54Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 12\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Omar\_Little](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omar_little/32/269_2.png) [@Omar\_Little](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omar_Little)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2015, 2:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nastygram-for-absence/722388/41 "2015-06-15T14:20:39Z")
Why sweat it **steronz**? You know why your kids have been absent and you have been taking responsibility to insure that your kids are keeping up despite their absences. I would suspect that you are the exception. In my experience with public schools, there is a high rate of kids (even younger age) that miss a lot of school for a myriad of reasons and their parents aren’t as diligent as you are. You shouldn’t expect yourself to be excluded from the form letter that is sent out for absences just because you already spoke to your kids teachers about it. Interesting that your school considers family vacations an “excused absence”. That has never been an excused absence in any of the schools my children have attended, private or public. ---
**Author:** ![WhyNot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c77e96/32.png) [@WhyNot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WhyNot)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2015, 2:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nastygram-for-absence/722388/42 "2015-06-15T14:21:52Z")
> [@steronz](#): > > Is this a woosh? How so? No, it’s not a “woosh”. You seem to think that all they can do to you is send you sternly worded letters. There’s a lot more they can do, and depending on the age of your child and the laws in your state, 11 absences puts them well within the “chronic truancy” level requiring family court intervention. Please note, I don’t share the opinion that this is necessarily a problem. I totally get why your particular kid missed so many days, and I think you did a great thing as far as the benefits go. I just don’t think you have a grasp of the risks. Because, yes, schools consider 11 days a whole lot. ---
**Author:** ![Inner\_Stickler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inner_stickler/32/318_2.png) [@Inner\_Stickler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inner_Stickler)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2015, 2:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nastygram-for-absence/722388/43 "2015-06-15T14:25:52Z")
This thread is fascinating. I feel like I’m in an alternate dimension where the traffic lights go red, yellow, purple. ---
**Author:** ![steronz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steronz/32/11765_2.png) [@steronz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/steronz)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2015, 2:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nastygram-for-absence/722388/44 "2015-06-15T14:31:16Z")
> [@WhyNot](#): > > How so? No, it’s not a “woosh”. You seem to think that all they can do to you is send you sternly worded letters. There’s a lot more they can do, and depending on the age of your child and the laws in your state, 11 absences puts them well within the “chronic truancy” level requiring family court intervention. But my kids had 0 days of truancy this year… and every year, because they’ve never had an unexcused (or “unlawful”) absence. ---
**Author:** ![steronz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steronz/32/11765_2.png) [@steronz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/steronz)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2015, 2:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nastygram-for-absence/722388/45 "2015-06-15T14:34:32Z")
> [@Omar\_Little](#): > > Interesting that your school considers family vacations an “excused absence”. That has never been an excused absence in any of the schools my children have attended, private or public. Only family vacations with prior approval are excused. We had to go to the office and do a form, if they refused to sign off the form we could have pulled the kids anyway and those would have been marked as unexcused. I suppose it’s likely that if my kids were older they wouldn’t have approved. ---
**Author:** ![IvoryTowerDenizen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ivorytowerdenizen/32/17937_2.png) [@IvoryTowerDenizen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/IvoryTowerDenizen)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2015, 2:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nastygram-for-absence/722388/46 "2015-06-15T14:56:45Z")
> [@Omar\_Little](#): > > Interesting that your school considers family vacations an “excused absence”. That has never been an excused absence in any of the schools my children have attended, private or public. In our previous district “excused” simply means the parents are aware of and ok’d the absence (as opposed to the child being truant). There were three categories: unexcused (truant)- it’s up to the teacher to allow make up work excused (parents know)- it’s up to the teacher to allow make up work approved (doctor’s notes, religious holidays etc)- make up work must be provided A child could only have a certain number of absences in each category before consequences came into play (with very few in the unexcused, limited number in excused and more in approved). Our current district does away with the excused/approved distinction, which is nice. I can keep my kid home when he’s ill and not have to go to the doc just to get a note to make it an approved absence. There is a reasonable number of allowed absences that covers everything I can imagine needing to do. I think there is some rule about multiple days in a row needing a doc note or something. ---
**Author:** ![steronz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steronz/32/11765_2.png) [@steronz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/steronz)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2015, 3:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nastygram-for-absence/722388/47 "2015-06-15T15:05:34Z")
> [@IvoryTowerDenizen](#): > > Our current district does away with the excused/approved distinction, which is nice. I can keep my kid home when he’s ill and not have to go to the doc just to get a note to make it an approved absence. There is a reasonable number of allowed absences that covers everything I can imagine needing to do. I think there is some rule about multiple days in a row needing a doc note or something. I think that’s the same thing this school does. I read through the guidance and it says that all personal illnesses _may_ require a doctor’s note, but it’s up to the school’s discretion. I guess we can add that to the list of things the school can do to annoy/inconvenience me beyond sternly worded letters, they could start requiring that I take my kid to the doctor every time they need to stay home. At 5 \*unexcused \*absences, a letter goes home to the parents and the school no longer has any discretion about doctors’ notes – they’re required. At 10 unexcused absences, there’s a mandatory attendance review. But no word on excused/approved absences. ---
**Author:** ![IvoryTowerDenizen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ivorytowerdenizen/32/17937_2.png) [@IvoryTowerDenizen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/IvoryTowerDenizen)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2015, 3:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nastygram-for-absence/722388/48 "2015-06-15T15:19:35Z")
i Can tell you (now that my youngest is a high school junior- almost senior) that we did pull them out once for a family vacation for 5 days when they were in early elementary school. After about K or 1st grade it became a huge hassle for them to miss school. They did so much in the classroom (including music and art projects) that a packet of worksheets can’t make up. Plus, It was incredible annoying to have them working on school work while we were on vacation. We only did it for real family emergencies (like when their grandfather died). They get winter break, two breaks in spring and summer- we just made it work. ---
**Author:** ![Drunky\_Smurf](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drunky_smurf/32/449_2.png) [@Drunky\_Smurf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Drunky_Smurf)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2015, 7:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nastygram-for-absence/722388/49 "2015-06-15T19:36:26Z")
> [@WhyNot](#): > > This is a form letter that doesn’t even include my \*name \*on it. What a bunch of jerk asses. ---
**Author:** ![Hershele\_Ostropoler](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e47c2d/32.png) [@Hershele\_Ostropoler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hershele_Ostropoler)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2015, 12:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nastygram-for-absence/722388/50 "2015-06-17T00:34:10Z")
> [@MandaJo](#): > > But it never threatened to take away the kids–it just said “Hey, school is important”. That’s probably what they’re aiming for. But try reading the letters – the letters your district sends, say, or the letter **steronz** received – from the perspective of someone who doesn’t believe the system is on their side, who may believe it is against them. Not in a paranoid “the CIA is in my tooth fillings” way, just, they’re not on the culture’s Approved List for whatever reason. > [@](#): > > You seem to assume that anyone keeping their kid out of school is either a shitty parent or has absolutely no other choice. And sometimes that’s true. But sometimes it’s just a matter of not prioritizing, and an early, low-key intervention can help. If it doesn’t, then you escalate. Hopefully in a constructive, positive way. This was not, as you sporadically concede, constructive or positive. Let’s say it’s 10 percent shitty parents, 10 percent desperate parents, and 80 percent – you’re not all that clear on what other categories you’re envisioning, but fine. Even for those 80 percent, I fail to see how starting with a scrupulously non-confrontational approach can be a bad option. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2015, 1:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nastygram-for-absence/722388/51 "2015-06-17T01:55:35Z")
> [@steronz](#): > > At some point my wife went in to talk to the teachers about this vacation – do you think the teachers at any point tried to talk us out of it? Did they say, “By the way, if your kid gets sick for a few days on top of this then it’s going to prompt a letter at the end of the year chastising you for taking this vacation that we are, right now, not objecting to?” Did they refer us to the school leadership? We jump through these hoops and then the school nags us well after the fact because, what, they can’t possibly know what all of these absences were for? Despite having policies in place designed to capture just that information? Three possibilities: 1. If your wife talked to the teachers in passing–say, at dismissal–it may totally have slipped the teachers’ minds to record it as excused. Or if there are multiple teachers, maybe just one teacher flaked. 2. Maybe the database designer responsible for sending out these letters screwed up and sent them out for total absences, not just unexcused ones. 3. Maybe there’s a dumb state law requiring the letter to be sent out. In any case, I’d make a quick call to the principal to verify that those absences are counted as excused; it might help the principal improve the system, if nothing else. > [@even\_sven](#): > > So look at the note, say “that doesn’t apply in our circumstances” and move on. Or this (snarky second and third sentences removed) is great advice. > [@Hershele\_Ostropoler](#): > > That’s probably what they’re aiming for. But try reading the letters – the letters your district sends, say, or the letter **steronz** received – from the perspective of someone who doesn’t believe the system is on their side, who may believe it is against them. Not in a paranoid “the CIA is in my tooth fillings” way, just, they’re not on the culture’s Approved List for whatever reason. I honestly don’t know what the best answer is. Our district sends out similar letters. But when, every few years, I have a chronically truant student, I don’t think the letters help. What helps is the school social worker contacting the family and explaining in detail what the truancy laws are–or sometimes just taking out a warrant for the parents’ arrest on truancy charges. Sometimes that last step is the only thing that will get parents to bring their kids to school. The parents who take their kids on long vacations and contact the teacher in advance are IME never the parents whose children are suffering. That may change in high school, I dunno; when I was a kid, I went on a monthlong trip in second grade, and a three week trip in high school, and maintained high grades (although apparently my parents didn’t let my teachers know about the high school trip, leading to at least one teacher withdrawing me from her class–but that’s another story). ---
**Author:** ![LinusK](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/258eb7/32.png) [@LinusK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LinusK)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2015, 2:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nastygram-for-absence/722388/52 "2015-06-17T02:23:56Z")
> [@WhyNot](#): > > I have to agree. **Manda Jo** , you’re an excellent educator and I really respect you as a poster and genuinely awesome human being, but this is one of those times where you’ve got blinders on because of your position. (It happens to all of us sooner or later!) I appreciate hearing from the education/administration perspective why they’re doing it like this, but from the parent perspective, it’s nothing but destructive. What you’re saying you’re trying to accomplish is good and admirable, but this is the exact wrong way to go about it. > > **“Dear Parent/Guardian,”** > This is tone deaf. This is the opposite of individualized instruction or intervention. This is a form letter that doesn’t even include my \*name \*on it. There’s no WAY I’m going to read this letter as an expression of sincere concern for the personal struggles potentially happening in my household and an offer of individualized assistance in an effort to relieve me of my burdens and ensure that my child gets the best education possible. I’m going to read it as one more burden, a threat from someone who doesn’t know or care what my family is dealing with, one more thing I have to figure out if I can fix or safely ignore for the moment. (I’m probably going to think it’s motivated by money (the school loses money when my kid isn’t there), because my biggest problem is money, so whenever another problem comes up, my mind fits money into the problem somehow.) > > **“if your child continues to miss this amount of school in the future, it will certainly inhibit their success,”** > This makes me think, “If you don’t even know my name, how “certain” can you be that \*my \*child’s success will be inhibited? How well do you know \*my \*child? How DARE you claim to know my child and what she can handle better than I do? Fuck you.” > > **“I am confident that this pattern of absences will not continue.”** > Fuck. You. You. Cocksucking. Motherfucking. Arrogant. Condescending. Asshole. Guess what? We’re going to the zoo next Tuesday. Just because. And maybe the Art Institute. Maybe we’ll fly to DC and go wander the Smithsonian and actually learn something besides how to take a bullshit standardized test. Goddammit, maybe I really should look into homeschooling, because this bullshit make me so fucking angry I could punch you in the throat next time I see you at drop off. > > Three sentences, and I’m unable to listen to another thing you say for the rest of the school year (or next school year, in this instance.) This sets up an adversarial relationship between my child’s educators and me. It does \*not \*get us on the same side with the same goals in support of my child. It makes me afraid and/or disdainful and blindingly angry, not enlightened or empowered. > > Your goals are laudable, and make sense, and thank you for sharing them. This particular letter does the inverse of helping us meet those goals, however. Yeah, this kind of thing is part of the reason my daughter is in private school. The combination of condescending arrogance, laziness, and assembly-line attitude toward kids is intolerable. I feel your pain, and just reading the note makes me angry. The automatic assumption that if your kid’s not in school you’re a bad parent is insane. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nastygram-for-absence/722388.md?page=2)