# National Do Not Call List may be illegal? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [September 24, 2003, 4:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/national-do-not-call-list-may-be-illegal/203564 "2003-09-24T16:43:57Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Strainger](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/strainger/32/244_2.png) [@Strainger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Strainger)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2003, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/national-do-not-call-list-may-be-illegal/203564/61 "2003-09-25T17:34:12Z")
[Hot damn!](http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=578&ncid=578&e=2&u=/nm/20030925/ts_nm/telecoms_telemarketing_dc) I love the quotes in that article. > [@](#): > > “I want to thank the judge for making us all love each other,” New York Democratic Rep. Eliot Engel said. My first impression of John Dingell was that he must be from one of the Carolinas. (Nope. Michigan.) Heh. ---
**Author:** ![mhendo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mhendo/32/3159_2.png) [@mhendo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mhendo)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2003, 5:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/national-do-not-call-list-may-be-illegal/203564/62 "2003-09-25T17:35:50Z")
When i first heard the news about the court decision, i was pretty pissed off. However, i’m pretty confident that Congress will do whatever needs to be doone to get this list working. Too many people are too pissed off at telemarketers for the politicians to simply ignore the issue. Some people have been saying that it’s not a good idea to bombard the poor receptionist with calls about telemarketing. I tend to agree. But i would like to add that i’m also opposed to those who have been posting the judge’s telephone number on the internet and bombarding him with calls since his decision. While i may not like the decision, i don’t feel qualified to make a legal assessment of it, and even if i did, it is perfectly possible for two reasonable and qualified people to disagree over a legal interpretation. I think we need to do what we can to encourage those in the justice system to make their decisions based on the law, not on angry public sentiment, and harrassing judges in their homes is not really the way to do this. Despite the claims of the politicians, it is possible that the judge had a perfectly good legal reason to make the ruling that he did, and until i know more about it, i’m going to hold off on the criticism. And i’m certainly not going to take it upon myself to call him at home. ---
**Author:** ![blowero](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/41988e/32.png) [@blowero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/blowero)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2003, 5:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/national-do-not-call-list-may-be-illegal/203564/63 "2003-09-25T17:47:59Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Bruce\_Daddy \* > \*\*After the phone quits ringing I wait 30 seconds to see if I get a new message. If so, I check it and if it’s a real person I call them back and say sorry, I was . . . > > Now if they never leave you a message, then you’ve got problems. \*\* Think about it: Imagine you need to hire someone to do some work for you tomorrow. You have a list of prospective people to do the job - Are you going to leave a message and just sit and wait for me to call you back, or are you just going to move on to the next person on your list? In the real world, they do it the latter way. Also consider the already-mentioned point that people might have sick relatives and do not have the luxury of screening every call that comes in. And finally, consider that it’s just plain rude to screen calls. Besides which, isn’t the point really - Why should we have to go to such great pains to keep from getting telemarketing calls that nobody wants? We’re talking about people who have taken the positive step of signing up for the Do Not Call list; that means none of us want to get any telemarketing calls, ever. Let’s say my neighbor drenches me with his garden hose every morning as I’m walking to my car - I _could_ wear a raincoat every day, but the more satisfactory solution would be for him to stop doing it. ---
**Author:** ![OpalCat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/8edcca/32.png) [@OpalCat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OpalCat)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2003, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/national-do-not-call-list-may-be-illegal/203564/64 "2003-09-25T17:48:34Z")
I think we should start an organization that provides free autodialers to enraged citizens that are programmed to call the telemarketers (and only the telemarketers) endlessly with various recorded messages. If we got, say, 500,000 people with these to turn them on 24/7 we may make a difference. So… I’ve got $3.37… anyone else want to chip in? ---
**Author:** ![blowero](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/41988e/32.png) [@blowero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/blowero)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2003, 6:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/national-do-not-call-list-may-be-illegal/203564/65 "2003-09-25T18:03:47Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Jonathan Chance \* > Really, again think of the **goal**. The only thing that will stop it (other than government fiat) is for everyone to stop buying. The simple fact is that it’s so cheap to do that it’s insanely profitable for the firms that do it. \*\* I don’t know that I agree with that. I think you’re underestimating the power of publicity. The Dave Barry stunt got a lot of press, and just look how Congressmen are already scrambling to do something about the situation. There’s _always_ gonna be one moron in a thousand who will buy some shit from a telemarketer (Double my I.Q. or no money back? Duh, I don’t know…O.K., sounds good to me). If we just throw up our hands and say we can’t do anything about it, then for sure nothing will get done. But when people make a stink…the squeaky wheel and all that. You’re right in that things won’t change without the government stepping in, but I think the more publicity about people’s dislike for telemarketing, the more our elected officials are going to think twice before voting against legislation. ---
**Author:** ![Casey1505](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/dc4da7/32.png) [@Casey1505](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Casey1505)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2003, 6:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/national-do-not-call-list-may-be-illegal/203564/66 "2003-09-25T18:28:04Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by blowero \* > And finally, consider that it’s just plain rude to screen calls. Why? I am under no obligation whatsoever to pick up my phone if it is ringing. Just like you are under no obligation to leave a message and wait for my return call if the opportunity presents itself. ---
**Author:** ![Otto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Otto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Otto)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2003, 6:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/national-do-not-call-list-may-be-illegal/203564/67 "2003-09-25T18:30:44Z")
> [@](#): > > And finally, consider that it’s just plain rude to screen calls. Pardon my hijack, but why is it rude to screen calls? Let’s say I’m expecting an important call about an exciting freelance opportunity and I don’t have call waiting. The phone rings, I pick it up and it’s lovable Aunt Gert, who talks my ear off just long enough for that potential employer to call and get a busy signal. Or Aunt Gert can leave a message on your voice mail while you talk to your prospective boss so you can earn money to buy Aunt Gert a lovely floral arrangement for her birthday. Where’s the rudeness? ---
**Author:** ![lost4life](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/c4cdca/32.png) [@lost4life](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lost4life)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2003, 6:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/national-do-not-call-list-may-be-illegal/203564/68 "2003-09-25T18:39:41Z")
Okay, here’s a question. Suppose the telemarketers are given access to the list in order to ensure they don’t break any laws. Somewhere down the road the law is determined to be unconstitutional. Do the telemarketers now have a list a 50 million numbers to call that they know are active? ---
**Author:** ![Mars\_Horizon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mars_horizon/32/2804_2.png) [@Mars\_Horizon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mars_Horizon)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2003, 6:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/national-do-not-call-list-may-be-illegal/203564/69 "2003-09-25T18:40:25Z")
IIRC, the US population is slightly less than 300 million people. If 50 million have **already** opted out in just a few months, that means 1 out of 6 people dislike telemarketing enough to do something about stopping the calls in a hurry. :eek: ---
**Author:** ![Bruce\_Daddy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/85f322/32.png) [@Bruce\_Daddy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bruce_Daddy)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2003, 6:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/national-do-not-call-list-may-be-illegal/203564/70 "2003-09-25T18:41:42Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by blowero \* > \*\*Think about it: Imagine you need to hire someone to do some work for you tomorrow. You have a list of prospective people to do the job - Are you going to leave a message and just sit and wait for me to call you back, or are you just going to move on to the next person on your list? In the real world, they do it the latter way. Also consider the already-mentioned point that people might have sick relatives and do not have the luxury of screening every call that comes in. And finally, consider that it’s just plain rude to screen calls. You are absolutlely right. I was offering anecdotal.evidence of what works for me, but _of course_ there are exceptions to every situation and everybody. > [@](#): > > Besides which, isn’t the point really - Why should we have to go to such great pains to keep from getting telemarketing calls that nobody wants? We’re talking about people who have taken the positive step of signing up for the Do Not Call list; that means none of us want to get any telemarketing calls, ever. Let’s say my neighbor drenches me with his garden hose every morning as I’m walking to my car - I _could_ wear a raincoat every day, but the more satisfactory solution would be for him to stop doing it. I actually came back to this thread to express my joy at the House to have the big balls to tell that federal judge to cram it. I signed up for the list the first day it was available, not that my cell phone gets that much spam, a call per month or so. ---
**Author:** ![Casey1505](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/dc4da7/32.png) [@Casey1505](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Casey1505)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2003, 6:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/national-do-not-call-list-may-be-illegal/203564/71 "2003-09-25T18:49:58Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Mars Horizon \* > \*\*IIRC, the US population is slightly less than 300 million people. If 50 million have **already** opted out in just a few months, that means 1 out of 6 people dislike telemarketing enough to do something about stopping the calls in a hurry. :eek: \*\* Actually, it’s over 50 million _households_. Figuring at least 2 people per household (no cite, just figured it sounds reasonable), that’s 1/3 of the population. ---
**Author:** ![LilyoftheValley](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/54ee81/32.png) [@LilyoftheValley](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LilyoftheValley)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2003, 7:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/national-do-not-call-list-may-be-illegal/203564/72 "2003-09-25T19:16:08Z")
I just [read](http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=578&ncid=578&e=1&u=/nm/20030925/ts_nm/telecoms_telemarketing_dc)that: > [@](#): > > The House of Representatives voted 412-8 to give the Federal Trade Commission authority to run the national “do not call” registry of phone numbers, which telemarketers would be prohibited to call. Out of curiousity, anyone know who those 8 are? ---
**Author:** ![blowero](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/41988e/32.png) [@blowero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/blowero)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2003, 7:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/national-do-not-call-list-may-be-illegal/203564/73 "2003-09-25T19:38:15Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Casey1505 \* > \*\*Why? I am under no obligation whatsoever to pick up my phone if it is ringing. Just like you are under no obligation to leave a message and wait for my return call if the opportunity presents itself. \*\* Hmmm…I wasn’t too clear on that, was I? I didn’t mean to imply that you shouldn’t be free to screen calls if you want to, I just meant people shouldn’t be _forced_ to have to screen calls just to keep the asshole telemarketers at bay. If you like screening your calls, that cool. Personally, I _don’t_ like to screen my calls, for the reasons I mentioned before. I know many people who are rather put-off by calling someone and being in the middle of leaving a message, only to have the person pick up the phone and say “Oh, hi…”, or to have them call back like _one minute_ later. I personally don’t like doing it that way, and would prefer to not have to do so - YMMV. ---
**Author:** ![Casey1505](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/dc4da7/32.png) [@Casey1505](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Casey1505)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2003, 7:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/national-do-not-call-list-may-be-illegal/203564/74 "2003-09-25T19:39:14Z")
Go [here](http://capwiz.com/c-span/dbq/issuesdbq/votesearch.dbq?command=monthres&month=September&chamber=H&congress=1081&submit.x=38&submit.y=12) tomorrow, and it might have it up. The last entry was yesterday, so everything’s probably a day behind. ---
**Author:** ![Bruce\_Daddy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/85f322/32.png) [@Bruce\_Daddy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bruce_Daddy)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2003, 7:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/national-do-not-call-list-may-be-illegal/203564/75 "2003-09-25T19:45:17Z")
> [@](#): > > The eight who voted against the bill were: > Ron Paul, R-Texas; > Jeff Flake, R-Ariz.; > Kendrick Meek, D-Fla.; > Tim Ryan, D-Ohio; > Ted Strickland, D-Ohio; > Lee Terry, R-Neb.; > Rob Bishop, R-Utah, and > Chris Cannon, R-Utah. From [Yahoo!](http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&ncid=&e=1&u=/ap/20030925/ap_on_bi_ge/do_not_call) I guess this proves there are idiots in both parties. ---
**Author:** ![Casey1505](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/dc4da7/32.png) [@Casey1505](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Casey1505)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2003, 7:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/national-do-not-call-list-may-be-illegal/203564/76 "2003-09-25T19:45:43Z")
Speaking of unclear, **blowero** , that last post was for **LilyoftheValley**. I wasn’t telling you to go anywhere warm or anything. That’s not my style. ---
**Author:** ![Jonathan\_Chance](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jonathan_chance/32/701_2.png) [@Jonathan\_Chance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jonathan_Chance)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2003, 7:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/national-do-not-call-list-may-be-illegal/203564/77 "2003-09-25T19:52:27Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Casey1505 \* > \*\*Actually, it’s over 50 million _households_. Figuring at least 2 people per household (no cite, just figured it sounds reasonable), that’s 1/3 of the population. \*\* Actually, I think this is a misinterpretation, too. I think it’s 50 Million **numbers** that have opted out. I wouldn’t care to speculate how many individual landline phone numbers there are in the US. And here are the nays from the House: Representatives Bishop (R-UT) Cannon ® Flake ® Meek (D-FL) Paul ® Ryan (D-OH) Strickland (D) Terry ® I live to serve. Here’s the entire voting list: [http://clerk.house.gov/cgi-bin/vote.exe?year=2003&rollnumber=521](http://clerk.house.gov/cgi-bin/vote.exe?year=2003&rollnumber=521) Nice to see that mine was on the side of the angels this time. Not often that happens IMHO. ---
**Author:** ![blowero](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/41988e/32.png) [@blowero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/blowero)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2003, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/national-do-not-call-list-may-be-illegal/203564/78 "2003-09-25T19:56:03Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by LilyoftheValley \* > I just [read](http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=578&ncid=578&e=1&u=/nm/20030925/ts_nm/telecoms_telemarketing_dc)that: > > ## quote: > > ## The House of Representatives voted 412-8 to give the Federal Trade Commission authority to run the national “do not call” registry of phone numbers, which telemarketers would be prohibited to call. Yes!!! In your face! Suck my hairy nutsack, DMA. Slam dunked YOUR ass, butthead Oklahoma judge. USA!!! USA!!! This thing’s got momentum now - I bet it gets through the Senate pretty quick. > [@](#): > > Out of curiousity, anyone know who those 8 are? Hopefully, 8 soon-to-be-voted-out-of-office Representatives.😃 That judge’s decision was obviously a festering pile of shit. His reasoning was that the Congress didn’t grant authority to the FTC to implement the list. Well what the fuck is THIS? [http://www.theorator.com/bills108/hr395.html](http://www.theorator.com/bills108/hr395.html) > [@](#): > > H.R. 395 > 3/11/2003 > Became Public Law No: 108-10 > > 108th CONGRESS > 1st Session > > H. R. 395 > > To authorize the **Federal Trade Commission** to collect fees for the implementation and enforcement of a `do-not-call’ registry, and for other purposes. Anyway, it looks like it’s soon to be a moot point. They’re just gonna pass a _new_ law. ---
**Author:** ![Strainger](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/strainger/32/244_2.png) [@Strainger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Strainger)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2003, 7:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/national-do-not-call-list-may-be-illegal/203564/79 "2003-09-25T19:58:27Z")
I see my suck-ass Congressman voted against it. I didn’t like him before and like him even less now. Time for a letter. ---
**Author:** ![Larry\_Mudd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f14d63/32.png) [@Larry\_Mudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Mudd)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2003, 8:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/national-do-not-call-list-may-be-illegal/203564/80 "2003-09-25T20:51:17Z")
I’m sure that the telemarketing folks are looking ahead to the consequences of the significantly smaller pool of numbers they’d have to call, too: Unless the industry as a body decides to cut back on their calling relative to the number of people who have opted out, (which seems unlikely given the competitive nature of commerce,) the people who _so far_ haven’t been bothered enough to opt out themselves are going to find themselves taking that many more nuisance calls. Say the volume suddenly goes up 15% or 20%, running with **Casey** ’s estimate. How many of _those_ people remaining are going to find that increase enough of a motivation to look up that number again? After they wise up, the telemarketing time that would have otherwise been taken up by calling them gets shared by the remaining suckers… So telesales businesses have to make the conscious decision to spend less time _selling_, effectively taking one for the ‘team’, if they want to avoid this scenario. Never gonna happen-- what if some _other company_ sells someone on the list they’re working from vinyl siding or steam cleaning, first? So with every iteration of the list being updated, there will be even more compelling reason to add your name to it. It’s a feedback loop. It was one thing when everyone in the whole damned country had to take their turn in the barrel, but nobody’s going to want to spend every day in there. The Do Not Call list is Doom writ large for the telemarketing industry in the U.S.A., and they know it. Sure they’re going to fight it. I hope it works out for y’all – sure like to see something similar up here. : preview : See that it has, while the hamsters were ignoring me for the last hour. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/national-do-not-call-list-may-be-illegal/203564.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/national-do-not-call-list-may-be-illegal/203564.md?page=5)