# National Enquirer is right: Bush is drinking again! **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [November 22, 2005, 2:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/national-enquirer-is-right-bush-is-drinking-again/332236 "2005-11-22T14:04:02Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![ShibbOleth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/848f3c/32.png) [@ShibbOleth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ShibbOleth)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2005, 6:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/national-enquirer-is-right-bush-is-drinking-again/332236/21 "2005-11-22T18:41:56Z")
Bah, I realised that PotUS was off the wagon when the “pretzel incident” appeared in the news. Who eats pretzels without beer? ---
**Author:** ![John\_Carter\_of\_Mars](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/2bfe46/32.png) [@John\_Carter\_of\_Mars](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Carter_of_Mars)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2005, 8:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/national-enquirer-is-right-bush-is-drinking-again/332236/22 "2005-11-22T20:47:43Z")
> [@Inigo Montoya](#): > > So…you deny that you have a drinking problem? You know, denial of the problem is one of the signs of alcoholism. You need to seek help pronto! By damn! You have trapped me with your indisputable logic! 😉 If I ever get to the point that a new bottle of Jack Daniels brought into this house is consumed in less than six months, I’ll think about seeking help. To return to the subject, I think the unanswered question here is whether Bush is a true alcoholic or just somebody that used to enjoy his liquor. I don’t know. I’ve been drinking whenever I wanted to since about age 13. I’ve also been a cigarette smoker. I am a nicotine addict, but a user of alcohol. I can state from personal experience that there’s one hell of a difference between addiction and use. Does anybody know for certain whether Bush is a true alcoholic, or is he just somebody that used to drink but quit for family/political reasons? ---
**Author:** ![tdn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/94ad74/32.png) [@tdn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tdn)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2005, 9:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/national-enquirer-is-right-bush-is-drinking-again/332236/23 "2005-11-22T21:12:41Z")
> [@CynicalGabe](#): > > Then, what’s the harm in a second glass after dinner? Or one before bed? If it’s a big meal, maybe another one thrown in there somewhere. Of course, nothing washes a big lunch down as well as a cold beer. And whiskey goes better with some things than wine… > > Someone who was a real alcoholic _cannot_ touch alcohol again in most cases. It almost always leads down the same path. Sure, but is there a medical reason for that? Is it aphysical impossibility to have one glass of wine with Christmas dinner and no more for the rest of the year? ---
**Author:** ![Spiff](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spiff/32/9852_2.png) [@Spiff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spiff)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2005, 9:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/national-enquirer-is-right-bush-is-drinking-again/332236/24 "2005-11-22T21:32:35Z")
Oh, what a can of worms I’ve opened… I’m glad this thread didn’t turn political, as I mentioned in my OP. But I never dreamed that it would turn all educational and serious ‘n’ stuff. Mindless. Pointless. Please remember that these shall be your mantras! ---
**Author:** ![Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/qadgop_the_mercotan/32/83_2.png) [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qadgop_the_Mercotan)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2005, 2:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/national-enquirer-is-right-bush-is-drinking-again/332236/25 "2005-11-23T02:10:03Z")
> [@John Carter of Mars](#): > > Does anybody know for certain whether Bush is a true alcoholic, or is he just somebody that used to drink but quit for family/political reasons? Am I sure he’s an alcoholic and he should therefore never drink any alcohol? No, I’m not sure he’s an alcoholic. All we know is what (little) GWB and a few family members have reported to the media about the severity and extent (excluding unverified tales by so-called witnesses). What’s been put out by the family and Bush sure makes me think “alcoholism is the most likely diagnosis” but it 's not like anyone has done the CAGE questions on him, or sent him for a 7 day inpatient alcohol and other substance abuse evaluation. But based on what the Prez himself has said, I’d be worried if he was drinking alcohol again. And the vast majority of alcoholics cannot return to controlled drinking. That’s one of the definitions of alcoholism, a loss of control over one’s drinking which _cannot be regained_. I’ve seen alcoholics who were sober for over 20 years start drinking again and die from their drinking in just a few months. They generally started again with “just one drink”. ---
**Author:** ![Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/qadgop_the_mercotan/32/83_2.png) [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qadgop_the_Mercotan)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2005, 2:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/national-enquirer-is-right-bush-is-drinking-again/332236/26 "2005-11-23T02:15:06Z")
> [@tdn](#): > > Sure, but is there a medical reason for that? Is it aphysical impossibility to have one glass of wine with Christmas dinner and no more for the rest of the year? See my post above. By definition, alcoholics cannot do that. An honest alcoholic will tell you that, after they take their first drink, they don’t know when they will stop, or what will happen before they stop. They might take the one drink, enjoy it, and go home to bed, no problem. That time. The next time, the one may lead to 2 or 3, a little rowdy behavior, and fun overall, but no harm there either. Or they may take the first drink, have a second, then suddenly awaken from a blackout 6 days later with no clue as to why they’re in control of a Cessna Citation at 16,000 feet vectoring into Pensacola, Florida (which happened to a friend of mine. He wasn’t rated for Citations, either). If you can figure out why alcoholics are like that, you’ll be famous (in neurochemistry and addictionology circles anyway). ---
**Author:** ![Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/qadgop_the_mercotan/32/83_2.png) [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qadgop_the_Mercotan)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2005, 2:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/national-enquirer-is-right-bush-is-drinking-again/332236/27 "2005-11-23T02:18:43Z")
> [@Qadgop the Mercotan](#): > > Or they may take the first drink, have a second, then suddenly awaken from a blackout 6 days later with no clue as to why they’re in control of a Cessna Citation at 16,000 feet vectoring into Pensacola, Florida (which happened to a friend of mine. He wasn’t rated for Citations, either). I should also mention that there was a Navy pilot passed out in the copilot seat and a hooker doing coke in the cabin. ---
**Author:** ![twickster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ec9cab/32.png) [@twickster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/twickster)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2005, 3:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/national-enquirer-is-right-bush-is-drinking-again/332236/28 "2005-11-23T03:01:11Z")
> [@Qadgop the Mercotan](#): > > I should also mention that there was a Navy pilot passed out in the copilot seat and a hooker doing coke in the cabin. Damn, I never did anything more interesting in a blackout than start arguments! 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Cluricaun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/bb73d2/32.png) [@Cluricaun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cluricaun)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2005, 3:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/national-enquirer-is-right-bush-is-drinking-again/332236/29 "2005-11-23T03:19:11Z")
> [@Qadgop the Mercotan](#): > > I should also mention that there was a Navy pilot passed out in the copilot seat and a hooker doing coke in the cabin. And I’d like to mention that I was the person flying the plane. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![ShibbOleth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/848f3c/32.png) [@ShibbOleth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ShibbOleth)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2005, 3:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/national-enquirer-is-right-bush-is-drinking-again/332236/30 "2005-11-23T03:38:25Z")
**Qadgop** , what exactly is a “blackout”, physiologically speaking? ---
**Author:** ![John\_Carter\_of\_Mars](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/2bfe46/32.png) [@John\_Carter\_of\_Mars](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Carter_of_Mars)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2005, 4:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/national-enquirer-is-right-bush-is-drinking-again/332236/31 "2005-11-23T04:38:31Z")
> [@Qadgop the Mercotan](#): > > I should also mention that there was a Navy pilot passed out in the copilot seat and a hooker doing coke in the cabin. Damn! I hate it when I miss out on some cool action. > [@Qadgop the Mercotan](#): > > And the vast majority of alcoholics cannot return to controlled drinking. That’s one of the definitions of alcoholism, a loss of control over one’s drinking which cannot be regained. I’ve seen alcoholics who were sober for over 20 years start drinking again and die from their drinking in just a few months. They generally started again with “just one drink”. This is my experience. My sister’s an alcoholic, sober for 18 years now. I don’t think she’ll ever have another drink. One of her sons is an alcoholic too, and he’s been sober for 4+ years. Her other son and I, we’re still sluggin’ it down when the situation is suitable, or not if the situation isn’t suitable. Therein lies the difference. ---
**Author:** ![zagloba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/977dab/32.png) [@zagloba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zagloba)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2005, 7:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/national-enquirer-is-right-bush-is-drinking-again/332236/32 "2005-11-23T07:48:58Z")
Has anyone here seen that video of GWB drunk at a wedding reception? BTW, Wikipedia says the alcohol content of kumis is usually around 2% ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2005, 8:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/national-enquirer-is-right-bush-is-drinking-again/332236/33 "2005-11-23T08:31:38Z")
I don’t think we need to worry yet. It was just one glass of fermented mare’s milk. But if the President tells Laura he wants a pony for Christmas, it could be a danger sign. ---
**Author:** ![Tenar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/35a633/32.png) [@Tenar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tenar)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2005, 8:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/national-enquirer-is-right-bush-is-drinking-again/332236/34 "2005-11-23T08:50:50Z")
> [@Sampiro](#): > > My concern is that the fermented mare’s milk will be a gateway substance. Next he’ll move on to that bloody milkshake the Masai drink, and then to camel’s milk with Franjelica, and then to elephant cream with vodka and a goat milk and Jim Beam chaser, and soon while Osama’s pulling his next master stroke Bush is unable to do anything because he’s too plastered and his DHS experts are out milking walruses because he heard fermented sea mammal milk goes really good with Sprite. Headline news: Bush urges increased funding for National Zoo. In a related story, adorable baby panda dies of malnutrition for lack of panda milk. ---
**Author:** ![Tenar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/35a633/32.png) [@Tenar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tenar)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2005, 8:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/national-enquirer-is-right-bush-is-drinking-again/332236/35 "2005-11-23T08:54:23Z")
Alternate headline: Bush has monkey on back, was last seen trying to maneuver it toward his mouth. ---
**Author:** ![Ike\_Witt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ike_witt/32/283_2.png) [@Ike\_Witt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ike_Witt)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2005, 3:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/national-enquirer-is-right-bush-is-drinking-again/332236/36 "2005-11-23T15:02:13Z")
> [@Tenar](#): > > Headline news: Bush urges increased funding for National Zoo. In a related story, adorable baby panda dies of malnutrition for lack of panda milk. Bush needs to hang out with Mr. Brisby. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Moto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9de0a6/32.png) [@Mr.Moto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Moto)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2005, 3:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/national-enquirer-is-right-bush-is-drinking-again/332236/37 "2005-11-23T15:16:45Z")
> [@F. U. Shakespeare](#): > > I get a different impression – IIRC, his wife told him to quit drinking or she’d leave him, which brought him to religion. That doesn’t sound like someone who could have quit any time he wanted to. > > President Bush has talked a lot about how his battle with booze led to his religious conversion. So I can’t believe it wouldn’t be a big deal if he were to _really_ start drinking again. > > FWIW, I don’t think this incident indicates anything – do you really think he’d take his first drink in front of the whole world? My grandmother had essentially the same conversation with my grandfather in the mid-1950’s. She was a tough woman, and he would have believed any threat she would have made. He quit drinking so much, but still imbibed at the holidays and on vacation. I don’t believe it ever became a problem again. We tend to see alcohol use and abuse as a black and white issue, with responsible use on one side and full blown alcoholism on the other. The reality is that there is a big gradient in the middle, fairly described as problem drinking. My grandfather found himself in this range. President Bush probably did as well. Whether Bush experienced the addiction behaviors that characterize alcoholism, I can’t say for certain. My grandfather didn’t go quite this far. If he had, he probably wouldn’t have been able to drink socially late in his life. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Lance\_Murdoch](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/47e85d/32.png) [@Captain\_Lance\_Murdoch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Lance_Murdoch)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2005, 3:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/national-enquirer-is-right-bush-is-drinking-again/332236/38 "2005-11-23T15:44:47Z")
> [@hawthorne](#): > > “[F]ermented mare’s milk – sometimes likened to a mix of warm beer and buttermilk” doesn’t necessarily mean it has the alcohol content of such a mix. I drink kefir - a fermented sheep’s milk drink. It has no alcohol in it. I want to party with you! ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Lance\_Murdoch](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/47e85d/32.png) [@Captain\_Lance\_Murdoch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Lance_Murdoch)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2005, 3:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/national-enquirer-is-right-bush-is-drinking-again/332236/39 "2005-11-23T15:48:35Z")
> [@ShibbOleth](#): > > Bah, I realised that PotUS was off the wagon when the “pretzel incident” appeared in the news. Who eats pretzels without beer? And then the _pretzels_ cause the person to pass out. ---
**Author:** ![F.U.Shakespeare](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/aca169/32.png) [@F.U.Shakespeare](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/F.U.Shakespeare)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2005, 3:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/national-enquirer-is-right-bush-is-drinking-again/332236/40 "2005-11-23T15:59:08Z")
I agree with you, **Mr. Moto** – I personally am very critical of the viewpoint that alcohol use/abuse is an ‘all or nothing’ thing. I know several people who simply cannot handle one drink without drinking more than they’d wanted to. I know plenty of people who’ve never had more than one or two drinks in their life, and never wanted any more. When such a person decides to swear it off, it’s not a major, life-changing event. And I know people in that vast middle ground, who enjoy it, are not dependent on it, but have to watch and moderate their intake lest they develop a dependency. The probability they’ll develop a problem is a tradeoff between their fondness for alcohol and their personal discipline. (I consider myself in this category). If they develop a problem and have to quit, it is a decision of major importance. So I’m just taking the president’s early fondness for drink (coupled with his decision to quit completely, and his frequent references to how influential this decision was on his life) as an indication that he may be in the first category. (His honesty in admitting his history of alcohol abuse was in fact one of the things that led me to vote for him in 2000). [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/national-enquirer-is-right-bush-is-drinking-again/332236.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/national-enquirer-is-right-bush-is-drinking-again/332236.md?page=3)