Please help me understand why are you getting so upset over this? I’m not the one getting emotional, nor was I looking for a fight. In fact, I think I went out of my way to be polite. Just because someone posts something he/she considers a joke, it does not mean that others will see it as such.
I asked MamaHen if she was joking. All she had to do was answer in the affirmative. Simple enough, it seems. She invited other NA dopers to this thread. Is there something wrong with my contributing to it?
I found her jokes to be in poor taste. If this were simply a thread devoted to jokes about Native Americans, I wouldn’t care and would leave her to have her fun. Since she presented this thread as a social one for Indian dopers, I thought that I might contribute. When she responded the way she did, I thought it was strange and told her so. I went through her post because I wanted to make sure that I did not misunderstand her.
I don’t see how my response to her even compares to her response to me. I tried to clearly explain how I felt. I didn’t want to insult her. I just wanted to point out the things she said about me in her post that I found objectionable.
I’ve posted three times to this thread. In my first post I did ask her if she was joking. Why is that a bad thing? You say in your own post that “Sometimes, if you have to tell someone it was a joke, the joke isn’t very funny.” That’s what I thought, too.
I still don’t understand why you both are so upset. Upon review, I see that I now have a pit thread devoted to me. I see this now as a difference of opinion. But I really do want to state emphatically that I was never looking for a fight over this.
I don’t think there was anything wrong with jack’s original reply in here. He was more than apologetic, and offered good advice and links. MamaHen, your humor is…um…interesting, and I’m sure it amuses more than enough people out there. I have a rather unusual sense of humor myself, so I can appreciate that. But I must confess that it is hard, for me at least, to determine where you were being serious and where you were being silly, and jack’s uncertainty is understandable.
Then this thing escalated into somethin’ ugly, with defenses flying high and a whole frickin’ Pit thread being opened solely to point at someone and say, “Hey! Everyone! Looky here, this guy’s being a meanie and loser! See how I’m wronged! Make fun of him with me!” …When that’s hardly the case. He misunderstood you, you got defensive, then he got defensive, and here we are.
Shit happened. Adjust.
Now will you two just shake hands, kiss, share a cigarette, or whatever is necessary to make up and return this thread to the friendly discussion it was?
Jack, may I call you that? thank you, anyway, I do believe we are at a crossroads here. Yes I do know this is an open public thread and once again it was an attempt at humor to tell you to get out. I wrote the last MPSIMS reply very tongue in cheek which everyone pretty much understood but you. I apologize for confusing you. It was never my intention. My intention like I said in my pit thread was to relax and hang out with fellow Native Americans. I asked in MPSIMS so it could be a relaxed thread. You might notice that the second poster responded in a joking manner. There were even Dutch jokes thrown in so most people did get that it was a jokey relaxed place to be. A comfy place where we could talk about being Indians which I am sure you know is a different experience. If you wanted to see me more serious with real advice you can see that evidence in the GQ thread where I offered to look up relations of the Oper. In truth I have nothing against shoes or cheese but it made into a good joke until you came along thinking it was serious. Honestly I could never believe someone would think I was giving serious advice about early Native Americans dancing for gas and wearing silly shoes. Even my two year old would know that is a joke. I really did not know you would not get the joke and I am sorry. Honestly, it really really never occured to me that someone would not understand humor. You claim several times that my post sounded rude, well yours sounded rude to me as well and it rubbed me the wrong way. It felt like you were attacking me in this thread and so I did take you to the pit but I have now asked for that to be closed. I think we could be friends if we never speak don’t you? That’s a joke by the way, just in case you don’t get it. I apologize for not making it clear that I tell jokes, maybe I should add that to my signature so you don’t get confused again, and I apologize if I was rude in these posts. I also apologize for my pit thread, like I said it’s been a bad day. Forgive me and let’s move on shall we?
** Ruffian** see I was making peace I am a good little Mama and apologize to the posters for my humor. Anyone real or imagined who was offended by my jokes please, rest assured that they were only jokes. There is no teepee in my garage. I really am a Native America Indian, I don’t want people to worship me and put my pictures in their outhouses. Raindances aren’t cure-alls for gas, moccasins surely were useful, ancestors do not speak to me, and they give commodities to poor Indians like myself who are desperate and in need of help. So there, that better? Oh and BTW I don’t eat the cheese, I give it to my cousin who trades me for his rice.
OK that’s it! I want some beef jerky! I might even be willing to make us all some Indian Fry Bread if one-madjack agrees to forgive me. On my knees…pretty please…with honey on top? Because of course Indian Fry Bread only tastes good dipped in honey.
BTW this is an honest to goodness neat Indian thing I think. I lived on the reservation several years ago and was always scared of tornadoes. Well I mentioned it to our Chief and he said not to be afraid. For several years in a roll a tornado pretty much destroyed the reservation. Fianlly all the old medicine men gathered around, and walked all around the reservation and sang and said prayers, since they did that a tornado hasn’t touched down on the reservation. Amazing isn’t it? If you like stories like this, I got a great one about a tree during the Trail of Tears, let me know
I am not! I want my picture in every urinal in America! I have nothing against outhouses but that’s too small time for me. I’m an Native American dangit! I deserve respect! Besides, my Mom can beat up your Mom. She fights dirty, I think it’s the Indian blood…JOKE!!! Only a joke!
On the subject of my Mom though, she’s a Cherokee with blonde hair and green eyes. She was the only one in the family on her side who didn’t get her CDIB yet so I am going to be at the tribal house soon looking up names. Once again if you have any Cherokee relations, e-mail me names and I will peek for your relations too. I might be able to get to a few other tribal houses and I am even willing to weave a basket or two all in the name of unity! This is serious as I will look up names and weave a basket because they are really pretty. Did you know you can tell what tribe weaved a basket by the way it’s woven? Yup Creeeks weave different that Cherokees or Lumbees. I weave the Creek way and will teach my daughter the Creek way as soon as she can handle the reeds. See? I am passing along traditions!
When my mother’s ancestor Penelope Stout came over to America from England (as I recall, reading the genealogy charts), she (Stout) was initially attacked by an Indian, who left her for dead. Another then came and nursed her back to health, and even gave her a kid for the stay:) I don’t recall what tribe the latter belonged to, and it’s fairly safe to say that phantomdiver is asleep.
I recall another Indian on my mother’s side, but the details here are even hazier. I’ll just say that at 4:15 in the morning I can recall two Indian ancestors.
I believe in their business they call it “pre-need.”
Not to detract from the misery suffered by its participants, but considering the string of partially Cherokee populations between Georgia and Oklahoma that has GOT to have been the LEAKIEST damned mass deportation EVER. Of course, the wilderness it passed through made it relatively easy to slip away. But between the deaths of the infirm and the escape of so many of the, uh, firm I’m surprised anybody made it to the reservation.
My great-great grandmother on my dad’s side was Seminole. Her name was Polly Dawn Raincrow, IIRC. My great-great grandfather on my mom’s side was Cherokee. I don’t know his name. (Family history has it that he was a chief of his tribe, but then, nobody ever has ancestors who were low man on the totem pole, as it were.)
The blood has run thin; the only way it shows on me is in my bone structure.
My erstwhile father is 50% Cherokee and 50% Cheyenne, making me a quarter each I think…
It only shows in my sister though, I’m about as bleached white as they come. Sister has pretty much gone native, but I think they would laugh me off of any res.
Actually I do have a relative who was the low man on the totem pole. He was known only as Bottom of the Heap! OK that's a joke but in my great-great Grandmother's journal's she tells a story about her Uncles all posing with silly faces for a drawing of a 'live' totem pole so technically I am related to the whole dang pole.
I notice alot of you mention not looking much like a Native American. I can pretty much spot a partial NA from a mile away, there are small signs I recognize. Limp greasy but thick hair no matter what color, wide feet, high cheekbones, a large sometimes thin sometimes crooked nose, deepset eyes, all these thing are the Indian traits I think are most noticable. I have all of these traits as well so don't anyone get offended. Also one common trait is a stand offish quality to most of the Indians. People often accuse me of being snobby or mad when actually I am just standing back and watching quietly.
There are alot of blondes living on the reservations these days. The reservations actually look like the United Nations with all the different types of people gathering. Even for the members only gatherings. While living on the reservation I lived in between an Indian who looked straight out of the old west and a jewish Native American who looked right out of New York :) Great people, really great people. I have an Aunt who works in the Indian Affairs office up at the tribal house with bright red hair and green eyes. My sister and I who are both the more common dark Indians both gave birth to blonde haired blue eyed children. People look at us like we've kidnapped our kids. But if you want to go to the local reservation don't let anything stop you, it's your blood too and no one can really say anything about it. The reservations and tribal houses are wonderful places full of information and people willing to help you. If anyone has a problem with you going just ignore them, most likely they are the type who have problems with everything, some people are just grumpy :D
Interesting, I didn’t know wide feet was a sign of NA blood. Like many people on this continent there is a family mythos wherein we have some “Indian” blood. I however don’t know anything about it except that is rumoured to be Cherokee. When I was younger (and much tanner and skinnier than now), several different people would ask if I had Indian blood. (I have high cheekbones and tan well when I bother to go out in the sun usually though I have blondish hair and green eyes. I also have wide feet but never knew this was a sign before.) Personally, I would not really claim the Indian blood unless I knew exactly who/where it came from. I kind of wish I did, it would be nice to have another culture that I felt I could draw off of but as of now I don’t know.
HUGS!
Sqrl
PS. Mamahen, I really love your sense of humor, especially posing in front of tomb stones. I like to tell people that when my elder sister died, we all sang “ding dong the witch is dead” before taking a poop in her coffin.
I am a good little Mama and apologize to the posters for my humor. Anyone real or imagined who was offended by my jokes please, rest assured that they were only jokes. There is no teepee in my garage. I really am a Native America Indian, I don’t want people to worship me and put my pictures in their outhouses. Raindances aren’t cure-alls for gas, moccasins surely were useful, ancestors do not speak to me, and they give commodities to poor Indians like myself who are desperate and in need of help. So there, that better? Oh and BTW I don’t eat the cheese, I give it to my cousin who trades me for his rice.