# Naxos Is From An Alternate Universe **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [May 29, 2011, 10:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/naxos-is-from-an-alternate-universe/583704 "2011-05-29T22:16:18Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2011, 5:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/naxos-is-from-an-alternate-universe/583704/101 "2011-05-31T05:07:44Z")
> [@Dissonance](#): > > _Yawn_ I’ll bite, who is it that you are going to claim to be or know? Who is the atheist version of Kirk Cameron? ---
**Author:** ![Kolak\_of\_Twilo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kolak_of_twilo/32/73_2.png) [@Kolak\_of\_Twilo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kolak_of_Twilo)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2011, 5:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/naxos-is-from-an-alternate-universe/583704/102 "2011-05-31T05:32:45Z")
> [@tomndebb](#): > > Who is the atheist version of Kirk Cameron? Well…maybe Charlie Sheen? ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2011, 5:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/naxos-is-from-an-alternate-universe/583704/103 "2011-05-31T05:37:25Z")
> [@Kolak\_of\_Twilo](#): > > Well…maybe Charlie Sheen? I don’t think so. Charlie Sheen’s god is… Charlie Sheen. So, not an atheist. ---
**Author:** ![armedmonkey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/d6d6ee/32.png) [@armedmonkey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/armedmonkey)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2011, 5:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/naxos-is-from-an-alternate-universe/583704/104 "2011-05-31T05:37:38Z")
“I always believed the theory of evolution as truth, that we all just came from the slime. When we, when we died, you know, that was it, there is nothing…” -Jeffry Dahmer Let’s not fight the atheism wars on this board again. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2011, 6:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/naxos-is-from-an-alternate-universe/583704/105 "2011-05-31T06:00:47Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > Careful, you fool! They’ll merge into the unholy binary demon… Trixonosis! I think that’s what you get if you’re pregnant and you scoop the kitty litter. [sub]Curse you, Monkey, you stole my line![/sub] ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2011, 8:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/naxos-is-from-an-alternate-universe/583704/106 "2011-05-31T08:13:12Z")
> [@Lobohan](#): > > I’m sorry to barge in, is this where the _Fundamentalist Atheist_ meeting is? Just look for a guy at a podium thumping a book with blank pages. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2011, 8:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/naxos-is-from-an-alternate-universe/583704/107 "2011-05-31T08:31:46Z")
> [@Naxos](#): > > So, now that I think I won’t be banned, here is the story: > > If you haven’t read that from me yet, here it is: Religion is a mental disorder. Gadzooks! He _is_ like **Der Trihs**! > [@Naxos](#): > > It’s a dysfunction of the human brain that causes antisocial, aggressive and hostile behaviors. Religion could be said to cause every type of behavior known to man. Among the religious people I’ve known personally in my life - a number easily into the thousands if not tens of thousands - religion fosters primarily social, non-aggressive and peaceful behaviors. I’ve seen this type of behavior time and time again amongst the various Christians, Jews and Muslims I’ve had the good fortune to know personally. In certain others I’ve seen hypocrisy, intolerance, dishonesty and cruelty - you know, the same qualities that are to be found in members of any other group of human beings (including atheists). So it’s obvious that it isn’t religion that creates these negative attributes; simply being human is all it takes. Now if you want to argue that the functioning of the human brain itself is far from perfect, you won’t get much argument from me. But don’t cherry-pick certain negative aspects of human nature and then try blame religion for creating them. To attempt to do so is more an indicator of an improperly functioning human brain than is any belief in religion. Further, religious belief is mostly a belief passed down from parents, neighbors and loved ones to children at a time in their lives when they by nature tend to accept what their families and loved ones tell them to be true. Then, having grown up with these beliefs, many maintain them out of a sense of loyalty to those loved ones and/or because they find arguments against religion to be self-serving, often insulting and to a large degree lacking credulity in accounting for the creation of life and nature as we know it. > [@Naxos](#): > > So, basically, anything anyone says in support of religion is not only moronic and worthless, but, in our times, also ignorant and a clear indicator of stupidity. The name that comes most readily to mind in order to refute this ridiculous allegation of yours is William F. Buckley, a brilliant man and a staunch believer to his dying day. Perhaps you’ve heard of him? ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2011, 8:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/naxos-is-from-an-alternate-universe/583704/108 "2011-05-31T08:52:08Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > However, there have been people on this board who have posted that they are certain that atheism is true and would remain certain they were right even if presented with objective evidence that a religious belief was true. > > And to me, holding on to your beliefs in the face of evidence that they’re wrong, is a religious belief. Even if your religion is atheism. I’ve never seen an instance of this, so I join in with others asking for a cite. I suspect that you are mangling the view expressed by **Der Trihs** at post #85 of this thread (and on many occasions previously). Saying “the God hypothesis is so internally contradictory and vague that I can’t imagine what evidence could possibly prove it” is not the same as saying “if there was evidence that proved there was a God I still wouldn’t believe there was a God”. A while back it was trendy for half smart theists to ask atheists what evidence would falsify their (atheists’) position, in a lame attempt to prove that the atheist view is unscientific (not falsifiable). Even leaving aside the onus of proof issues, this isn’t a valid approach. It’s just an attempt at a gotcha yah, somewhat similar to asking a loaded question (like “when did you stop beating your wife?”). Simply, you can’t prove or falsify gibberish. It’s like me asking you what evidence it would take to falsify your belief that I don’t have “a cat that is entirely white and is flang and is entirely black and a wibble”, and then accusing me of having an unscientific belief in the non-existence of my cat when I demur. You may think I exaggerate, but remember that when we have had a thread asking what exactly theists believe the precise characteristics of their deity to be, every single response was substantially different, even amongst those supposedly of the same religion. Theists don’t even know what their god is; they aren’t in any position to start demanding to know what evidence atheists would have to see to prove their gods’ existence. ---
**Author:** ![Double\_Foolscap](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/85e7bf/32.png) [@Double\_Foolscap](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Double_Foolscap)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2011, 9:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/naxos-is-from-an-alternate-universe/583704/109 "2011-05-31T09:00:57Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > Religion could be said to cause every type of behavior known to man. That’s more or less what I was going to pop in and say. History has its fair share of religious crazies, sure, but it also has The Venerable Bede, the scribes of the Lindisfarne Gospels and the Book of Kells, and a whole bunch of dudes writing wonderful pieces of literature because they were divinely inspired. Yeah, there were wars as well, but we managed those when we were worshipping Wotan. You might as well claim tea is The Great Evil because of the Chinese Opium Wars, ignoring all the good it’s done in the world by being a tasty beverage. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2011, 9:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/naxos-is-from-an-alternate-universe/583704/110 "2011-05-31T09:01:51Z")
> [@Naxos](#): > > Treat what I say as arguments from an average person. You overestimate yourself. ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2011, 9:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/naxos-is-from-an-alternate-universe/583704/111 "2011-05-31T09:20:08Z")
Sorry, confused my protagonists, there, let me try again > [@Princhester](#): > > It’s like me asking you what evidence it would take to falsify your belief that I don’t have “a cat that is entirely white and is flang and is entirely black and a wibble”, and then me accusing you of having an unscientific belief in the non-existence of my cat when you demur. ---
**Author:** ![armedmonkey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/d6d6ee/32.png) [@armedmonkey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/armedmonkey)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2011, 9:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/naxos-is-from-an-alternate-universe/583704/112 "2011-05-31T09:27:10Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > Just look for a guy at a podium thumping a book with blank pages. **Der Tris** , we’ve tangled quite a few times over the years about religion, but I’m beginning to suspect you are as sick of it as I am. 'Cause I have to admit, that post is pretty damn funny. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2011, 10:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/naxos-is-from-an-alternate-universe/583704/113 "2011-05-31T10:05:18Z")
> [@An\_Gadai](#): > > Yeah, their classical music sucks too. I had no views on the poster before reading this thread but them’s fighting words! [Naxos](http://www.naxos.com/) do cheap CDs (£5 here) of good performances of a lot of rarely-recorded classical music and I won’t hear a word against them.\* After reading this thread, however, I agree with this pitting. I’m an agnostic and even I think “Religious people are stupid, I said it, that settles it” is a deeply offensive argument. > [@](#): > > I think if **Qin** weren’t a tween, he’d get a lot more grief on here for the shit he posts. I concur. I think we’re hoping he’ll grow out of it. A conversion to rationality and critical thinking, if you will. \*NB: I have no professional connection to the Naxos record company. I just like their CDs. ---
**Author:** ![heavyarms553](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/779978/32.png) [@heavyarms553](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/heavyarms553)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2011, 11:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/naxos-is-from-an-alternate-universe/583704/114 "2011-05-31T11:41:29Z")
I’m as hardcore an atheist as they come, but even I have to admit that religion has been a positive influence to humanity throughout history. It introduced accountability to a society which was technically and logistically incapable of providing it through tangible means. Without it, the wretched masses would have had no remorse in preying upon themselves. People are vicious, selfish, malign creatures at heart who can only aspire to a greater good through role playing, which religion allows them to do. That being said, I feel that the best way to encourage people to cast off the shackles of religious dogma is through education and improving societal well being. In time, reason will triumph. Of course, that will involve making difficult decisions like limiting population growth in areas of rampant poverty to avoid endless spirals of famine, disease, and violence. I fear that humanity lacks the determination to willfully accept such realities. Also, Texas is nutters. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2011, 12:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/naxos-is-from-an-alternate-universe/583704/115 "2011-05-31T12:03:30Z")
> [@heavyarms553](#): > > I’m as hardcore an atheist as they come, but even I have to admit that religion has been a positive influence to humanity throughout history. It introduced accountability to a society which was technically and logistically incapable of providing it through tangible means. Without it, the wretched masses would have had no remorse in preying upon themselves. People are vicious, selfish, malign creatures at heart who can only aspire to a greater good through role playing, which religion allows them to do. I don’t see it working like that at all. Religion has always been a force for moral corruption, a tool to excuse and encourage bigotry & atrocities and justify the exploitation of the weak by the strong. It’s when the _government_ loses control that everything falls to chaos, not when religion becomes less powerful. It’s the government that is the source of social order, not religion. Far from being a positive influence, religion has been and still is crippling. ---
**Author:** ![Scumpup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ce73a5/32.png) [@Scumpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scumpup)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2011, 12:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/naxos-is-from-an-alternate-universe/583704/116 "2011-05-31T12:09:49Z")
> [@Naxos](#): > > Religion is a mental disease. Language is a virus from outer space. ---
**Author:** ![armedmonkey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/d6d6ee/32.png) [@armedmonkey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/armedmonkey)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2011, 12:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/naxos-is-from-an-alternate-universe/583704/117 "2011-05-31T12:20:17Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > I don’t see it working like that at all. Religion has always been a force for moral corruption, a tool to excuse and encourage bigotry & atrocities and justify the exploitation of the weak by the strong. It’s when the _government_ loses control that everything falls to chaos, not when religion becomes less powerful. It’s the government that is the source of social order, not religion. > > Far from being a positive influence, religion has been and still is crippling. Well, I guess I’m going to have to take my previous post back. Can we get your take on how Buddhism is a tool to exploit the weak? ---
**Author:** ![Scumpup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ce73a5/32.png) [@Scumpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scumpup)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2011, 12:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/naxos-is-from-an-alternate-universe/583704/118 "2011-05-31T12:30:17Z")
> [@Argent\_Towers](#): > > I’ve seen things you people wouldn’t believe. Attack ships on fire off the shoulder of Orion. I watched C-beams glitter in the dark near the Posts of Naxos. “And when the smoke cleared away, and I sought to look upon the earth, I beheld against the background of cold, humorous stars only the dying sun and the pale mournful planets searching for their sister.” from \*The Posts of Naxos \* by H.P. Lovecraft and Winifred Virginia Jackson ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2011, 12:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/naxos-is-from-an-alternate-universe/583704/119 "2011-05-31T12:39:13Z")
> [@Scumpup](#): > > Language is a virus from outer space. You sound like a man who’s willing to listen to reason. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2011, 1:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/naxos-is-from-an-alternate-universe/583704/120 "2011-05-31T13:22:44Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > You sound like a man who’s willing to listen to reason. Or a man who’s willing to listen to Laurie Anderson. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/naxos-is-from-an-alternate-universe/583704.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/naxos-is-from-an-alternate-universe/583704.md?page=7)