# Nazi on ballot for Montana state legislature as a Republican **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [July 6, 2006, 12:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nazi-on-ballot-for-montana-state-legislature-as-a-republican/363286 "2006-07-06T00:27:26Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2006, 2:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nazi-on-ballot-for-montana-state-legislature-as-a-republican/363286/41 "2006-07-06T14:16:58Z")
[QUOTE=John Mace] Reasonable people can and do oppose Affirmative Action. Many of us consider it a form of officially sanctioned racism. [/QUOTE] Me too, actually. I hold with Michael Lind: Race-based affirmative action should be, not merely abolished, but **replaced,** with an even more vigorous program of class-based affirmative action. Create a “social escalator” to which all the poor have access. ---
**Author:** ![LonesomePolecat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/a88e57/32.png) [@LonesomePolecat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LonesomePolecat)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2006, 2:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nazi-on-ballot-for-montana-state-legislature-as-a-republican/363286/42 "2006-07-06T14:17:22Z")
[QUOTE=BrainGlutton] Moore doesn’t embarrass me one tiny little bit; I’m a fan, as you should be. Sharpton does, but I think **on balance** he’s done America more good than harm. And he certainly made the 2004 Dem primary season more entertaining! 🙂 (And perhaps just a bit more enlightening.) [/QUOTE] And attitude like this are why millions of working class whites don’t trust the Democrats. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2006, 2:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nazi-on-ballot-for-montana-state-legislature-as-a-republican/363286/43 "2006-07-06T14:20:31Z")
[QUOTE=John Mace] Some people don’t pit the two against each other. In fact, some people recognize that many businesspeople are minorities and many minorities are businesspeople. [/QUOTE] But it remains true that the Pubs’ (and, for that matter, the Dems’) slavish service to the business interests is, on the balance, bad for minorities, and for poor and working people generally. (Most blacks in America are poor, but most poor people are white.) It is also true you will not see brown faces in any American corporate boardroom in anywhere near the proportion you will see them in the general population. ---
**Author:** ![LonesomePolecat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/a88e57/32.png) [@LonesomePolecat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LonesomePolecat)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2006, 2:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nazi-on-ballot-for-montana-state-legislature-as-a-republican/363286/44 "2006-07-06T14:23:35Z")
[QUOTE=BrainGlutton] Most blacks in America are poor, but most poor people are white. [/QUOTE] No, most blacks are well above the poverty line. However, it is true that blacks are disproportionately poor. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2006, 2:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nazi-on-ballot-for-montana-state-legislature-as-a-republican/363286/45 "2006-07-06T14:24:48Z")
[QUOTE=Jackmannii] Hate to shake up your “four legs good, two legs bad” view of American politics once again, **BG** , but here’s more evidence that racists can find the Democratic Party congenial. Seems there’s a Dem candidate for attorney general in Alabama who’s getting a surprising amount of support. From [msnbc.com](http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/12762671): _Democratic Party leaders are wondering what to do about a candidate for attorney general who denies the Holocaust occurred and wants to “reawaken white racial awareness.”…He has no money for campaign advertising and has made only a few campaign speeches, but garnered 12 percent support in the June 6 primary in a poll of 400 registered voters last month._ Nice. Wonder who’s more embarassed here - Alabama Democrats or atheists? 😃 [/QUOTE] That **is** embarrassing to me, but nowadays it is unsual and anomalous. The only fringe group who have consistently tried to run in Dems’ clothing in recent decades are the [LaRouchies.](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lyndon_Larouche) Who (unlike Duke) never actually get elected to anything, and at least offer a lot more entertainment value! 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2006, 2:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nazi-on-ballot-for-montana-state-legislature-as-a-republican/363286/46 "2006-07-06T14:27:32Z")
[QUOTE=BrainGlutton] Moore doesn’t embarrass me one tiny little bit; I’m a fan, as you should be. Sharpton does, but I think **on balance** he’s done America more good than harm. And he certainly made the 2004 Dem primary season more entertaining! 🙂 (And perhaps just a bit more enlightening.) [/QUOTE] Which merely means that you find anti-Bush bigots congenial, but not the rest. Thus, you don’t object to bigotry _per se_, and your OP was entirely hypocritical. Imagine my surprise. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Hostile\_Dialect](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e495f1/32.png) [@Hostile\_Dialect](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hostile_Dialect)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2006, 2:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nazi-on-ballot-for-montana-state-legislature-as-a-republican/363286/47 "2006-07-06T14:30:30Z")
> [@t-bonham@scc.net](#): > > But Keith is far from a “fundamentalist” – way last year, he got some heat for writing this article to black ministers in the area: “Would a constitutional amendment to ban gay marriage help us to welcome the stranger, clothe the naked, heal the sick, or visit those in prison?” 😕 How does that show he’s not a fundamentalist? Seems to me like it leaves open the possiblity, because it looks like an argument against gay marriage. ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2006, 2:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nazi-on-ballot-for-montana-state-legislature-as-a-republican/363286/48 "2006-07-06T14:44:31Z")
[QUOTE=BrainGlutton] Moore doesn’t embarrass me one tiny little bit; I’m a fan, as you should be. Sharpton does, but I think **on balance** he’s done America more good than harm. And he certainly made the 2004 Dem primary season more entertaining! 🙂 (And perhaps just a bit more enlightening.) [/QUOTE] As a Democrat, I find your overall positive view of Sharpton embarassing. He is unapologetic about his [long and lurid history of racism.](http://www.boston.com/news/globe/editorial_opinion/oped/articles/2003/11/09/the_race_baiter_in_the_campaign/) Republicans currently have a lot to answer for, but using (as you put it) an “anomaly” like a self-proclaimed Nazi running for office as a Republican to label the GOP as racist (and suggesting that the Dems are now pristine on this score) just smacks of politics as usual. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2006, 2:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nazi-on-ballot-for-montana-state-legislature-as-a-republican/363286/49 "2006-07-06T14:49:19Z")
[QUOTE=Shodan] Which merely means that you find anti-Bush bigots congenial, but not the rest. [/QUOTE] Sharpton I won’t defend, but I defy you to come up with any generally acceptable definition of “bigot” that includes Moore. (Just hating Bush and everything he’s done makes nobody a “bigot.”) ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2006, 2:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nazi-on-ballot-for-montana-state-legislature-as-a-republican/363286/50 "2006-07-06T14:50:49Z")
[QUOTE=BrainGlutton] Interesting. Will he be the **first** Muslim in Congress? [/QUOTE] [Yes, _inshallah_.](http://www.hillnews.com/thehill/export/TheHill/News/Campaign/052406.html) > [@](#): > > Ellison, a black Muslim…would also be the first black congressman from Minnesota…Ellison, who converted to Islam when he was 19 years old at Wayne State University in Detroit, said he doesn’t think district voters are afraid to vote for a Muslim, as long as they know he’s concerned about their welfare. > > “My faith informs me. My faith helps me to remember to be gentle, kind, considerate, fair, respectful,” he said. “But I don’t make my faith something that other people have to deal with.” More context: > [@](#): > > According to the American Muslim Alliance, which supports Muslim candidates and educates Muslims about politics, four Muslims ran for Congress in 2004 — two for the Senate and two for the House. One was a Libertarian, and the other three lost in the primaries. > > Overall, about 100 Muslims ran for public office in 2004, with close to half winning. One of them, a black Muslim Democratic state senator in North Carolina, is the highest-ranking Muslim elected official. > > At least two others Muslims have run for the House this year, both in Texas. Republican Ahmad Hassan is a long shot running against Rep. Sheila Jackson Lee (D-Texas) in her Houston district, and Republican Amir Omar lost a primary in the Dallas district. ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2006, 2:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nazi-on-ballot-for-montana-state-legislature-as-a-republican/363286/51 "2006-07-06T14:51:27Z")
[QUOTE=fetus] 😕 How does that show he’s not a fundamentalist? Seems to me like it leaves open the possiblity, because it looks like an argument against gay marriage. [/QUOTE] No. He appears to be saying that spending energy to support a ban on gay marriage does nothing to " help us to welcome the stranger, clothe the naked, heal the sick, or visit those in prison." That is not support for such a ban but a criticism based on it being a waste of time and energy. ---
**Author:** ![LonesomePolecat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/a88e57/32.png) [@LonesomePolecat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LonesomePolecat)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2006, 3:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nazi-on-ballot-for-montana-state-legislature-as-a-republican/363286/52 "2006-07-06T15:05:50Z")
[QUOTE=tomndebb] No. He appears to be saying that spending energy to support a ban on gay marriage does nothing to " help us to welcome the stranger, clothe the naked, heal the sick, or visit those in prison." That is not support for such a ban but a criticism based on it being a waste of time and energy. [/QUOTE] Umm… well, it doesn’t look like opposition in principle, either, just a statement that campaigning for such a ban isn’t a priority. Opposing a gay marriage ban doesn’t necessarily make him gay friendly. I wouldn’t support a complete ban on the sale of tobacco, but that doesn’t make me tobacco friendly. I have the uncomfortable feeling that he’s trying to be slick here. ---
**Author:** ![Tamerlane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tamerlane/32/7602_2.png) [@Tamerlane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tamerlane)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2006, 3:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nazi-on-ballot-for-montana-state-legislature-as-a-republican/363286/53 "2006-07-06T15:49:47Z")
[QUOTE=BrainGlutton] Is he a Black Muslim? (Most of the world’s Muslims regard those as heretics.) [/QUOTE] Not quite. Most of the world’s Muslims would likely regard the _current_ Nation of Islam warily as potential heretics. But to the best of my understanding most black Muslims are pretty well mainstreamed into Sunnism these days. Farrakhan’s NOI faction are a relative minority. By the by, I’d regard Farrakhan, with his own brand of racial supremacism, as a lot closer parallel to David Duke and his ilk. Michael Moore is much more of the left version of Rush Limbaugh. - Tamerlane ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2006, 6:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nazi-on-ballot-for-montana-state-legislature-as-a-republican/363286/54 "2006-07-06T18:55:26Z")
[QUOTE=BrainGlutton] Sharpton I won’t defend… [/QUOTE] > [@BrainGlutton](#): > > Moore doesn’t embarrass me one tiny little bit; I’m a fan, as you should be. Sharpton does, but I think on balance he’s done America more good than harm. And he certainly made the 2004 Dem primary season more entertaining! (And perhaps just a bit more enlightening.) I don’t understand how you believe you can get away with these easily provable lies. It’s posted right there in black and white. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2006, 9:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nazi-on-ballot-for-montana-state-legislature-as-a-republican/363286/55 "2006-07-06T21:31:27Z")
[QUOTE=Shodan] I don’t understand how you believe you can get away with these easily provable lies. It’s posted right there in black and white. [/QUOTE] I said I wouldn’t defend Sharptom from a charge of **bigotry,** that is all. Arguably, he is a bigot. But you can’t by any stretch reasonably say that about Moore. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2006, 9:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nazi-on-ballot-for-montana-state-legislature-as-a-republican/363286/56 "2006-07-06T21:38:16Z")
[hijack] Oh, and look out for Michael Moore’s new movie, [_Sicko!_](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sicko) Coming out in September! 🙂 [/hijack] ---
**Author:** ![Tim\_T-Bonham.net](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/46a35a/32.png) [@Tim\_T-Bonham.net](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tim_T-Bonham.net)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2006, 9:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nazi-on-ballot-for-montana-state-legislature-as-a-republican/363286/57 "2006-07-06T21:55:45Z")
[QUOTE=BobLibDem] I love that quote! I don’t think Jesus could have said it any better. [/QUOTE] You can read the whole article at [http://www.insightnews.com/search.asp?mode=display&articleID=2101](http://www.insightnews.com/search.asp?mode=display&articleID=2101), which I forgot to link to before. [QUOTE=BrainGlutton] Interesting. Will he be the **first** Muslim in Congress? [/QUOTE] Yes. [QUOTE=BrainGlutton] The name “Keith Ellision” doesn’t sound like it originates from any Islamic country. Is he a Black Muslim? (Most of the world’s Muslims regard those as heretics.) [/QUOTE] He was born & grew up in Detroit, MI, so not from an Islamic country. He moved to Minnesota about a quarter century ago to attend law school. He is black, and a Muslim; I don’t know if that makes him part of the ‘black Muslim’ faith or not. He generally doesn’t talk much about personal beliefs like religion or stress them on his website ([www.keithellison.org](http://www.keithellison.org)), but rather talks about the issues & policies inspired by those beliefs. ---
**Author:** ![threemae](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/5f9b8f/32.png) [@threemae](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/threemae)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2006, 9:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nazi-on-ballot-for-montana-state-legislature-as-a-republican/363286/58 "2006-07-06T21:59:07Z")
[QUOTE=LonesomePolecat] Umm… well, it doesn’t look like opposition in principle, either, just a statement that campaigning for such a ban isn’t a priority. Opposing a gay marriage ban doesn’t necessarily make him gay friendly. I wouldn’t support a complete ban on the sale of tobacco, but that doesn’t make me tobacco friendly. I have the uncomfortable feeling that he’s trying to be slick here. [/QUOTE] He’s pointing out that strongly supporting and arguing on behalf of this bill in contrary to the principles of their religion. He’s arguing against a gay marriage bill/ammendment/whathaveyou, so what exactly is that basis of your complaint? ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2006, 10:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nazi-on-ballot-for-montana-state-legislature-as-a-republican/363286/59 "2006-07-06T22:05:28Z")
[QUOTE=BrainGlutton] Me too, actually. I hold with Michael Lind… [/QUOTE] You don’t say! BTW, I wouldn’t put Sharpton and Moore in the same category, either, although both primarily seem motivated primarily by one thing-- self-promotion. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2006, 2:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nazi-on-ballot-for-montana-state-legislature-as-a-republican/363286/60 "2006-07-07T02:32:34Z")
[QUOTE=John Mace] BTW, I wouldn’t put Sharpton and Moore in the same category, either, although both primarily seem motivated primarily by one thing-- self-promotion. [/QUOTE] Never heard anyone but David Horowitz say that about Lind before. Which particular orifice . . . ? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nazi-on-ballot-for-montana-state-legislature-as-a-republican/363286.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nazi-on-ballot-for-montana-state-legislature-as-a-republican/363286.md?page=4)