# Nazi Rune As CPAC Stage- Coincidence Or Not? **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [February 28, 2021, 3:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nazi-rune-as-cpac-stage-coincidence-or-not/933927 "2021-02-28T03:13:35Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![DocCathode](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doccathode/32/18773_2.png) [@DocCathode](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DocCathode)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2021, 3:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nazi-rune-as-cpac-stage-coincidence-or-not/933927/1 "2021-02-28T03:13:35Z")
I checked with an Odinist I know. He confirmed what the research in the article says. This form of the rune was only used by Nazis, never by the Vikings. I consider that bit settled. The only remaining question is the one in the title. > **[Why the Odal/Othala Rune Used By CPAC is 100% Explicitly a Nazi Symbol](https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2021/2/26/2018354/-Why-the-Odal-Othala-Rune-Used-By-CPAC-is-100-Explicitly-a-Nazi-Symbol?fbclid=IwAR3j49aQEritAKuIgXt9qYxlrAWmKmlNmAnmLj1uh9SC1cxk9Ipc7mn9w6M)** > > UPDATE:  This is not conspiracy theory. Every link I provide is to a mainstream source. I resent the (bannable) CT accusations and “this is just like Q.” Questioning my reasoning is fine - I’m human and regularly make mistakes, jump to... ---
**Author:** ![Mundane\_Super\_Hero](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mundane_super_hero/32/6304_2.png) [@Mundane\_Super\_Hero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mundane_Super_Hero)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2021, 3:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nazi-rune-as-cpac-stage-coincidence-or-not/933927/2 "2021-02-28T03:20:31Z")
Dogs gonna whistle… ---
**Author:** ![mistymage](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mistymage/32/459_2.png) [@mistymage](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mistymage)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2021, 3:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nazi-rune-as-cpac-stage-coincidence-or-not/933927/3 "2021-02-28T03:29:06Z")
I saw that here, showed Hubby who is not very political … and when I showed him [https://twitter.com/Amara\_deMachado/status/1365417507788627971](https://twitter.com/Amara_deMachado/status/1365417507788627971) He went “Wow!” Dog whistle? How about Noon Whistle? ---
**Author:** ![wolfpup](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolfpup/32/10618_2.png) [@wolfpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfpup)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2021, 3:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nazi-rune-as-cpac-stage-coincidence-or-not/933927/4 "2021-02-28T03:39:59Z")
Meh, I think that’s just silliness. Yes, hard-core Trumpists are undoubtedly racist, xenophobic, hateful neo-Nazis. But the shape of the stage being a Nazi dog-whistle? Seriously? As if the shape of the stage was going to attract extra followers and get them more votes? ---
**Author:** ![snoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/43a26b/32.png) [@snoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/snoe)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2021, 3:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nazi-rune-as-cpac-stage-coincidence-or-not/933927/5 "2021-02-28T03:47:21Z")
It’s absolutely plausible that it was intentional, if only for plausibly deniable trolling-the-libs fun. (In which case it worked.) Think about what _the most white-nationalist-sympathetic people_ _involved with designing the CPAC stage_ might plausibly be like. They might be … fine, for some values of fine. Or they might be Nazi scum who think this is funny, or actually think it works as meme magic, or just want to show their white pride, or whatever. This is something journalists could investigate, and we could wait for the results before jumping to conclusions. We _could_ do that. ---
**Author:** ![mistymage](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mistymage/32/459_2.png) [@mistymage](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mistymage)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2021, 3:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nazi-rune-as-cpac-stage-coincidence-or-not/933927/6 "2021-02-28T03:47:39Z")
No, just affirmation for those already inclined. CPAC AFPAC Do we really need NSPAC? ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2021, 3:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nazi-rune-as-cpac-stage-coincidence-or-not/933927/7 "2021-02-28T03:49:24Z")
I think it’s a stretch to say it was deliberate, but they wouldn’t have hesitated to do it if they did think of it. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2021, 3:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nazi-rune-as-cpac-stage-coincidence-or-not/933927/8 "2021-02-28T03:58:05Z")
> [@wolfpup](#): > > Yes, hard-core Trumpists are undoubtedly racist, xenophobic, hateful neo-Nazis. But the shape of the stage being a Nazi dog-whistle? Seriously? As if the shape of the stage was going to attract extra followers and get them more votes? Yeah, as I’ve said elsewhere, I doubt this was intended as a deliberate gesture of solidarity with actual Nazis. Certainly, I don’t find it at all difficult to believe that some conservative trolls might have planned this “coincidence”, or at least chuckled about it when it was noticed, just to appall the libs. And if some conservative neo-Nazis do choose to interpret it as a slightly veiled gesture of support for fascist white supremacism, doubtless the trolls won’t mind that either. Likewise, I think it’s very credible that a lot of CPAC attendees might be pretending to adore that notorious gold-painted kitschy Trump statue more than they really do, just to provoke libs’ comments about their “idol worship”. If the adulation gives a glow to rabid Trump-worshipers among the faithful who really do idolize his image, that’s a bonus. That’s basically all that the US conservative movement has these days in terms of sincere ideological symbolism: 1. A sincere desire to troll the libs, and 2. No repugnance or scruples whatsoever about the appearance of symbolically endorsing any of their garbage-cult right-wing extremist groups, as long as such endorsement carries a veneer of plausible deniability. But deliberately, unambiguously aligning their conference presentation with the symbology of the National Socialists in order to proclaim their solidarity with Nazi beliefs? Nah, I don’t think so. A lot of conservatives, even of the rabid Trumpist variety, still don’t like Nazis. ---
**Author:** ![mikecurtis](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mikecurtis/32/3284_2.png) [@mikecurtis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mikecurtis)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2021, 3:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nazi-rune-as-cpac-stage-coincidence-or-not/933927/9 "2021-02-28T03:59:55Z")
I think **TriPolar** hit the nail. As someone who has lots of experience designing and building stages, it’s very hard to design something that’s easy to install in a room with multiple areas that doesn’t in some way look like a swastika or that rune. These are almost always built out of modular pieces and then faced and painted to look “different” than the last time. There’s only so many different ways rectangles go together. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2021, 4:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nazi-rune-as-cpac-stage-coincidence-or-not/933927/10 "2021-02-28T04:10:45Z")
The problem I have with the coinicidence explanation is this: even if we assume that the design wasn’t originally intentional, it seems unlikely you could look at that and not notice now. And yet they didn’t change it. They reasonably know that actual neo-Nazis would interpret it as a nod to them, and allowed that meaning to persist. Yet everyone else can claim it’s just a coincidence. That’s the definition of a dogwhistle. You don’t need it to have been originally designed to be one. One group will think it’s a nod to them, and the other group has plausible deniability. And those who designed this know it. Regardless of original intent, it functions like a dogwhistle. ---
**Author:** ![Banquet\_Bear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/banquet_bear/32/373_2.png) [@Banquet\_Bear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Banquet_Bear)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2021, 4:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nazi-rune-as-cpac-stage-coincidence-or-not/933927/11 "2021-02-28T04:24:57Z")
> [@mikecurtis](#): > > As someone who has lots of experience designing and building stages, it’s very hard to design something that’s easy to install in a room with multiple areas **that doesn’t in some way look like a swastika or that rune.** …I was in the conference and events industry for fifteen years and I’ve never seen anyone accidentally build a stage that looked like a swastikas or that rune. For starters the eyelines on the screen for people at the front of the stage are blocked by the lectern and the speaker. Typically in this case you would have two screens, one to the left and one to the right of the speaker so that everyone gets eyelines on the screen. You don’t need staging **in front of the lectern**. You don’t need the two spokes off to the side. The gap in front of the screen is a fall hazard. This isn’t a practical arrangement. No AV company I know would set up staging like this unless **explicitly requested to do so by the client**. You don’t accidentally build something like this. ---
**Author:** ![wolfpup](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolfpup/32/10618_2.png) [@wolfpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfpup)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2021, 4:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nazi-rune-as-cpac-stage-coincidence-or-not/933927/12 "2021-02-28T04:32:21Z")
> [@Banquet\_Bear](#): > > You don’t accidentally build something like this. Apparently sometimes you do. (Not that I’m defending the neo-Nazis at CPAC; just trying to be realistic.) [![](https://i.imgur.com/s4BWWhJ.jpg) ](https://i.imgur.com/s4BWWhJ.jpg) [http://content.time.com/time/specials/packages/article/0,28804,1881770\_1881787\_1881780,00.html](http://content.time.com/time/specials/packages/article/0,28804,1881770_1881787_1881780,00.html) ---
**Author:** ![Banquet\_Bear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/banquet_bear/32/373_2.png) [@Banquet\_Bear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Banquet_Bear)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2021, 4:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nazi-rune-as-cpac-stage-coincidence-or-not/933927/13 "2021-02-28T04:33:00Z")
…that…isn’t a stage? ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2021, 5:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nazi-rune-as-cpac-stage-coincidence-or-not/933927/14 "2021-02-28T05:43:16Z")
> [@Kimstu](#): > > But deliberately, unambiguously aligning their conference presentation with the symbology of the National Socialists in order to proclaim their solidarity with Nazi beliefs? Nah, I don’t think so. A lot of conservatives, even of the rabid Trumpist variety, still don’t like Nazis. The problem with that dismissal is that you can look at the parallels to the rise of National Socialism in 1920s Germany in how the National Socialist German Workers’ Party (NSDAP) was marginallized and Hitler dismissed as a buffoon; meanwhile, the _Sturmabteilung_ (essentially a private militia) armed themselves and attacked political opponents while Hitler used the post-war recession to gain a following among the lower middle class, WWI veterans, and small farmers, and eventually disaffected students and unemployed youth. Party propaganda relied upon villifying immigrants, Communists, Jews, and “internationalists” (e.g. people who weren’t screaming patriots) to rile up the population and convert people from more moderate conservative parties like the more moderate German National People’s Party (DNVP), which eventually tried to join an alliance with the NSDAP despite internal resistance. It doesn’t take a majority, or even large majority of Republicans to actively support Trump; it just requires enough to remain silent while the party purges its moderate or rational elements in order to appeal to Trump’s base. And that is _exactly_ what is occurring. The parallels are stunning and disturbing to anyone who has studied the history of the Weimar Republic and the rise of pre-WWII fascism in Germany and elsewhere in Europe, and it isn’t just occurring in the United States. Conservatives may not like Nazis or Proud Boys or Oath Keepers but they’ve shown a clear willingness to overlook and apologize for them as just being a “fringe” even after a blatant attempt to overturn a legitimate election. These people have seen the desperate path to hardcore, unbending support, and they’ll hew to it in order to get votes just as they are willing to subvert the democratic process and deny election rights to win. Stranger ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2021, 6:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nazi-rune-as-cpac-stage-coincidence-or-not/933927/15 "2021-02-28T06:21:29Z")
> [@mikecurtis](#): > > As someone who has lots of experience designing and building stages, it’s very hard to design something that’s easy to install in a room with multiple areas that doesn’t in some way look like a swastika or that rune. The CPAC stage looks to me kind of like a cheap ‘n’ cheesy version of a modern performance venue stage design like [this one](https://in.pinterest.com/pin/692991461392954208/). Corner sticking out into the center of the audience, runways wrapping around at weird angles. ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2021, 6:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nazi-rune-as-cpac-stage-coincidence-or-not/933927/16 "2021-02-28T06:53:17Z")
> [@Kimstu](#): > > The CPAC stage looks to me kind of like a cheap ‘n’ cheesy version of a modern performance venue stage design like [this one](https://in.pinterest.com/pin/692991461392954208/). Corner sticking out into the center of the audience, runways wrapping around at weird angles. None of those look like a fascist rune-symbol from above or have odd, nonfunctional stubs sticking out to the side. When you have to make so many gyrations to explain why it just _happens to look_ like a symbol that has been and continues to be used by fascist organizations, the simpler explanation is that it looks exactly as it was made to look. And it isn’t as if there aren’t already many figures in the GOP that are facilitating the active support for white nationalist and fascist elements, even if they won’t come out and embrace these themselves. The reluctance to condemn the 6 January insurrection or label it as such, the refusal by Senate Republicans to vote in favor of impeachment on the demonstrably false premise that an official cannot be impeached after they have left office (never mind the only reason it took that long was because McConnell delayed the trial until after inauguration), and most tellingly the censure and condemnation of the few Republicans who did vote for impeachment or spoke out against Trump as supporting insurrection and fascist movements. Stranger ---
**Author:** ![Son\_of\_a\_Rich](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/son_of_a_rich/32/5439_2.png) [@Son\_of\_a\_Rich](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Son_of_a_Rich)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2021, 2:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nazi-rune-as-cpac-stage-coincidence-or-not/933927/17 "2021-02-28T14:09:13Z")
Might just be the result of the stage designer fucking with them, and not enough people OKing the design. To change it after having been clued to it would be weak. ---
**Author:** ![madmonk28](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madmonk28/32/20811_2.png) [@madmonk28](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madmonk28)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2021, 2:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nazi-rune-as-cpac-stage-coincidence-or-not/933927/18 "2021-02-28T14:29:24Z")
Let’s not forget that one of Trump’s aides wore a Nazi medal to his inauguration. > **[Top Trump aide wears medal of Hungarian Nazi collaborators](https://www.timesofisrael.com/top-trump-aide-wears-medal-of-hungarian-nazi-collaborators/)** > > Sebastian Gorka photographed on several occasions with uniform and badge of Vitézi Rend, an order of merit with a dark past ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2021, 2:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nazi-rune-as-cpac-stage-coincidence-or-not/933927/19 "2021-02-28T14:39:16Z")
I’ve never been in the stage-designing business, but it seems to me that it’s really, really easy to assemble rectangular modules into a shape that isn’t at all like a Nazi symbol. How about… a rectangle? If your stage is anything other than a rectangle, triangle, semicircle, or quarter-circle, it seems to me that there’s some reason why you picked the shape you did. ---
**Author:** ![HMS\_Irruncible](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hms_irruncible/32/7394_2.png) [@HMS\_Irruncible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HMS_Irruncible)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2021, 3:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nazi-rune-as-cpac-stage-coincidence-or-not/933927/20 "2021-02-28T15:14:30Z")
> [@Kimstu](#): > > Certainly, I don’t find it at all difficult to believe that some conservative trolls might have planned this “coincidence”, or at least chuckled about it when it was noticed, just to appall the libs. And if some conservative neo-Nazis do choose to interpret it as a slightly veiled gesture of support for fascist white supremacism, doubtless the trolls won’t mind that either. I agree with this. It’s my own personal suspicion that this is trolling. For years now, someone’s been intentionally dropping Nazi references into Trump/Republican presentations, with these purposes (from most to least important) 1. To make the libs freak out over symbology that most people don’t see 2. To reaffirm the aura that, hey, we’re not Nazis, but we’re powerful enough to get away with Nazi-adjacent imagery. 3. And, after all, Nazis do vote. So I think it’s a mixed purpose of just being edgy and defiant, mixed with discreetly tapping a _verboten_ political group to skim off a few votes. Can’t prove it, but that’s my pet theory. It’s a dangerous game to play, but I think Republicans are that feckless and reckless. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nazi-rune-as-cpac-stage-coincidence-or-not/933927.md?page=2)