IMO the ref was quick on the trigger, but overall the rule is a good one and IMO needed.
College is amateur in name only. Only the players are unpaid; it’s HUGE money for the universities and NCAA.
But the classless showboating and bad behavior has nearly ruined the NFL and NBA for me. For every Barry Sanders (one of the classiest athletes ever) theres 100 fools who need to run to the middle of the field and flex their muscles for the cameras. (because of some mediocre play that caught the runner in the backfield)
I say great rule. Will it occasionally cause a bad call? Sure, the same as every other rule in the book.
Lemme ask you a question. Say a QB throws a deep pass and, as the runner is reaching the end zone, he taunts a DE lineman. Refs see it and throw the flag. Should the ball come all the way back to the stop of the penalty +15 yards?
I don’t quite understand this scenario. If the taunter is near the end zone, say the 2 yard line, isn’t that the spot of the penalty? Thus, the ball would be placed at the 17 yard line?
In any case, I still think the 15 yards should be tacked on to the kickoff.
No, the QB might be on his own 30. WR is running towards the endzone, and the QB starts taunting the opposing team before the WR makes it into the endzone. So the spot of the foul would be the 30 yard line where the QB taunted the other team. Unless I am mistaken, that means the touchdown is negated and the ball placed on the offense’s own 15 yard line.
They just want to get rid of the showboating and taunting. That’s why they have a rule against it. They decided the best way to do that was to take away the TD. The 15 yards on the kickoff did not stop it.
The idea of the new penalty is to deter the behavior. Giving up 15 yards on a kickoff or even an extra point try did not deter the behavior. Not even close. You stated you think the behavior should be penalized, implying you think the behavior should be deterred, but you advocate a penalty which will does not do that.
Six weeks into the college season with the new rule and this is the first widely publicized incident. I think the officials are treating the new rule pretty judiciously. Wing’s action was blatant. He turned to face two Florida players and flapped his arms while several yards from the end zone. Stupid act, btw, because he was almost caught.
Ah, now I got it. Yeah, I guess you’re right, but I’d be surprised if a ref was still paying attention to activity that far away from the ball. And, what if the taunting comes from the sideline?
Eh, every variety of personal foul still happens even though measures have been taken to deter them. Look at the NFL, you’re still seeing blows to the head despite all the noise they’ve made about that.
Whether or not 15 yards on the kickoff is deterrant, it’s a pretty significant disadvantage for the kicking team.
To you it’s blatant taunting, to some it’s a guy getting overexcited about scoring what may very well be the only touchdown in his life. The rule is just a bit vague considering the magnitude it carries. The NCAA needs to make a complete list of actions that it will consider “taunting,” and they can put arm flapping in there if they want.
I see that at 0:04 Wing begins to run, rather than punt the ball.
At 0:07 - 0:09 Wing is looking over his right shoulder toward a Florida player that’s running toward him as the LSU player ahead of him blocks a tackler for him. He doesn’t flap anything nor does he turn bodily toward any Florida player.
At 0:10 - 0:11 Wing passes by his blocker and would-be tackler on the ground and has to change direction to avoid them, and then to be back on course to the end zone. Florida players continue to approach from Wing’s right and he turns his head toward them to note their location, but then turns back to see where he’s running.
At 0:12 Wing continues to run, looking and aiming straight ahead. On one stride, his arms open, on the next stride, his arms close. His arms never go up and down, his head and body are clearly directed straight ahead toward the end zone.
At 0:13 Wing enters the end zone.
At 0:14 Wing runs through the end zone to the barrier, doing a fancy-ish high step which could’ve been celebratory but also could’ve been another way of slowing down so that he doesn’t hit the barrier, after which he is mobbed by his teammates in congratulations.
Calling this celebration is a stretch, as Wing could’ve easily stopped pumping and opened his arms to slow himself down, as sprinters do at the end of any race. Calling this overcelebration is patently ridiculous.
At 0:40, Wing clearly turns his head away from the endzone and in the direction of two approaching Florida players (who arrive on screen a bit later). It sounds like you only watched the video from one perspective and then came here to post this without watching the rest of the video. The initial replay is not indicative of Wing’s actions. It’s too far away and a bad perspective. Watch the rest of that video.
It’s not a celebration. It was taunting/mocking the opposing team.
There is nothing wrong with a limited post-touchdown celebration not directed at the opposition, and that is not what was penalized.
Sorry to double post, but it just doesn’t make any sense. Say the offense has the ball at their own 10. QB is scrambling around, and an offensive lineman just nails a defender. QB makes the throw and the WR is running for the touchdown.
Scenario A:
The OL looks at the player on the ground, screams we’re gonna win MFer and does a little dance. All before the WR scores. The ref sees it, throws the flag, and calls him for unsportsmanlike conduct. Result? Ball comes out of the endzone and is placed on the 5.
Scenario B:
The OL looks at the player on the ground, screams we’re gonna win MFer and does a little dance. The ref sees it, throws the flag, and calls him for unsportsmanlike conduct. But this time the OL had waited for the player to score. Result? Touchdown and a 15 yard penalty on the extra point.
What’s the takeaway here? If you want to taunt and celebrate, just wait until after the player scores.
Holding is 10 yards and it still happens. Pass Interference is 10 yards and it still happens. Intentional Grounding is 10 yards, a loss of down and as “intentional” IN THE NAME and is still called.
You just want to keep upping the ante until no rules are broken at all?
He turns and looks to see if two would-be tacklers are close to him, at the same time that he spreads his arms for one stride. His glance at the tacklers lasts about as long.
If this is “taunting” then anything other than heads-down running on a scoring drive is now penalty-worthy, subject solely to the discretion of that day’s officials.
If that doesn’t raise extreme red flags, I can’t imagine what would.
And taunting will still happen and will still be penalized, just like the above penalties. I didn’t say the rule will eliminate the behavior, I said it will deter (discourage) it. Turning your head to look at opponents and spreading your arms like an airplane is a bit more controllable than pass interference when you’re trying to make a legitimate play on the football or holding when you’re legitimately trying to keep the opponent away from your QB. There is no legitimate attempt at anything football related when you taunt/mock your opponent.
I agree he looked back to see who might be close to him, but once he saw he wasn’t going to be tackled, he then made his gesture. There is an appreciable amount of time between his glance back and his gesture. It wasn’t simultaneous.
I’d agree with you if this was true, but if it was true, we would have seen many more of these types of penalties in the 7 weeks of college football to this point. The reason this is a bit remarkable and has us in a roar this week is because it doesn’t happen that often. The officials are pretty generous with a player’s gestures and body motions while they are running. Wing’s gesture was blatant.
P.S. I misspelled your name in post 30. I apologize.
No, that’s also 15 yards, but is assessed as a dead-ball penalty (ie, on the kick) because it comes from a “non-player”. See the same section as above.
In Scenario A, the ball would be placed at a minimum of the 15 yard line (assuming taunting in the end zone by a player before the ball carrier has scored). It’s the spot of the foul + 15 yards. So if the taunting occured on the 5, then the ball would be spotted on the 20.
You have Scenario B described correctly.
Further, in the Interpretations it’s made clear that if there’s any doubt about the timing of the taunting (pre/post TD) to assess the penalty as dead-ball penalty.