# NEA on Sept. 11 - don't go blaming anybody, but criticizing U.S. or yourself is OK **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [August 19, 2002, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nea-on-sept-11-dont-go-blaming-anybody-but-criticizing-u-s-or-yourself-is-ok/124614 "2002-08-19T17:02:38Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Milossarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/3ec8ea/32.png) [@Milossarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Milossarian)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2002, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nea-on-sept-11-dont-go-blaming-anybody-but-criticizing-u-s-or-yourself-is-ok/124614/1 "2002-08-19T17:02:38Z")
[http://www.washtimes.com/national/20020819-34549100.htm](http://www.washtimes.com/national/20020819-34549100.htm) > [@](#): > > The National Education Association is suggesting to teachers that they be careful on the first anniversary of the September 11 attacks not to “suggest any group is responsible” for the terrorist hijackings that killed more than 3,000 people. > > Suggested lesson plans compiled by the NEA recommend that teachers “address the issue of blame factually,” noting: “Blaming is especially difficult in terrorist situations because someone is at fault. In this country, we still believe that all people are innocent until solid, reliable evidence from our legal authorities proves otherwise.” OK, I think this is a ridiculous position, but I can live with it. We’ll just forget about those videotapes of Osama bin Laden, the documents found in Al Qaeda headquarters following the invasion of Afghanistan, the connections drawn between the hijackers and Al Qaeda. Nothing matters until a judge and/or jury says it matters. For purposes of convicting someone for a crime, I agree. In any other context, that’s a ridiculous position, especially regarding Sept. 11. But fine; go ahead and have it. However, THIS is where my blood pressure rises: > [@](#): > > But another of the suggested NEA lesson plans — compiled together under the title “Remember September 11” and appearing on the teachers union health information network Web site — takes a decidedly blame-America approach, urging educators to “discuss historical instances of American intolerance,” so that the American public avoids “repeating terrible mistakes.” > “Internment of Japanese Americans after Pearl Harbor and the backlash against Arab Americans during the Gulf War are obvious examples,” the plan says. “Teachers can do lessons in class, but parents can also discuss the consequences of these events and encourage their children to suggest better choices that Americans can make this time.” Please make special note of the fact that this “lesson” is part of a suggested lesson plan for **September 11 remembrance**. Maybe our public schools should stick to reading, writing and 'rithmatic, instead of indoctrinating a bunch of little leftists whose mantra is “criticize America early and often, but everybody else gets a pass.” That’s the job of our universities, dammit! Oh, and in case you want to immediately bash the Washington Times, here’s the direct link to what they are talking about. I got to it by going through [nea.org](http://nea.org) and their “Remembering September 11” links, exactly as the article states: [http://www.jfku.edu/psych/parents.html](http://www.jfku.edu/psych/parents.html) I should note that I agree with much of what is listed on the list. But I don’t think the Washington Times is unfairly portraying what’s stated there. See numbers 4 and 10 under “Tips for Parents and Teachers.” I especially spit Coke on this from Number 4: > [@](#): > > Do not suggest any group is responsible. Do not repeat the speculations of others, including newscasters. Do not encourage or allow random blaming; but understand that self-blame may be a way for students to fell _(sic)_“in control” (something different they “could have done” or “could do” in the future). So go out of your way to ensure no one assigns blame to anyone over the Sept. 11 attacks that killed about 3,000 U.S. civilians. But, if they want to blame _themselves_ in some way, that could be constructive. 😕 Number 4 continues: > [@](#): > > we have no reason to believe that the attacks on our country were part of an organized plan of any other country. The terrorists acted independently without the sanctions of any nation. This from the writer who, a few sentences earlier, wrote, “Use non-speculative terms. Do not suggest any group is responsible. Do not repeat the speculations of others, including newscasters. Do not encourage or allow random blaming.” However, if you want to let people off the hook before all the facts are in, by all fucking means! And Al Qaeda didn’t have “sanctions” from the Taliban? Al Qaeda worked “independently” from the Taliban? I think we will soon find that many Al Qaeda members have fled into Iran and Iraq, with the blessings of the government there. But that’s just speculation on my part. There are some good messages in what’s proposed on that webpage. Too bad it had to be undercut by a bunch of outrageous liberal clap-trap. Stick to polluting your own kids’ minds, pal. I’ll thank you not to do it my (hypothetical) children. ---
**Author:** ![WV\_Woman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e95f7d/32.png) [@WV\_Woman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WV_Woman)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2002, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nea-on-sept-11-dont-go-blaming-anybody-but-criticizing-u-s-or-yourself-is-ok/124614/2 "2002-08-19T17:21:54Z")
Yet another reason to send WV\_Toddler to a private school. ---
**Author:** ![TwistofFate](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/cdc98d/32.png) [@TwistofFate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TwistofFate)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2002, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nea-on-sept-11-dont-go-blaming-anybody-but-criticizing-u-s-or-yourself-is-ok/124614/3 "2002-08-19T17:52:19Z")
because, of course, America is _never_ to blame. Now, before you explode, I don’t think America brought September 11th on themselves. But to blindly skip past reasons for what motivated the terrorists is a mistake. If you ignore the past, you jepordize the future. ---
**Author:** ![Jodi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/7feea3/32.png) [@Jodi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jodi)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2002, 6:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nea-on-sept-11-dont-go-blaming-anybody-but-criticizing-u-s-or-yourself-is-ok/124614/4 "2002-08-19T18:01:55Z")
> [@](#): > > Because, of course, America is never to blame. Did he fucking say that, TWISTY? _Did he fucking say that?_ Before I explode, my ass. No one – _no one_ – had advocated “blindly skipping past what motivated the terrorists.” What MILO _said_ is that the NEA is applying an double-standard, in that it is careful not to blame any other country or organization for 9/11, but thinks the fucking _remembrance day_ would be a dandy time to think about American transgressions. Jesus Christ. Learn to fucking read. ---
**Author:** ![Milossarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/3ec8ea/32.png) [@Milossarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Milossarian)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2002, 6:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nea-on-sept-11-dont-go-blaming-anybody-but-criticizing-u-s-or-yourself-is-ok/124614/5 "2002-08-19T18:40:43Z")
I wasn’t aware the Sept. 11 hijackers were motivated by American Japanese internment camps during World War II. ---
**Author:** ![Jodi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/7feea3/32.png) [@Jodi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jodi)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2002, 6:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nea-on-sept-11-dont-go-blaming-anybody-but-criticizing-u-s-or-yourself-is-ok/124614/6 "2002-08-19T18:49:20Z")
And allow me to say that I have great respect for you generally and think highly of you as a poster. But there is no fucking way you can extrapolate that from what MILO said. This is not an all or nothing proposition. If a person to come in and say “This position of the NEA is fucked up, and here are the reasons” that does NOT mean that person is saying “America is never to blame.” How the hell do you get that from what he said? You have to _willfully_ misread his post, and you have to import some American apologist, “we’re always right 100% of the time” point of view that quite simply is _not there_. NOT THERE. And it seriously pissed me off. This subject is hard enough to discuss without people dropping by to totally misread and misstate what others have said. _Especially_ people who by any measure are smart enough to refrain, and who clearly ought to know better. ---
**Author:** ![Truth\_Seeker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/5fc32e/32.png) [@Truth\_Seeker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Truth_Seeker)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2002, 6:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nea-on-sept-11-dont-go-blaming-anybody-but-criticizing-u-s-or-yourself-is-ok/124614/7 "2002-08-19T18:54:18Z")
I don’t get the “self blame” thing, but the clear intent of what the NEA is pushing is to avoid whipping up racial and religious intolerance. They’re saying the message ought to be, “It’s not OK to blame your neighbors or your classmates for what happened because they are “Arabs” or because they practice Islam. That’s not what the U.S. is about. We’ve done that before and it was the wrong thing to do.” When the NEA says “don’t blame a group” it means "Don’t blame “Arabs” or Muslims just because they are Arabs or Muslims. It’s all very well to recognize that Islam does have some virulent strains that are incompatible with Western liberal democracy but you may have a tough time explaining, say, Wahhabism or the succession of Ali to a third grader. If you can teach them not to pick on Rashid just because his parents came from Iran, you’ll be way ahead. In fact, you’d be doing well to communicate this to certain adults. From the article: > [@](#): > > \*\*“There is no such thing as peaceful Islam,” Mr. Lind said. “It says that followers should make war on those who believe that Christ is the Messiah.” \*\* ---
**Author:** ![Milossarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/3ec8ea/32.png) [@Milossarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Milossarian)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2002, 7:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nea-on-sept-11-dont-go-blaming-anybody-but-criticizing-u-s-or-yourself-is-ok/124614/8 "2002-08-19T19:19:19Z")
All I can say Twist, is if there message was what you just said it was, and they left it at that, I’d be in total agreement. I already noted I agreed with much of what they listed. Most of which was the overall message that you pointed to. But they didn’t just do that. They did what I described in detail in my OP. They pushed an agenda - one that a great many Americans find offensive as hell. You’ll note I didn’t quote from Lind because I don’t agree with him. I think he is taking a simplistic view of the matter. But then, so is someone who says “The Muslim religion is not to blame for this terrorism, hatred and violence.” In a general sense it isn’t; but the biggest propagators of a message of hate and destruction are certain **mullahs**. They are far more effective in developing Al Qaeda-like mindsets than any government leader. ---
**Author:** ![Milossarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/3ec8ea/32.png) [@Milossarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Milossarian)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2002, 7:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nea-on-sept-11-dont-go-blaming-anybody-but-criticizing-u-s-or-yourself-is-ok/124614/9 "2002-08-19T19:25:36Z")
Oops, that last message was for Truth Seeker. People who think like Twist of Fate are directly responsible for dreck like that cited above. ---
**Author:** ![Necros](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/necros/32/11086_2.png) [@Necros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Necros)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2002, 7:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nea-on-sept-11-dont-go-blaming-anybody-but-criticizing-u-s-or-yourself-is-ok/124614/10 "2002-08-19T19:36:21Z")
**Milo** said: > [@](#): > > But, if they want to blame themselves in some way, that could be constructive. Actually, it seems to be that when they say that “self blame could be a way for students to [feel] ‘in control’”, they are indicating that many people _do_ use this type of thinking as a defense mechanism. I don’t think that they are advocating self-blame, merely warning teachers that a self-blame response on the part of the student isn’t an unusual response under these circumstances. I do think, however, that they could have worded that part a little better. ---
**Author:** ![sailor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a587f6/32.png) [@sailor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sailor)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2002, 9:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nea-on-sept-11-dont-go-blaming-anybody-but-criticizing-u-s-or-yourself-is-ok/124614/11 "2002-08-19T21:07:39Z")
NEA are assholes and idiots and this is totally inappropriate. Sheesh. A huge crime was committed and we pretty much know who did it and we are supposed to not blame anyone? huh? How stupid can you be? The lesson is that there are fanatics in the world and you have to be on guard and ready to defend yourself. That’s the lesson. This is like going to the funeral of a cop who was killed and saying to the family: “Yes, but you have to understand the other side. Let’s talk about how criminals see this.” There is a time and a place for everything and there is a time an a place to discuss how America can improve its relations with other countries and cultures but this is not the place or the time. When I was about 12 I got this suspicion that teachers were idiots and it has grown stronger over the years. I guess they vote the most idiots of the idiots to head the NEA. Screw them. ---
**Author:** ![zev\_steinhardt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/97f17d/32.png) [@zev\_steinhardt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zev_steinhardt)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2002, 9:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nea-on-sept-11-dont-go-blaming-anybody-but-criticizing-u-s-or-yourself-is-ok/124614/12 "2002-08-19T21:12:29Z")
> [@](#): > > Do not suggest any group is responsible. How about the 19 hijackers? Or are they off-limits for blame too? :rolleyes: Zev Steinhardt ---
**Author:** ![beagledave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6de8d8/32.png) [@beagledave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/beagledave)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2002, 9:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nea-on-sept-11-dont-go-blaming-anybody-but-criticizing-u-s-or-yourself-is-ok/124614/13 "2002-08-19T21:22:43Z")
Umm the “group” that is responsible is Al Qaeda. They are a terrorist “group”. The notion that we should “not suggest any **group** is responsible” is PC lunacy. Truthseeker says > [@](#): > > I don’t get the “self blame” thing, but the clear intent of what the NEA is pushing is to avoid whipping up racial and religious intolerance. They’re saying the message ought to be, "It’s not OK to blame your neighbors or your classmates for what happened because they are “Arabs” or because they practice Islam. Well no. I don’t think that the above is the “clear intent” of the NEA. While I do agree that they are opposed to stereotyping of Muslims, it appears that they are "intending" **more**. The idea that a lesson on Japanese internment during WWII is a relevant lesson for **September 11** , is well beyond the frickin pale. ---
**Author:** ![xenophon41](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xenophon41/32/253_2.png) [@xenophon41](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/xenophon41)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2002, 10:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nea-on-sept-11-dont-go-blaming-anybody-but-criticizing-u-s-or-yourself-is-ok/124614/14 "2002-08-19T22:22:44Z")
I find this unbelievably annoying. –Not the short list of tips, or the NEA’s endorsement of it; it’s the fact that smart people can work themselves up to a frenzy of indignation without fully engaging their intelligence that pisses me off. Far be it from me to try and dissuade those who’ve already made up their minds that all this is “liberal claptrap.” But for everyone else, here’s some facts you might consider while deciding whether to be upset about this. The list was not generated by the NEA; in fact the suggestions come from the director of programs at John F. Kennedy University’s Graduate School of Professional Psychology. It is a list of suggestions to educators and parents of school children, it is not a polemic; its focus is _child pshychology_, not informational reportage. Much of the intent of the list is to provide a communication guide which facilitates healthy discussion of terrorism while trying to defuse the potential fear and hatred of specific ethnic groups which could be engendered by careless pronouncements of blame. This last point is key to understanding the language used in the various tips. --Again, _this is not an informative or moral essay_, it is a guide to psychologically healthy discussion of a difficult subject with children. Let’s look at the two “Tips for Parents and Teachers” which gave both _The Washington Times_’ Ellen Sorokin and **Milossarian** such a conniption. For convenience, I’ll parse each idea in blue font as it is presented. > [@](#): > > 1. **Address the issue of blame factually.** Explore who and what may be to blame for this event. Use non-speculative terms. (Discuss terrorism in general terms.) Do not suggest any group is responsible. (In this context, “group” means “group of people” rather than “group of terrorists” since younger children have difficulty separating one group of a specific ethnicity from the entire ethnic group.) Do not repeat the speculations of others, including newscasters. Do not encourage or allow random blaming; but understand that self-blame may be a way for students to fell “in control” (something different they “could have done” or “could do” in the future). (“Understand” about “self-blame” means “be aware of the reason why some kids are comforted by this technique, and be sensitive to the child’s need to feel some sort of control.”) Be careful to ensure students (e.g., Arab-American students,) do not assume blame in order to make classmates feel better. Blaming is especially difficult in terrorist situations because someone is at fault. However, explain that all Arab-Americans are not guilty by association or racial membership. Help kids resist the tendency to want to “pin the blame” on someone close by. (Controlling the quite natural tendency among children to “scapegoat” whole ethnic groups.) In this country, we still believe that all people are innocent until solid, reliable evidence from our legal authorities proves otherwise. Further, we have no reason to believe that the attacks on our country were part of an organized plan of any other country. The terrorists acted independently without the sanctions of any nation. (Being careful to distinguish the now defunct ruling political group from the terrorist organization itself, and from the country in which they operated. Consistently stressing the American ideals of _justice for all_ and _due process_.) > > 2. **Discuss historical instances of American intolerance.** Internment of Japanese Americans after Pearl Harbor and the backlash against Arab Americans during the Gulf War are obvious examples. Teachers can do lessons in class, but parents can also discuss the consequences of these events and encourage their children to suggest better choices that Americans can make this time. (This entire point discusses the historical backlashes against ethnic groups _in reaction to atrocities_. At no point does this paragraph engage in “blaming America” for 9/11. The psychological advice here is to continue to stress the need for constructive, focused and effective responses to aggression rather than scapegoating.) Only if we ignore the context in which this advice is given by the NEA is it possible to take the message of the list as “blame America.” This is not editorial advice to columnists or reporters. Nor is it political advice to legislators or executives. It’s advice to professionals or parents whose job or whose familial duty is to provide guidance and learning opportunities to young people in various developmental stages, who need to coexist peacefully with other young people in this very diverse country’s schools and playgrounds. ---
**Author:** ![Fenris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fenris/32/498_2.png) [@Fenris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fenris)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2002, 10:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nea-on-sept-11-dont-go-blaming-anybody-but-criticizing-u-s-or-yourself-is-ok/124614/15 "2002-08-19T22:41:09Z")
I’m all in favor of the NEA’s advice and I hope it’s the first of a long series of similar teaching agendas/lesson plans of a similar nature. See, I’m a **BIG** supporter of school vouchers and every innane “Hate Amerika” lesson plan they suggest, every “blame Amerika first” statement they make is one more group who’ll vote my way. 🙂 GO NEA!!! Fenris PS: What **Xeno** said was all spiffy, unfortunately, it’s not even close to what the NEA said. Especially this bit. > [@](#): > > Understand" about “self-blame” means “be aware of the reason why some kids are comforted by this technique, and be sensitive to the child’s need to feel some sort of control.”) All well and good, but that’s not even remotely what the NEA said. I was a teacher for a couple of years (got my major in El. Ed.) and that’s not the message _I_ got. If they’re gonna write in a secret code, they’ll haveta take the chance that people will take them at face value. ---
**Author:** ![LolaCocaCola](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7cd45c/32.png) [@LolaCocaCola](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LolaCocaCola)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2002, 10:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nea-on-sept-11-dont-go-blaming-anybody-but-criticizing-u-s-or-yourself-is-ok/124614/16 "2002-08-19T22:59:13Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Jodi \* > \*\* > > Did he fucking say that, TWISTY? _Did he fucking say that?_ > > Before I explode, my ass. No one – _no one_ – had advocated “blindly skipping past what motivated the terrorists.” What MILO _said_ is that the NEA is applying an double-standard, in that it is careful not to blame any other country or organization for 9/11, but thinks the fucking _remembrance day_ would be a dandy time to think about American transgressions. > > Jesus Christ. Learn to fucking read. \*\* Well said. ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2002, 11:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nea-on-sept-11-dont-go-blaming-anybody-but-criticizing-u-s-or-yourself-is-ok/124614/17 "2002-08-19T23:00:03Z")
"“Blaming is especially difficult in terrorist situations because someone is at fault.” Yeah, ain’t that a bitch? We’ve got to make sure that blame is turned _inward_. A good way is to equate the internment of Japanese-Americans in WWII and the “backlash against Arab-Americans during the Gulf War”. Maybe the kiddies will make the connection that our dastardly treatment of Arab-Americans as a result of the Gulf War provoked the attacks of 9/11. Too bad a set of generally good recommendations also had to include fuel for the likes of Phyllis Schlafly. ---
**Author:** ![Freudian\_Slit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/5daacb/32.png) [@Freudian\_Slit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Freudian_Slit)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2002, 12:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nea-on-sept-11-dont-go-blaming-anybody-but-criticizing-u-s-or-yourself-is-ok/124614/18 "2002-08-20T00:06:18Z")
Well, maybe they went a little overboard on the self-blame thing, but I don’t see why it’s that horrible. They were wrong, but I think their message was good. Said message being not scapegoating people based on race/religion, which is really easy to do, especially since we- and the human race in general- has a long colorful history of doing just that. So in short, I agree with **xenophon41**. It’s probably important to emphasize that scapegoating is bad when talking to children. Although I suppose they should be told that it is likely the work of a known terrorist group, it’s significant that we not go off the deep end here and just further spread the hatred and anger. _ **sailor** said_ > [@](#): > > There is a time and a place for everything and there is a time an a place to discuss how America can improve its relations with other countries and cultures but this is not the place or the time. Actually, this probably is the best time. If we were just attacked a year ago, wouldn’t it be better to take action? And considering the animosity felt by the rest of the world toward us, isn’t improving relations a top priority right about now? ---
**Author:** ![Milossarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/3ec8ea/32.png) [@Milossarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Milossarian)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2002, 2:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nea-on-sept-11-dont-go-blaming-anybody-but-criticizing-u-s-or-yourself-is-ok/124614/19 "2002-08-20T02:42:25Z")
Zoggie: > [@](#): > > \*\*They were wrong, but I think their message was good. Said message being not scapegoating people based on race/religion, which is really easy to do, especially since we- and the human race in general- has a long colorful history of doing just that. \*\* Were that their message, and their message alone, I would have had no problem with it. > [@](#): > > \*\*And considering the animosity felt by the rest of the world toward us, isn’t improving relations a top priority right about now? \*\* Improving relations with those who dislike the USA, and hold misperceptions about it, should be ongoing. Tying that message in any way to Sept. 11, however, carries the offensiveness of telling a woman who was gang-raped, “Well … you _were_ known to get a little flirty at the bars …” Have you ever read what Osama bin Laden’s reasons are for doing “all this?” In his own words? [Do it.](http://www.theatlantic.com/issues/2002/01/gerecht.htm) [Do it some more.](http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/monitoring/media_reports/1636782.stm) You’ll never read a more hate-filled, intolerant person. Do you remember the Islamic fundamentalist repressions the Taliban placed on its own people? Read OBL’s words, and you’ll have a better understanding of why he felt real comfy in bed with them. In a nutshell, he wants to kill Americans because we’re “evil,” in that we have such radical concepts as music and women who can be seen and even work. Because we have soldiers in Saudi Arabia, and we don’t hate Israel. (Although his meely-mouthed Israel-Palestine shit is all-new. He never said boo about that until Sept. 11. But he’s trying to rally all Muslims together now.) Perhaps reading that you’ll understand why the hairs raise on the back of my neck whenever “but …” is added to a declaration of how terrible Sept. 11 was, by somebody who’s trying to prove they have a nuanced worldview. And I find it particularly, bitterly ironic that the people who tend to insert the “but …” are those who otherwise are relentlessly against anything remotely intolerant. I’d be really interested to know what we’re supposed to do to get “the rest of the world” to stop hating us so much. What people (especially those on the left in places like Europe and Latin America) have a tendency to do is to list their own dislikes of America when this point is discussed. But you want to get at the reasons America is under attack? Read OBL’s words. Then get back to me on what America is supposed to do. Abandon Israel? Find a nation that’s worked harder to develop peace between Israel and Palestine than the United States of America. Find **one**. Get all troops out of the Middle East? Put all our women out of work and have them get fitted for their burquas? Is it a two-way street? Isn’t part of the onus of getting “them” to stop hating us on them? ---
**Author:** ![Blalron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/35a633/32.png) [@Blalron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blalron)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2002, 2:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nea-on-sept-11-dont-go-blaming-anybody-but-criticizing-u-s-or-yourself-is-ok/124614/20 "2002-08-20T02:47:33Z")
> [@](#): > > Nothing matters until a judge and/or jury says it matters. For purposes of convicting someone for a crime, I agree. In any other context, that’s a ridiculous position, especially regarding Sept. 11. With that logic, Adolf Hitler never did anything wrong. Neither did Jack the Ripper. And all Al Capone was guilty of was tax evasion. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nea-on-sept-11-dont-go-blaming-anybody-but-criticizing-u-s-or-yourself-is-ok/124614.md?page=2)