# Near death experiences **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [January 15, 2012, 12:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/near-death-experiences/609591 "2012-01-15T12:36:54Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![LonesomePolecat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/a88e57/32.png) [@LonesomePolecat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LonesomePolecat)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2012, 7:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/near-death-experiences/609591/81 "2012-01-17T19:23:53Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Any luck finding a cite from a non-biased source for this claim yet? Any luck researching the subject yet? ---
**Author:** ![LonesomePolecat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/a88e57/32.png) [@LonesomePolecat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LonesomePolecat)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2012, 7:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/near-death-experiences/609591/82 "2012-01-17T19:25:36Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Why don’t you save some time and make that your signature. Why don’t you make sure you know what you’re talking about before you post? ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2012, 7:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/near-death-experiences/609591/83 "2012-01-17T19:27:12Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Here is my comment: I am tired of posters that make claims, then say “_You_ look for the cites.” And once you found the cites for them, they’d expect you to make their best argument for them, before you rebutted it. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2012, 7:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/near-death-experiences/609591/84 "2012-01-17T19:27:27Z")
Alright, enough already. Please get back to discussing the actual thread topic, not who should’ve known what. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2012, 7:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/near-death-experiences/609591/85 "2012-01-17T19:27:44Z")
> [@LonesomePolecat](#): > > No, an appropriate analogy was made illustrating how unnecessary demands do not deserve a response. _And yet you keep responding._ ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2012, 7:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/near-death-experiences/609591/86 "2012-01-17T19:33:09Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > Alright, enough already. Please get back to discussing the actual thread topic, not who should’ve known what. Will do. In all my amateur research over the years I have found that NDE’s vary greatly depending on the subject’s upbringing and beliefs. I have yet to hear of a convincing case. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2012, 7:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/near-death-experiences/609591/87 "2012-01-17T19:40:31Z")
On the subject of NDEs, how is it that so many hundreds of thousands of mistakes are made of behalf of an all knowing deity: “Come towards the light for your reward, my child…whoops! Looks like it’s not your time yet. Sorry about that.” ---
**Author:** ![LonesomePolecat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/a88e57/32.png) [@LonesomePolecat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LonesomePolecat)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2012, 7:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/near-death-experiences/609591/88 "2012-01-17T19:44:28Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > If there is an award for saying “I’ve got nothing” the greatest number of ways, you are certainly in the running. (shrug) Demanding a cite for negative NDEs in a discussion of NDEs shows the same colossal imbecility as demanding a cite for D-Day in a discussion of World War II. At best it is laughably ignorant, at worst it is exasperatingly ill-mannered. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2012, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/near-death-experiences/609591/89 "2012-01-17T19:46:37Z")
> [@LonesomePolecat](#): > > (shrug) Demanding a cite for negative NDEs in a discussion of NDEs shows the same colossal imbecility as demanding a cite for D-Day in a discussion of World War II. > At best it is laughably ignorant, at worst it is exasperatingly ill-mannered. On the other hand you would have eliminated a lot of tedious back-and-forth if you’d just posted the cite. Regardless, see my mod note in post #84: it’s time to end the bickering over who should know what and who should have to cite what. ---
**Author:** ![2ManyTacos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/2/3da27b/32.png) [@2ManyTacos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/2ManyTacos)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2012, 7:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/near-death-experiences/609591/90 "2012-01-17T19:48:06Z")
I have read quite a bit about NDE’s, admittedly mostly from the “they’re real” perspective simply because I’d like to think that they’re genuine glimpses of an afterlife. Are they truly that, though? Hell, I don’t know, and either way I don’t think that it’s even possible for science to definitively prove their existence or nonexistence one way or the other. The one aspect of NDE’s that is truly fascinating to me, though, are the accounts of persons who were clinically brain dead and yet who were able to witness the events unfolding around them after the fact. I think that the case of [Pam Reynolds](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bu1ErDeQ0Zw) is the most substantial bit of evidence in this arena. For my own two cents: Again, I’d like to think that NDE’s are genuine glimpses of an afterlife, but I just don’t have any idea either way. I don’t think that ANYBODY can know for sure, really. I do think, however, that regardless of NDEs’ legitimacy, there is definitely a biological component involved in the entire experience, just as there is a cultural element that plays a part in all of it. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2012, 7:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/near-death-experiences/609591/91 "2012-01-17T19:51:51Z")
> [@2ManyTacos](#): > > The one aspect of NDE’s that is truly fascinating to me, though, are the accounts of persons who were clinically brain dead and yet who were able to witness the events unfolding around them after the fact. I think that the case of [Pam Reynolds](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bu1ErDeQ0Zw) is the most substantial bit of evidence in this arena. The big hole in this is of course the fact that we cannot know if she had whatever experience she had _during_ the time she was brain dead. ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2012, 7:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/near-death-experiences/609591/92 "2012-01-17T19:52:51Z")
I was sorta assuming that references to D-Day and the Holocaust needed citations a bit less than NDEs, seeing as they involved real-life occurrences involving flesh-and-blood beings with, um, ample witnesses. But I could be wrong. So, let’s hear more about this “literature” to which **LP** refers. Specifically, what are the recommended learned journals which devote themselves to this stuff (and are referenced in PubMed for easy access by the unwashed)? And do scholars in the field get to attend conferences at nice warm-weather sites during the winter? (I’m peeved that my main professional society holds its meetings in November in places like Philadelphia and Toronto). :mad: ---
**Author:** ![LonesomePolecat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/a88e57/32.png) [@LonesomePolecat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LonesomePolecat)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2012, 8:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/near-death-experiences/609591/93 "2012-01-17T20:01:47Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > On the other hand you would have eliminated a lot of tedious back-and-forth if you’d just posted the cite. Regardless, see my mod note in post #84: it’s time to end the bickering over who should know what and who should have to cite what. My last post was placed before I saw #84. However, I would point out that the needless back and forth would have been avoided if Czarcasm had simply conceded a valid point. ---
**Author:** ![LonesomePolecat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/a88e57/32.png) [@LonesomePolecat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LonesomePolecat)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2012, 8:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/near-death-experiences/609591/94 "2012-01-17T20:04:00Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > On the subject of NDEs, how is it that so many hundreds of thousands of mistakes are made of behalf of an all knowing deity: “Come towards the light for your reward, my child…whoops! Looks like it’s not your time yet. Sorry about that.” Who said anything about an all-knowing deity? There is no logical contradiction between an afterlife and the absence of a deity. ---
**Author:** ![SiXSwordS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/49beb7/32.png) [@SiXSwordS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SiXSwordS)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2012, 8:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/near-death-experiences/609591/95 "2012-01-17T20:06:32Z")
> [@Chessic\_Sense](#): > > Hellish NDEs are all over the place. I’m a little reticent about to post this link, but it is from something called the “Near Death Experience Research Foundation”: > [@](#): > > [The hellish NDE is so graphic and atypical, I think an attached commentary is appropriate…](http://www.nderf.org/meg_a%27s_nde.htm) and > [@](#): > > [Frightening NDEs represent about 15% of all NDEs we receive.](http://www.nderf.org/meg_a%27s_nde.htm) …so even within the NDE community, hellish experiences seem to be considered rare enough to warrant additional commentary. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2012, 8:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/near-death-experiences/609591/96 "2012-01-17T20:13:03Z")
> [@SiXSwordS](#): > > I’m a little reticent about to post this link, but it is from something called the “Near Death Experience Research Foundation”: > > and > …so even within the NDE community, hellish experiences seem to be considered rare enough to warrant additional commentary. It looks like both links go to the same place. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2012, 8:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/near-death-experiences/609591/97 "2012-01-17T20:18:14Z")
It looks like the [Near Death Experience Research Foundation](http://www.nderf.org/) is about as far from impartial a “research foundation” as it could possibly get. Their “Life Questions” alone tell me a lot about their impartiality. ---
**Author:** ![SiXSwordS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/49beb7/32.png) [@SiXSwordS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SiXSwordS)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2012, 8:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/near-death-experiences/609591/98 "2012-01-17T20:21:53Z")
> [@2ManyTacos](#): > > The one aspect of NDE’s that is truly fascinating to me, though, are the accounts of persons who were clinically brain dead and yet who were able to witness the events unfolding around them after the fact. More-and-more I’m starting to wonder if so-called Near-Death experiences are really resuscitation experiences. Something like a video tape losing its timecode. While dead, the brain isn’t functioning properly and after resuscitation it’s not sure where to pick up again–so to speak. Because of this it has to “reboot.” The most basic memories are “imprint” type memories, such as those of loved ones. The white light is like the static on the video tape. In other words, all of the experience happens after the person is alive again, not when they are actually dead. ---
**Author:** ![Chessic\_Sense](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/7c8e57/32.png) [@Chessic\_Sense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chessic_Sense)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2012, 8:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/near-death-experiences/609591/99 "2012-01-17T20:23:40Z")
> [@SiXSwordS](#): > > I’m a little reticent about to post this link, but it is from something called the “Near Death Experience Research Foundation”: > > and > …so even within the NDE community, hellish experiences seem to be considered rare enough to warrant additional commentary. I think you just proved my point. Negative NDEs are a whole 15% of all NDEs. So slightly more common than an African-American in America. Like **LP** and I said…all over the place. ---
**Author:** ![SiXSwordS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/49beb7/32.png) [@SiXSwordS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SiXSwordS)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2012, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/near-death-experiences/609591/100 "2012-01-17T20:25:49Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > It looks like the [Near Death Experience Research Foundation](http://www.nderf.org/) is about as far from impartial a “research foundation” as it could possibly get. So, you don’t think I should trust their [What Is Reality](http://www.nderf.org/dreams_reality032703.htm)? link? But seriously, the point of the link was that within the credulous community, hellish NDEs are considered rare enough to warrant special handling. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/near-death-experiences/609591.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/near-death-experiences/609591.md?page=6)