# Negative Intelligence And Shakespeare **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [December 13, 2003, 2:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/negative-intelligence-and-shakespeare/218711 "2003-12-13T02:06:07Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 10\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Phage](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/a4c791/32.png) [@Phage](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Phage)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2003, 12:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/negative-intelligence-and-shakespeare/218711/21 "2003-12-13T12:01:01Z")
The initial statement confuses me: “According to the pyschologically accepted Flynn effect, across the 20th century, the average I.Q. increased 3 points per decade[.]” As I understand it, the intelligence quotient is adjusted so that for every test the average score is 100. This means that the average score will never rise; it is by definition 100. **Derleth** How do you mean recalibrate the test? The average score is by definition 100 IQ, so even if on average people are scoring higher than they did before the calculations are still routine. Unadjusted scores are expected to wildly vary between different tests; after all, it would be extremely difficult to make a test of equal difficulty. ---
**Author:** ![Padeye](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/a9a28c/32.png) [@Padeye](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Padeye)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2003, 2:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/negative-intelligence-and-shakespeare/218711/22 "2003-12-13T14:33:03Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by myles \* > \*\*OK, I’ll refocus my question, if we accept that the Flynn effect is accurate for the twentieth century, a more limited interpretation of the theory. > > Where is all of the evidence that for the majority of the century most people were retarded? \*\* That’s the rub, I don’t assume he’s right. I think he’s completely full of shit. Intelligence tests are not precise measuring tools like a vernier caliper. They _do_ measure intelligence but lumped in with a lot of specific knowledge and language skills. Trying to make an era neutral I.Q. test is going to be more difficult than making a culture neutral test. ---
**Author:** ![Matchka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/77aa72/32.png) [@Matchka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Matchka)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2003, 4:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/negative-intelligence-and-shakespeare/218711/23 "2003-12-13T16:41:07Z")
Ummm…what was this Flynn guy’s IQ? Could be _he_ ain’t qite right. ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2003, 6:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/negative-intelligence-and-shakespeare/218711/24 "2003-12-13T18:36:21Z")
The increase in IQ tests could just be a result of better education and a better knowledge of how to take IQ tests. But aside from that, the fallacy is the assumption that when you find a trend, it has always been that way and will always continue that way. The Flynn Effect could merely be a minor random variation over the short time the tests have been used. ---
**Author:** ![scr4](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/59ef9b/32.png) [@scr4](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scr4)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2003, 6:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/negative-intelligence-and-shakespeare/218711/25 "2003-12-13T18:58:05Z")
For what it’s worth, from [Wikipedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flynn_effect): > [@](#): > > The Flynn effect is a perplexing phenomenon for those who believe that IQ tests represent a true measure of human intelligence, as it would suggest that people today are in general considerably more intelligent than those of previous generations. **Flynn himself does not believe this to be the case**. It is conceivable that something about modern society (the greater need for abstract thinking, presence of computers, more visually-oriented culture) is responsible. Look, if there is a trend in IQ test scores, then it means… that there’s a trend in IQ test scores. Nothing more, and nobody seems to be claiming anything more as a fact. ---
**Author:** ![netscape\_6](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/8c91f0/32.png) [@netscape\_6](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/netscape_6)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2003, 7:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/negative-intelligence-and-shakespeare/218711/26 "2003-12-13T19:20:25Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Derleth \* > \*\*That’s what I like about math: For a piddling investment of facts, one can reap such a bounty of nonsense. > \*\* facts are the opposite of fat. the more you have the healthier you are. ---
**Author:** ![bup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6bbea6/32.png) [@bup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bup)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2003, 10:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/negative-intelligence-and-shakespeare/218711/27 "2003-12-13T22:03:50Z")
Look, [url=http://www.sciam.com/article.cfm?articleID=00037F65-D9C0-1C6A-84A9809EC588EF21]DIDN’T ANYONE LOOK AT MY CITE?[/url Flynn himself doesn’t believe it! That is, he doesn’t believe people are really getting smarter and used to be dumber. Don’t start criticizing Flynn, criticize the people who miss his point. ---
**Author:** ![Derleth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Derleth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Derleth)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2003, 3:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/negative-intelligence-and-shakespeare/218711/28 "2003-12-14T03:25:25Z")
**Phage** : From what I understand about how they alter the tests over time, it is the case that if I got one score on a modern test, I’d get a higher score on an older test. I could keep taking older and older tests to get higher and higher scores. That’s what I meant with recalibration: The tests are being `recentered’ around the current average, which is higher than any prior average. ---
**Author:** ![Xema](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/9de053/32.png) [@Xema](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Xema)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2003, 3:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/negative-intelligence-and-shakespeare/218711/29 "2003-12-14T03:59:04Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by myles \* > In 1669, the average person had 0 intelligence. > Prior to 1669, the average person had negative intelligence. You’ve neglected another equally important trend - height. Using 20th-century trends in height, it’s easy to show that people in Shakespeare’s time were but a few inches tall (on average - the truly short ones had negative height). The size of surviving artifacts such as clothes, furniture and buildings are a bit hard to square with this, until you consider that these are just the sorts of blunders that people with zero or negative intelligence could be expected to make. ---
**Author:** ![QuasiQubit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/9dc877/32.png) [@QuasiQubit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuasiQubit)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2003, 5:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/negative-intelligence-and-shakespeare/218711/30 "2003-12-14T05:42:20Z")
The thing about people with negative intelligence is that they themselves do not maintain it, no no no no no Instead they suck intelligence from everyone around them untill there IQ is positive. That’s how we get large groups of retards. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/negative-intelligence-and-shakespeare/218711.md?page=1)