# Neil Degrasse Tyson accused of assaulting women **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [December 1, 2018, 4:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/neil-degrasse-tyson-accused-of-assaulting-women/825400 "2018-12-01T16:14:24Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2018, 9:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/neil-degrasse-tyson-accused-of-assaulting-women/825400/41 "2018-12-03T21:14:03Z")
> [@Riemann](#): > > Is it clear cut that this was a situation where she was a subordinate, and the issue is whether he was trying to exploit his position of power to obtain sex? > > Or was she a co-worker? If the latter, I’m not sure that the question of whether he treated male co-workers exactly identically is really relevant. There’s nothing intrinsically wrong with wanting to date a co-worker, although of course you must be extremely careful to act appropriately and not make them uncomfortable at work if they are not interested (and that’s why companies strongly discourage it). > > I’m not trying to defend him, I’m just not quite sure what this situation is. He’s pretty clearly saying, “This wasn’t a romantic overture.” He can show that by showing he engages in similar behavior with folks he’s not interested in romantically. Whether they’re co-workers or subordinates or something else doesn’t really matter, if he’s trying to show that an offer to join him upstairs, alone, for wine and cheese isn’t necessarily a seduction attempt. If he can’t establish that these wine-and-cheese-snacks are platonic, THEN we get to the question of trying to seduce a subordinate. ---
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2018, 9:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/neil-degrasse-tyson-accused-of-assaulting-women/825400/42 "2018-12-03T21:25:43Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > He’s pretty clearly saying, “This wasn’t a romantic overture.” Yes, I guess you’re right. I was dismissing that part as bullshit, given the other things he said about finding her attractive. I was thinking more along the lines of assuming he did want to make a move on her, and it was then a question of whether he acted inappropriately in doing so. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2018, 9:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/neil-degrasse-tyson-accused-of-assaulting-women/825400/43 "2018-12-03T21:30:17Z")
Ah. From his own account she was a production assistant who drove him around and helped him keep his schedule. She’s younger than him and she’s working for the star. Even if he wasn’t technically her boss on the org chart, the star of the show and the assigned production assistant aren’t on equal footing. Given how easy it’d be for him to have her kicked off the show, he’d have zero business putting the moves on her, and doing so would absolutely be sexual harassment in my opinion. ---
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2018, 9:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/neil-degrasse-tyson-accused-of-assaulting-women/825400/44 "2018-12-03T21:34:37Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > Ah. From his own account she was a production assistant who drove him around and helped him keep his schedule. She’s younger than him and she’s working for the star. Even if he wasn’t technically her boss on the org chart, the star of the show and the assigned production assistant aren’t on equal footing. Given how easy it’d be for him to have her kicked off the show, he’d have zero business putting the moves on her, and doing so would absolutely be sexual harassment in my opinion. Yes, _any_ kind of move is a dick move under those circumstances. Whether or not it crosses any legal boundary, I agree it’s sexual harassment. ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2018, 10:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/neil-degrasse-tyson-accused-of-assaulting-women/825400/45 "2018-12-03T22:04:01Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > Even if he wasn’t technically her boss on the org chart, the star of the show and the assigned production assistant aren’t on equal footing. Given how easy it’d be for him to have her kicked off the show, he’d have zero business putting the moves on her, and doing so would absolutely be sexual harassment in my opinion. This happened “in the final week of shooting, with just a few days left,” so I don’t know whether that’s an issue here. OTOH, there’s a reference to “her fiancé.” Assuming she was still engaged at the time of the incident, that’s a good enough reason not to put the moves on her. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2018, 10:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/neil-degrasse-tyson-accused-of-assaulting-women/825400/46 "2018-12-03T22:15:49Z")
> [@Thudlow\_Boink](#): > > This happened “in the final week of shooting, with just a few days left,” so I don’t know whether that’s an issue here. [According to this article](https://www.washingtonpost.com/science/2018/12/01/neil-degrasse-tyson-under-investigation-after-accusations-sexual-misconduct/?utm_term=.21e256849c7a), it wasn’t clear that her job was definitely ending. > [@WaPo](#): > > In an interview with The Post, Watson described an uncomfortable night with Tyson in May 2018. She had been working as his assistant on the Santa Fe set of “Cosmos” for several months and was hoping that Tyson would ask her to continue working for him when production moved to Europe. She says that, based on this evening, she decided to quit. As for the fiance thing–that falls in the same category as Tyson’s wife. In other words, what people do in their personal lives, and whether they mess up their own sexual/romantic relationships, isn’t really my business. But when it happens in the workplace, or when it becomes predatory, it becomes public concern. ---
**Author:** ![Bijou\_Drains](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bijou_drains/32/2814_2.png) [@Bijou\_Drains](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bijou_Drains)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2018, 10:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/neil-degrasse-tyson-accused-of-assaulting-women/825400/47 "2018-12-03T22:43:46Z")
I’m a guy and if another guy invited me over for wine and cheese I would assume he’s gay and wants to be romantic. Beer and pizza would be what I would expect from another guy. ---
**Author:** ![filmore](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/7993a0/32.png) [@filmore](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/filmore)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2018, 10:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/neil-degrasse-tyson-accused-of-assaulting-women/825400/48 "2018-12-03T22:49:48Z")
> [@Bijou\_Drains](#): > > I’m a guy and if another guy invited me over for wine and cheese I would assume he’s gay and wants to be romantic. Beer and pizza would be what I would expect from another guy. I’m not talking about Tyson’s situation in particular, but lots of guys drink wine as their go-to alcoholic drink. It sounds like there’s more going on with Tyson, but I just wanted to offer some clarification so that people don’t mistakenly think that wine means romance even if it’s just men. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2018, 11:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/neil-degrasse-tyson-accused-of-assaulting-women/825400/49 "2018-12-03T23:02:05Z")
> [@filmore](#): > > I’m not talking about Tyson’s situation in particular, but lots of guys drink wine as their go-to alcoholic drink. It sounds like there’s more going on with Tyson, but I just wanted to offer some clarification so that people don’t mistakenly think that wine means romance even if it’s just men. Yeah, Tyson aside, I wouldn’t think much of it if a guy invited me for wine & cheese. The food and drink don’t really make a difference to the way I interpret the situation (partly because I do know a lot of hetero guys into wine and cheese. I’d be all over that invitation! And I’m pretty sure I have had wine & cheese at a male friend or co-worker’s place.) There are other things that might signal to me the intent of the person. ---
**Author:** ![Tamerlane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tamerlane/32/7602_2.png) [@Tamerlane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tamerlane)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2018, 11:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/neil-degrasse-tyson-accused-of-assaulting-women/825400/50 "2018-12-03T23:21:38Z")
> [@Bijou\_Drains](#): > > I’m a guy and if another guy invited me over for wine and cheese I would assume he’s gay and wants to be romantic. Beer and pizza would be what I would expect from another guy. You’d be wrong in my case ;). Straight and far more likely to have wine and cheese for snacks than beer and pizza( though I’m good with beer and pizza as well ). AND I’m the sort of guy that would do so for purely platonic hanging out reasons with any gender. That said it’s all the in the phrasing and circumstance, because I’d also do the same in a dating situation. ---
**Author:** ![Gatopescado](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gatopescado/32/5711_2.png) [@Gatopescado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gatopescado)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2018, 12:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/neil-degrasse-tyson-accused-of-assaulting-women/825400/51 "2018-12-04T00:55:31Z")
Sorry, but “Wine and Cheese” = “Tryin’ to get Laid”. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2018, 12:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/neil-degrasse-tyson-accused-of-assaulting-women/825400/52 "2018-12-04T00:59:44Z")
> [@Gatopescado](#): > > Sorry, but “Wine and Cheese” = “Tryin’ to get Laid”. Apology accepted. ---
**Author:** ![That\_Don\_Guy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/that_don_guy/32/538_2.png) [@That\_Don\_Guy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/That_Don_Guy)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2018, 2:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/neil-degrasse-tyson-accused-of-assaulting-women/825400/53 "2018-12-04T02:56:27Z")
Fox has already announced that the second season of his _Cosmos_ series premieres in early March; I wonder if this will affect it somehow. ---
**Author:** ![zombywoof](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/9e8a1a/32.png) [@zombywoof](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zombywoof)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2018, 3:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/neil-degrasse-tyson-accused-of-assaulting-women/825400/54 "2018-12-04T03:01:57Z")
Cosmo’s recipe for red wine grilled cheese [here](https://www.cosmopolitan.com/food-cocktails/a5672/gooey-grilled-cheeses/). ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2018, 3:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/neil-degrasse-tyson-accused-of-assaulting-women/825400/55 "2018-12-04T03:13:38Z")
> [@Gatopescado](#): > > Sorry, but “Wine and Cheese” = “Tryin’ to get Laid”. Nah, there’s nothing specific about “wine and cheese” that means “tryin’ to get laid.” Any invitation to a person’s place, regardless of food and drink being served, can be “tryin’ to get laid.” With my wife, it was “wanna come up and play some chess?” (Actually, from her end.) With another girlfriend, it was “would you like to come up and get some coffee?” With another it was, “come over and I’ll cook dinner for you.” (I think beer was involved with that one.) With another, it was “let’s rent a movie, get some pizza and drinks” (I guess what would be “Netflix and chill” these days.) There’s other contextual clues that have much more meaning than trying to say, oh, if it’s wine and beer it’s I wanna get laid, but if it’s beer and pizza, it’s just friends. ---
**Author:** ![xizor](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xizor/32/102_2.png) [@xizor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/xizor)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2018, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/neil-degrasse-tyson-accused-of-assaulting-women/825400/56 "2018-12-04T17:34:26Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > Nah, there’s nothing specific about “wine and cheese” that means “tryin’ to get laid.” Any invitation to a person’s place, regardless of food and drink being served, can be “tryin’ to get laid.” With my wife, it was “wanna come up and play some chess?” (Actually, from her end.) With another girlfriend, it was “would you like to come up and get some coffee?” With another it was, “come over and I’ll cook dinner for you.” (I think beer was involved with that one.) With another, it was “let’s rent a movie, get some pizza and drinks” (I guess what would be “Netflix and chill” these days.) There’s other contextual clues that have much more meaning than trying to say, oh, if it’s wine and beer it’s I wanna get laid, but if it’s beer and pizza, it’s just friends. I agree any invitation to a co-worker’s room or home late at night for a one-on-one anything is heading straight into creepy territory and anyone accepting such an invitation should not be surprised when awkward sets in. After reading both sides, my take is that he was trying to put the moves on her but was being very careful on how he did it to maintain deniability if she wasn’t into it. But for her to quit it must have been a lot creepier than it reads. ---
**Author:** ![muldoonthief](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muldoonthief/32/3188_2.png) [@muldoonthief](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/muldoonthief)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2018, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/neil-degrasse-tyson-accused-of-assaulting-women/825400/57 "2018-12-04T17:48:06Z")
At least she didn’t have wine & cheese with [Neil’s brother](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AIgdpllCnwc#t=51s). ---
**Author:** ![Ashtura](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ashtura/32/2963_2.png) [@Ashtura](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ashtura)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2018, 6:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/neil-degrasse-tyson-accused-of-assaulting-women/825400/58 "2018-12-04T18:38:44Z")
> [@Bijou\_Drains](#): > > accused of groping and 1 case of rape > > [Fox, National Geographic to Investigate Neil DeGrasse Tyson Claims](https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/fox-national-geographic-investigate-neil-degrasse-tyson-claims-1165582) Many climate-change denialist will rejoice, no doubt. Now, there’s GOTTA be something on Bill Nye. ---
**Author:** ![Royal\_Nonesutch](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ecb155/32.png) [@Royal\_Nonesutch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Royal_Nonesutch)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2018, 8:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/neil-degrasse-tyson-accused-of-assaulting-women/825400/59 "2018-12-04T20:10:42Z")
> [@Ashtura](#): > > Many climate-change denialist will rejoice, no doubt. Now, there’s GOTTA be something on Bill Nye. Or perhaps to put it another way: “How dare those whiny, disloyal ginches tarnish the good works of a fine, upstanding man of science, a visionary, learned man of letters who is out there Fighting The Good Fight, with trifling tales of two-bit harassment?” “Don’t they know how to be Team Players? He is one of ours, damn it!” That attitude got Bill Clinton (for one) a free pass for too many years, and there were plenty on the other side of the political spectrum who would have said the same thing about scumbags like Jimmy Swaggart." ---
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2018, 8:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/neil-degrasse-tyson-accused-of-assaulting-women/825400/60 "2018-12-04T20:32:10Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > “wanna come up and play some chess?” > > “would you like to come up and get some coffee?” > > “come over and I’ll cook dinner for you.” It’s really the “come” part of the invitation that means ‘tryin’ to get laid’ > [@](#): > > “let’s rent a movie, get some pizza and drinks” Here, the “come” is implied. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/neil-degrasse-tyson-accused-of-assaulting-women/825400.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/neil-degrasse-tyson-accused-of-assaulting-women/825400.md?page=4)