Thanks. It’s a shame I can’t recall hearing anything about them 
Not sure I’d use Sulla as an example for American democracy.
Sailboat
My son was home on leave this last week (he left for Iraq on Wednesday) and we spoke about this very subject. Nick is a Hospital Corpsman, a very highly decorated group – there are more Hospital Corpsmen with the MoH than any other Navy rate.
What sparked our conversation was an old book I picked up for Nick – I can’t give you the title, since my Dad borrowed it. Anyway, it was a history of the US Navy’s involvment in the Vietnam War. The back of the book included a picture of each Navy MoH awardee from that war.
What really struck me was how ordinary these guys looked. Look at this guy. You could pass him at WalMart a million times and never dream you were looking at one the most highly decorated enlisted men in Navy history. Be sure to scroll down and read his citation – he had a Navy Cross and the MoH, plus a stack of other medals.
That’s what a hero looks like – just another guy.
I’m not saying Sulla didn’t have his faults (proscribing and executing businessmen and wealthy knights to plump up the Treasury, for instance) but he did acknowledge and celebrate military heroism. Caesar won a Civic Crown, and even his enemies (Cato, Bilubus, Cicero) had to stand and applaud him.
Shouldn’t we want to acknowledge and celebrate military heroes?
Unfortunately, in this day and age it is no longer “cool” to do so. A previous poster was correct when he said it would take another Hitler to turn that around.
Sorry, but that strikes me as a weasel question of the most dangerous kind. You don’t want Communism in our schools, do you? Don’t you want to defeat the terrorists? If you don’t agree with my position, then why do you hate America?
Lauding individuals for heroism in the military is one thing. Lauding the military itself, and its leaders, is another. Why do you think Cicero being forced to applaud Caesar was a good thing?
Missed the edit window, otherwise I would ETA: I realize now that this is MPSIMS, not GD, so sorry if I pounced too severely there. But even in ordinary conversation, boxing someone in with “don’t you want to see [some undeniably good thing] done?” doesn’t strike me as strictly polite if [good thing] is not really equivalent to the thing you’re disagreeing with.
Mr. Moto posted threads in honor of those particular men, and a few others, during the war, but they were hijacked due to political reasons. My politics back then were entirely different, but even now I find myself disturbed by that, given the nature of the threads, even though the posts were well intentioned. I’m sorry I can’t find them, but if you do a dedicated search I’m sure they’ll turn up.
I miss *Olentzero. He was a good guy, even if his timing sucked (he was the major hijacker… if I recall correctly, he posted in every thread “End the war. Bring the troops home now.”). Back when I met him I couldn’t abide by anything he said, yet he made me think. Now I’d probably agree with him on a lot of things. Too bad he got frustrated and gave up on the SDMB.
So the symbolism you like is that the elected civic officials are subordinate to military heroes?
Newsweek ran an article a few weeks ago about how the number of MoH awarded in Iraq is quite low, compared to previous combats. One explanation is that the nature of the combat there, with less emphasis on hand-to-hand combat than in Vietnam or WWII, does not give as many opportunities for the type of personal bravery associated with the MoH. Not everyone is buying that explanation:
I have to agree (with you Koxinga.) I can’t say I favor any version of being forced to revere something. Either you appreciate it on its own virtue or you don’t.
I mean, if you want to celebrate heroism–devoid of the politics surrounding it–why not applaud the medal of honor equivalents from France or China? Not only Americans perform brave acts. I’m sure there are some WWII Japanese heroes still about, we can send them to China to be applauded.
Not being the sort of person who is much into military exploits…but man, those guys are unreal brave. Movie stars don’t impress me; MoH recipients do.
Some years ago, a guy wrote a Letter to the Editor of our local paper about a lieutenant he’d served with in Korea. Didn’t give a name*, though I’m sure some research could find it. This man, by himself, charged a machine-gun nest and took it out, saving his entire unit. Sadly, it didn’t save him; his MoH was given to his mother by President Truman. That is just stunning, that somebody could work up courage like that.
*This was because the lieutenant in question was gay, and the letter writer was making a point about gays in the military. He didn’t feel it was his place to out anybody. I’m NOT trying to start any debates here, just giving the context of where I got this information.
From the description, that might have been Rodger Young, the namesake of troop carrier in Heinlein’s “Starship Troopers.”
World War II
Oh yes. That article made me sick to my stomach.
I know the man who trained Gary Gordon & Randy Shughart. He said he’d never trained two finer men, nor was he a bit surprised that they would lay down their own lives to prolong the life of that downed pilot. They knew damned well that the cavalry wasn’t coming.
I think it’s a shameful thing that everyone in this country can’t immediately identify the Congressional Medal of Honor. If you are ever lucky enough to see a man wearing one, walk up to him and thank him. But you’ll probably never be that lucky.
Some of you Sci-Fi fans will recognize this one:
From the troop ship “Roger Young” in Starship Troopers, by Robert Heinlein.
“To the everlasting glory of the infantry,
Shines the name of Roger Young.”
The original book had the citation, and subsequent editions had a dedication at the end. Among it’s many faults, the movie had nothing.
Tris
I was reading some of the descriptions listed and one under “Special Legislation” caught my eye because at first I couldn’t figure out why it was awarded:
Then I finally realized that it was William “Billy” Mitchell. :smack:
That was the late Joe Foss, and it was right here at the Phoenix airport, where he lives. Those are the same folks who let a handcuffed woman accidently strangle herself.
IIRC it was because of the star on it; they were afraid he might tear the neck ribbon off and use it as a shuriken or something.
This would be a somewhat more meaningful sentiment if you named the award correctly. 
It is called the “Medal of Honor.” There’s no such thing as a “Congressional Medal of Honor.”
There’s an excellent book by Christopher Robbins called The Ravens: Pilots of the Secret War in Laos. (Robbins also wrote another good book called Air America. The Mel Gibson film was based on it, but Robbins was angered that they took his book and made it into a goofy comedy. He spent a lot of money on ads disassociating himself from the film.) Ravens were volunteer pilots during the secret war in Laos. In the book, the particular exploits of quite a few who won the MOH are detailed. No matter how one feels about the secret war itself, it’s a fascinating read.
There are still a few Ravens around here, too. They not infrequently turn up in Madrid Bar in our Patpong red-light district, especially for reunions. Madrid was one of the earliest bars there, dates back to the Vietnam War days. The CIA’s Air America offices were also in Patpong. Madrid Bar itself used to be owned by the real-life prototype for Colonel Kurtz in Apocalypse Now. He did operate some in Cambodia, but his main work was in Laos. Survived the war, too. Eventually ended up getting kicked out of Thailand for “unspecified” offenses maybe 10 or 12 years ago and returned to the US. Died not too long afterward.
(Tony Poe was the real-life Kurtz’s name. No, he did not receive the MOH.)