# Neutral bouyancy ice **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [May 7, 2013, 12:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/neutral-bouyancy-ice/657666 "2013-05-07T00:05:51Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 11\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Pitter\_Patter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/90db22/32.png) [@Pitter\_Patter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pitter_Patter)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2013, 12:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/neutral-bouyancy-ice/657666/1 "2013-05-07T00:05:51Z")
Would it be possible, under ideal conditions, to freeze water with no air trapped in it so that the solid ice would have a neutral bouyancy? ---
**Author:** ![Joey\_P](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/919ad9/32.png) [@Joey\_P](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joey_P)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2013, 12:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/neutral-bouyancy-ice/657666/2 "2013-05-07T00:08:42Z")
> [@Pitter\_Patter](#): > > Would it be possible, under ideal conditions, to freeze water with no air trapped in it so that the solid ice would have a neutral bouyancy? It’s not trapped air, it’s just that the water is less dense when it freezes. ---
**Author:** ![Great\_Antibob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Great\_Antibob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Great_Antibob)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2013, 12:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/neutral-bouyancy-ice/657666/3 "2013-05-07T00:12:01Z")
Ice doesn’t float due to trapped air but because water expands as it gets close to freezing - it has lower density than the water it floats in. You’re not going to achieve neutral buoyancy ice via any special freezing technique. ---
**Author:** ![Pitter\_Patter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/90db22/32.png) [@Pitter\_Patter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pitter_Patter)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2013, 12:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/neutral-bouyancy-ice/657666/4 "2013-05-07T00:20:51Z")
Thanks, guys. ---
**Author:** ![dstarfire](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dstarfire/32/5762_2.png) [@dstarfire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dstarfire)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2013, 12:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/neutral-bouyancy-ice/657666/5 "2013-05-07T00:51:24Z")
I’m pretty sure neutrally buoyant ice is precluded by the nature of chemical states. Most solids have molecules more tightly packed than their liquid state, and so would sink. Some substances (of which water is the best known example) expand when they freeze, due to their polar nature, therefore they float. Neutral buoyancy means you have **effectively** the same overall density (your weight is equivalent to the weight of a similar volume of the surrounding medium). I’m pretty sure I’m missing a qualifier there for total accuracy, but it should be true in most cases you’ll encounter here on earth. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Hamster\_King](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8edcca/32.png) [@The\_Hamster\_King](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Hamster_King)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2013, 1:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/neutral-bouyancy-ice/657666/6 "2013-05-07T01:02:09Z")
There are a variety of alternate crystalline structures that ice can assume if it is formed under the right temperature and pressure. Many of these are denser than water. > **[Ice | Phases](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ice#Phases)** > > Ice may be any one of the 19 known solid crystalline phases of water, or in an amorphous solid state at various densities. > Most liquids under increased pressure freeze at higher temperatures because the pressure helps to hold the molecules together. However, the strong hydrogen bonds in water make it different: for some pressures higher than 1 atm (0.10 MPa), water freezes at a temperature below 0 °C, as shown in the phase diagram below. The melting of ice under high pressures is thought to cont... ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2013, 1:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/neutral-bouyancy-ice/657666/7 "2013-05-07T01:33:41Z")
What a shame to find that Ice IX cannot exist at atmospheric pressure and temperatures. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![ZenBeam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/3ab097/32.png) [@ZenBeam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZenBeam)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2013, 1:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/neutral-bouyancy-ice/657666/8 "2013-05-07T01:54:45Z")
The easiest way to make neutral buoyancy ice would be to use [heavy water](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heavy_water). ---
**Author:** ![Pitter\_Patter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/90db22/32.png) [@Pitter\_Patter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pitter_Patter)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2013, 3:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/neutral-bouyancy-ice/657666/9 "2013-05-07T03:51:04Z")
Thanks, The Hamster King. Am I reading you correctly if if you are systalline aying it is possible with the right crystalline structure? Is that actually possibe? ---
**Author:** ![njtt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/ecd19e/32.png) [@njtt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/njtt)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2013, 4:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/neutral-bouyancy-ice/657666/10 "2013-05-07T04:24:45Z")
> [@Pitter\_Patter](#): > > Thanks, The Hamster King. Am I reading you correctly if if you are systalline aying it is possible with the right crystalline structure? Is that actually possibe? I don’t think that that follows from what **The Hamster King** said. Anyway, I doubt whether any of those exotic forms of ice would survive for long in put into water at normal temperatures and pressures. ---
**Author:** ![Pitter\_Patter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/90db22/32.png) [@Pitter\_Patter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pitter_Patter)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2013, 2:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/neutral-bouyancy-ice/657666/11 "2013-05-08T02:26:22Z")
Sorry for the gibberish. I was on a wireless kb last night. When the batteries get low, it gets stupid. Anyway, thanks for the info.