# Nevada Senate 2010: Reid vs. Angle **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [July 29, 2010, 10:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nevada-senate-2010-reid-vs-angle/548515 "2010-07-29T22:32:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 11\ **Page:** 17
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2010, 8:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nevada-senate-2010-reid-vs-angle/548515/321 "2010-11-10T20:20:58Z")
I can think of a dozen ways to convey illegal aliens without resorting to race. As Angle did, show people sneaking around a fence. Show people with jackets pulled up over their faces being led away in handcuffs by guys in blue CIS windbreakers. Have a hand place a Social Security card on a big red FAKE stamped on it. Show the Border Patrol looking out on the desert with big binoculars. Heck, even showing B-roll of the faces of illegal immigrants in the lock-up is better than taking a picture of three three men who are completely unremarkable other than they are Hispanic and putting the word ILLEGAL on it. You keep referencing the ridiculousness of referencing Canadian illegal immigrants in the context of this discussion. If it is so bizarre to do so, why are you not understanding that it was Mrs. Angle (not her critics!!) who said that the fence in the ad in question was actually a reference to the US-Canadian border? I understand that you think this is a manufactured controversy, but I’m also betting that it isn’t your ox being gored. Let me try on a different scenario for you: I’m running for Congress on the platform that there is a looming threat of domestic terrorism that has to be controlled. I run an ad in which I show three men, who are all white, kind of blue collar looking, carrying bolt action rifles (along the lines of what one might use for deer hunting), perhaps one wearing a Cabella’s cap. On this photo I superimpose the words, “RIGHT WING DOMESTIC TERRORISTS.” Do you think sportsmen/hunters/gun owners would be manufacturing a controversy if they say that it is unfair to label their “type” as being associated with domestic terrorism? After all, if I am going to put a face on domestic terrorists, wouldn’t it be white, blue collar gun owners? ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2010, 8:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nevada-senate-2010-reid-vs-angle/548515/322 "2010-11-10T20:33:44Z")
I think most people do view domestic terrorists that way. The Timothy McVeigh/Ruby Ridge types. And if that’s what those guys look like I would have no problem with their being portrayed that way. And do you really think there would have been less of an outcry had their faces not been shown? It’s more likely that under a scenario like you suggest where their faces are covered, the complaints would be that she was cowardly and really talking about Hispanics but wasn’t honest enough to show them as such. The unfortunate fact of the matter is that _any_ objection to illegal aliens is met with righteous indignation and accusations of racism by the left. There is simply no way Angle, especially as a Republican, could have brought up the issue of stopping illegal immigration without being accused of racism. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2010, 9:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nevada-senate-2010-reid-vs-angle/548515/323 "2010-11-10T21:44:24Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > And if that’s what those guys look like I would have no problem with their being portrayed that way. And yet, [right wingers](http://www.thelibertypapers.org/2009/04/12/homeland-security-document-targets-most-conservatives-and-libertarians-in-the-country/) flip their shit when the notion that domestic terrorists might have a background in the military, or oppose abortion, or favor limited government, etc. > [@](#): > > It’s more likely that under a scenario like you suggest where their faces are covered, the complaints would be that she was cowardly and really talking about Hispanics but wasn’t honest enough to show them as such. The unfortunate fact of the matter is that _any_ objection to illegal aliens is met with righteous indignation and accusations of racism by the left. There is simply no way Angle, especially as a Republican, could have brought up the issue of stopping illegal immigration without being accused of racism. Could you even try to shoehorn any more speculation into one paragraph? How am I even able to respond in a reasoned manner to such wild-eyed fantasy? ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2010, 9:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nevada-senate-2010-reid-vs-angle/548515/324 "2010-11-10T21:44:52Z")
> [@](#): > > The unfortunate fact of the matter is that any objection to illegal aliens is met with righteous indignation and accusations of racism by the left. Well, yeah, if it weren’t for racism, we’d let them in legally. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2010, 11:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nevada-senate-2010-reid-vs-angle/548515/325 "2010-11-10T23:00:02Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > And yet, [right wingers](http://www.thelibertypapers.org/2009/04/12/homeland-security-document-targets-most-conservatives-and-libertarians-in-the-country/) flip their shit when the notion that domestic terrorists might have a background in the military, or oppose abortion, or favor limited government, etc. You asked what my response would be and that is what I gave you. > [@Ravenman](#): > > Could you even try to shoehorn any more speculation into one paragraph? How am I even able to respond in a reasoned manner to such wild-eyed fantasy? Okay then, can you show me any instances where Republican politicians or candidates have advocated strong measures to enforce the law and put a stop to illegal immigration where they we’re castigated and reviled by liberals? > [@Chronos](#): > > Well, yeah, if it weren’t for racism, we’d let them in legally. Pardon my French, but horseshit! There are somewhere around 84 countries in the world. Can you name any that just stand by and allow people from other countries to come flooding in at will? Every country has immigration laws (even Canada. 😃 What evil motive do you suspect is behind their immigration laws?), and those laws have nothing to do with racism. Where do you people _get_ this shit? I’ve mentioned this before, but my next-door neighbor is a woman who came here from Mexico legally. She has busted her butt and is not in charge of 9 or more McDonald’s restaurants. She also works for another Hispanic who came here legally and worked his way up from dishwasher in his teens to ownership of over 30 restaurants now. They both object very strongly to illegal immigrants and are furious at proposals that we give them amnesty. Both of these people recognize the rights of countries to control immigration and they feel that if someone wants to come here from Mexico or points south, they should do it legally just like they did. Are you going to call _them_ racists too? I mean after all, their thinking is identical to that of most of us who object to illegal immigration. ETA: We do let them in legally, as the people I just described illustrate. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2010, 12:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nevada-senate-2010-reid-vs-angle/548515/326 "2010-11-11T00:44:14Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > Pardon my French, but horseshit! There are somewhere around 84 countries in the world. As with damn near every one of your posts on damn near every subject conceivable, you’re wrong. You’re so far wrong, it makes it look like you have no idea what you’re talking about. As usual. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2010, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nevada-senate-2010-reid-vs-angle/548515/327 "2010-11-11T16:25:29Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > Okay then, can you show me any instances where Republican politicians or candidates have advocated strong measures to enforce the law and put a stop to illegal immigration where they we’re castigated and reviled by liberals? First of all, I’m not sure your question made any sense. Second of all, I’m not talking about liberals having a problem with Sharon Angle’s ad, I’m talking about Hispanics having a problem with showing three normal-looking Hispanic people and declaring them ILLEGALS in a major TV ad, apparently for no other reason than the color of their skin. And remember it wasn’t the ACLU or some liberal group who raised this issue with Angle, it was some high school kids in the Latino student union (or something like that). Try to keep up with my points, please. To state it another way: there’s a difference between not agreeing with a candidate on policy grounds and having a problem with a candidate because his/her TV ads look insensitive toward your race. ---
**Author:** ![SenorBeef](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senorbeef/32/2220_2.png) [@SenorBeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SenorBeef)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2010, 8:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nevada-senate-2010-reid-vs-angle/548515/328 "2010-11-11T20:17:34Z")
It’s the other way around. The ad doesn’t somehow declare them illegals because they’re hispanic. They wanted images of illegal aliens to highlight policies related to illegal aliens. So they chose hispanic people, since they make up the vast majority of illegal aliens. Should they have shown some norwegians cause I’m sure there are a few norwegian illegals in the US? This is some weird hypersensitive PC thought crime interpretation going on here. The ad doesn’t in any way imply that all (or most) hispanics are illegal. It just shows some hispanic people as typical illegals - and not only is that reasonable, it would be pretty silly to show any other ethnic group in that spot. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2010, 11:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nevada-senate-2010-reid-vs-angle/548515/329 "2010-11-11T23:24:22Z")
> [@](#): > > Pardon my French, but horseshit! There are somewhere around 84 countries in the world. Can you name any that just stand by and allow people from other countries to come flooding in at will? Every country has immigration laws (even Canada. What evil motive do you suspect is behind their immigration laws?), and those laws have nothing to do with racism. Where do you people get this shit? And if someone from a predominantly-white country wants to immigrate to the US, those laws are easily dealt with, but if someone from, say, Mexico wants to immigrate, the laws are considerably more difficult. The _reason_ people don’t run scary ads about Norwegian illegal immigrants is because most Norwegians who want to come here, we let in legally. ---
**Author:** ![SenorBeef](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senorbeef/32/2220_2.png) [@SenorBeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SenorBeef)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2010, 11:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nevada-senate-2010-reid-vs-angle/548515/330 "2010-11-11T23:52:21Z")
So in the application process, if you check the “white” checkbox, you get +10 towards your immigration score then? ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2010, 2:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nevada-senate-2010-reid-vs-angle/548515/331 "2010-11-22T14:28:26Z")
Politico has a [post-mortem](http://www.politico.com/news/stories/1110/45463.html) on Mrs. Angle’s campaign. This bit really gave me a chuckle: > [@](#): > > [Angle campaign manager] Campbell frequently pitched unorthodox forms of advertising, such as buying advertisements on closed-circuit television cameras at gyms and hiring a plane to be called “Angle One” for sky-writing the candidate’s name… > > At one point, Campbell hired a digital billboard truck with Angle’s face on it that drove around the tourist-drenched Las Vegas Strip — a tactic he referred to as a “game changer,” according to three sources. > > Read more: [http://www.politico.com/news/stories/1110/45463.html#ixzz161NxAcbu](http://www.politico.com/news/stories/1110/45463.html#ixzz161NxAcbu) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nevada-senate-2010-reid-vs-angle/548515.md?page=16)