# New discussion thread for Israel/Gaza/West Bank (Hijacks tolerated) **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Tags:** israel-hamas-war, hijacks-tolerated\ **Created:** [July 12, 2026, 12:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-discussion-thread-for-israel-gaza-west-bank-hijacks-tolerated/1031615 "2026-07-12T00:17:27Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 37
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2026, 6:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-discussion-thread-for-israel-gaza-west-bank-hijacks-tolerated/1031615/735 "2026-10-14T06:23:17Z")
> [@Babale](#): > > …when do you imagine the Palestinian identity emerged as distinct from the wider Levantine Arab identity? Ooh, ooh, I know! Is it “right after Israel’s neighbors gave up on trying to conquer it”? ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2026, 6:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-discussion-thread-for-israel-gaza-west-bank-hijacks-tolerated/1031615/736 "2026-10-14T06:29:13Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > Ooh, ooh, I know! Is it “right after Israel’s neighbors gave up on trying to conquer it”?. It does go back earlier than that, although that _is_ the exact point at which the surrounding Arab states stopped trying their hardest to stifle the bourgeoning Palestinian identity in the crib and instead started grooming it as a weapon to be wielded against Israel. Funny, that. It emerged as a reaction to early Zionists in the Ottoman period. Edward Said was one of the Palestinian voices who argued that Palestine needs to come to be defined by something other than opposition to Zionism, which is very true. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2026, 6:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-discussion-thread-for-israel-gaza-west-bank-hijacks-tolerated/1031615/737 "2026-10-14T06:30:56Z")
> [@Babale](#): > > They weren’t Boers back in the Netherlands. They weren’t Boers until they moved at all. It’s a job description. But the people who set off from the Cape and the people who settled in the Boer republics _were the same people_. So no, they did not originate in Africa. > [@Babale](#): > > So, highly meaningful? Only if you ignore all the genetics, I suppose. And what’s genetics got to do with origins\s > [@Babale](#): > > when do you imagine the Palestinian identity emerged as distinct from the wider Levantine Arab identity? When they first started calling themselves Palestinians. So - 10th C. onwards. Hey, that’s probably the same time the Ashkenazim got their start in the Rhineland… > [@Babale](#): > > what exactly do you think happened during the conquest of the Bilad al-Sham? A [bunch of locals](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestinians#Genetics) converted to Islam? Including, it seems, no small amount of Israelites. Oh, there was also the usual mixing, but by-and-large, the peninsular conquerors did not push out the locals. I mean, _someone_ has to grow your dates and grain. > [@Smapti](#): > > [Early Muslim conquests - Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Early_Muslim_conquests#Campaigns) Where in any of that is the bit about pushing out the locals? > [@Babale](#): > > It does go back earlier than that, A _lot_ earlier. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2026, 6:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-discussion-thread-for-israel-gaza-west-bank-hijacks-tolerated/1031615/738 "2026-10-14T06:33:05Z")
> [@MrDibble](#): > > Where in any of that is the bit about pushing out the locals? Did you think the Ashkenazim wound up in eastern Europe because they enjoyed the climate and hospitality? Funny coincidence how the 600 years the rabbis of Babylon spent working on the Talmud just sort of _stopped_ a couple of decades after the Muslims took over. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2026, 6:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-discussion-thread-for-israel-gaza-west-bank-hijacks-tolerated/1031615/739 "2026-10-14T06:38:24Z")
> [@MrDibble](#): > > They weren’t Boers until they moved at all. It’s a job description. But the people who set off from the Cape and the people who settled in the Boer republics _were the same people_. So no, they did not originate in Africa. This is the same game that’s played with the “kill the Boers” BS - Boers are an ethnic group whose name etymologically derives from a profession. Much like Palestinian, which is an ethnic group whose name derives from the Peleshet, a word that means “to raid” and once described an entirely different ethnic group. Boers today are not Dutch people. They are a new and distinct group, which, yes, originated in Africa. > [@MrDibble](#): > > When they first started calling themselves Palestinians. So - 10th C. onwards. That’s some serious historical revisionism. > [@MrDibble](#): > > A [bunch of locals](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestinians#Genetics) converted to Islam? Oh, hey, I guess if Israel was to convert all the Palestinians either forcibly or by making them Dhimmi for a few centuries until they decided they were better off converting, you wouldn’t consider that colonization? Somebody tell Ben Gvir! He’d be all about a Jewish Caliphate. > [@MrDibble](#): > > A _lot_ earlier. Yeah - like the very late 1800s. Definitely not the _tenth century_ 🤣 ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2026, 6:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-discussion-thread-for-israel-gaza-west-bank-hijacks-tolerated/1031615/740 "2026-10-14T06:39:34Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > Funny coincidence how the 600 years the rabbis of Babylon spent working on the Talmud just sort of _stopped_ a couple of decades after the Muslims took over. The horseshoe is one thing, but whitewashing the CALIPHATES is a whole new low. Like, it doesn’t seem like much of a bullet to bite to admit that the islamification of the Middle East was in fact due to the aggressive conquest of the Caliphates and their persecution of non-muslims and non-Arabs, but I guess it’s only bad if a white person does it. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2026, 6:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-discussion-thread-for-israel-gaza-west-bank-hijacks-tolerated/1031615/741 "2026-10-14T06:41:08Z")
> [@MrDibble](#): > > When they first started calling themselves Palestinians. Why did the land of Israel come to be called “Palestine”? _Because an invading force displaced the native population, hijacked their religion, and renamed it after their ancient (extinct) enemies in order to mock them._ ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2026, 6:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-discussion-thread-for-israel-gaza-west-bank-hijacks-tolerated/1031615/742 "2026-10-14T06:50:42Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > Did you think the Ashkenazim wound up in eastern Europe because they enjoyed the climate and hospitality? Do you think they wound up there because of the _Arab_ conquest? > [@Smapti](#): > > Funny coincidence how the 600 years the rabbis of Babylon spent working on the Talmud just sort of _stopped_ a couple of decades after the Muslims took over. What’s that got to do with the Ashkenazim? Who’s disputing the Arabs conquered the area? > [@Babale](#): > > This is the same game that’s played with the “kill the Boers” BS Oh, please, tell me about my own area’s idioms > [@Babale](#): > > Boers are an ethnic group whose name etymologically derives from a profession. And also a name for a different, porcine, occupation… > [@Babale](#): > > Boers today are not Dutch people. Funny, we still call them Dutchmen… > [@Babale](#): > > They are a new and distinct group, which, yes, originated in Africa. Naah. > [@Babale](#): > > That’s some serious historical revisionism. Take it up with [the guy who kept insisting he was _filastini_](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Al-Maqdisi) > [@Babale](#): > > Oh, hey, I guess if Israel was to convert all the Palestinians either forcibly or by making them Dhimmi for a few centuries until they decided they were better off converting, you wouldn’t consider that colonization? No, I’d call that conquest. > [@Babale](#): > > Somebody tell Ben Gvir! You think that racist pig would want any Palestinians muddying up his precious Zion? I’m pretty sure he’d sooner die. > [@Babale](#): > > Definitely not the _tenth century_ Take that up with Al-Maqdisi > [@Babale](#): > > it doesn’t seem like much of a bullet to bite to admit that the islamification of the Middle East was in fact due to the aggressive conquest of the Caliphates and their persecution of non-muslims and non-Arabs Who here has denied this? You’re arguing with some phantom. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2026, 6:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-discussion-thread-for-israel-gaza-west-bank-hijacks-tolerated/1031615/743 "2026-10-14T06:52:45Z")
> [@MrDibble](#): > > Do you think they wound up there because of the _Arab_ conquest? Among other things. > [@MrDibble](#): > > Who’s disputing the Arabs conquered the area? So you acknowledge that the Arabs are colonizers. > [@MrDibble](#): > > Funny, we still call them Dutchmen… And lots of Americans are still called “Irish” or “Italian” or “African” even though their great-grandparents never set foot in those places. What’s your point? ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2026, 6:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-discussion-thread-for-israel-gaza-west-bank-hijacks-tolerated/1031615/744 "2026-10-14T06:53:08Z")
> [@MrDibble](#): > > Funny, we still call them Dutchmen… Yes, you’ve made your goodness for [racial slurs](https://dsae.co.za/entry/dutchman/e02182) pretty clear in the past. > [@](#): > > b. slang. A derogatory and offensive name for an Afrikaner person, used of both men and women ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2026, 6:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-discussion-thread-for-israel-gaza-west-bank-hijacks-tolerated/1031615/745 "2026-10-14T06:55:21Z")
> [@MrDibble](#): > > > [@Babale](#): > > > > They are a new and distinct group, which, yes, originated in Africa. > > Naah Fair enough, I used incorrect terminology there. Afrikaners on the other hand are a distinct ethnic group that did indeed originate in Africa. Boers are just a subgroup of Afrikaners. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2026, 6:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-discussion-thread-for-israel-gaza-west-bank-hijacks-tolerated/1031615/746 "2026-10-14T06:59:54Z")
> [@MrDibble](#): > > Take it up with [the guy who kept insisting he was _filastini_](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Al-Maqdisi) From your link: > [@](#): > > Shams al-Din Abu Abd Allah Muhammad ibn Ahmad ibn Abi Bakr,[a] commonly known by the nisba al-Maqdisi[b] or al-Muqaddasī,[c] meaning Jerusalemite, was a medieval Arab[1] geographer, author of The Best Divisions in the Knowledge of the Regions[d] and Description of _ **Syria** _. Emphasis mine. Are you going to tell me that Maqdiso (Jerusalemite) also refers to a distinct ethnic group? 🤣 Yes, there was a region within Syria sometimes called Palestine, but that doesn’t make Levantine Arabs who come from there a distinct ethnic group, any more than New Englanders are. > [@MrDibble](#): > > Take that up with Al-Maqdisi The Jerusalemite? What about him? > [@MrDibble](#): > > Who here has denied this? You’re arguing with some phantom. You: > [@MrDibble](#): > > A [bunch of locals](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestinians#Genetics) converted to Islam? Including, it seems, no small amount of Israelites. That’s a bit like describing the trans Atlantic slave trade as “a bunch of locals moved to America and found new jobs?”. What you did there is called “whitewashing”. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2026, 7:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-discussion-thread-for-israel-gaza-west-bank-hijacks-tolerated/1031615/747 "2026-10-14T07:07:17Z")
> [@MrDibble](#): > > Oh, please, tell me about my own area’s idioms Talk about tossing stones while living in a glass house… Tell me more about Judaism and Israel 🙄 ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2026, 7:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-discussion-thread-for-israel-gaza-west-bank-hijacks-tolerated/1031615/748 "2026-10-14T07:18:46Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > Why did the land of Israel come to be called “Palestine”? Because that was also what it used to be called in Antiquity (Herodotus and Aristotle much?) and the Middle Ages, _before_ the Ottomans? > [@Smapti](#): > > Among other things. Naah. The Ashkenazim mainly descend from Jews who were _already_ in Europe by the conquests. Babale’s helpful Erfurt cite bears that out, too. > [@Smapti](#): > > So you acknowledge that the Arabs are colonizers. The Peninsula Arabs were, yes, was that in doubt? Of course, if you’re going to insist on using the word Arab to refer to two different populations, I’m never going to agree that “Arabs” overall are. > [@Smapti](#): > > And lots of Americans are still called “Irish” or “Italian” or “African” even though their great-grandparents never set foot in those places. And I’d say the first two are European _in origin_, while the latter are distinctly American. > [@Smapti](#): > > What’s your point? Origins have meaning. > [@Babale](#): > > you’ve made your goodness for [racial slurs](https://dsae.co.za/entry/dutchman/e02182) pretty clear in the past. I’ll be sure to let my colleague who self-identifies as one know. > [@Babale](#): > > Afrikaners on the other hand are a distinct ethnic group that did indeed originate in Africa. Naah. You can make that case for Afrikaans-speaking Coloureds, but not Afrikaners. > [@Babale](#): > > Emphasis mine. What does that signify, because I think this (same link) signifies much more: > Al-Maqdisi identified himself as “[Palestinian](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestinian_identity "Palestinian identity")” (_filastini_) when asked if he was “Egyptian” during his travels in [Shiraz](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shiraz "Shiraz").[[9]](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Al-Maqdisi#cite_note-14)[[10]](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Al-Maqdisi#cite_note-Maqdisi2-15)[[11]](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Al-Maqdisi#cite_note-16)[[12]](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Al-Maqdisi#cite_note-Zakariyeh-17) His writings also recount thirty-six different names he was given by those he encountered during his travels, the first two being _Muqadassi_ (“Jerusalemite”) and _Filastini_ (“Palestinian”).[[13]](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Al-Maqdisi#cite_note-Masalhap171-18)[[14]](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Al-Maqdisi#cite_note-19) > [@Babale](#): > > Are you going to tell me that Maqdiso (Jerusalemite) also refers to a distinct ethnic group? Are you going to tell me when someone says they’re an Angelino, they’re making a statement about their ethnicity? > [@Babale](#): > > that doesn’t make Levantine Arabs who come from there a distinct ethnic group, If they insistently identify themselves as being from there it’s certainly the case that they’re marking that as “distinct from the wider Levantine Arab identity?” > [@Babale](#): > > That’s a bit like describing the trans Atlantic slave trade as “a bunch of locals moved to America and found new jobs?”. Nothing like that. I was literally asked what happened _when they were conquered_. The conquest part _was already part of the equation_, in a way the slavery part _is not_ in your poor analogy. > [@Babale](#): > > What you did there is called “whitewashing”. Nope. > [@Babale](#): > > Tell me more about Judaism and Israel I only talk about the bits that the data support. “Data over Dogma”, as they say. If you don’t like where the data leads, can’t really help you. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2026, 7:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-discussion-thread-for-israel-gaza-west-bank-hijacks-tolerated/1031615/749 "2026-10-14T07:19:08Z")
> [@Babale](#): > > goodness Gah, autocorrect typo… That should read “fondness”. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2026, 7:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-discussion-thread-for-israel-gaza-west-bank-hijacks-tolerated/1031615/750 "2026-10-14T07:21:15Z")
> [@MrDibble](#): > > Because that was also what it used to be called in Antiquity (Herodotus and Aristotle much?) and the Middle Ages, _before_ the Ottomans? Wrong. The Romans specifically picked the name to mock the Jews and sever their connection to the land after the Bar Kochba rebellion by naming it after the people that their scriptures said had been their ancient enemies. > **[Syria Palaestina](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Syria_Palaestina)** > > Syria Palaestina (Koine Greek: Συρία ἡ Παλαιστίνη, romanized: Syría hē Palaistínē \[syˈri.a (h)e̝ palɛsˈtine̝\]) was the renamed Roman province formerly known as Judaea, possibly due to the Roman suppression of the Bar Kokhba revolt, in what was known as Palaestina (Palestine) between the early 2nd and late 4th centuries AD. The provincial capital was Caesarea Maritima. Diocletian added to it in c. 300 much of the province of Arabia Petraea. It forms part of the timeline of Roman Palestine,\[ The... > [@MrDibble](#): > > The Peninsula Arabs were, yes, was that in doubt? And colonization, I’m told, is _bad_, yes? > [@MrDibble](#): > > Origins have meaning. And the origin of the Jewish people is in Eretz Yisrael. They have an unbroken 2500-year tradition of being indigenous to the land and DNA backs up that tradition. We even have evidence that the priestly caste originated with a small group of families roughly around the time that the Torah says it ought to have. > [@MrDibble](#): > > I’ll be sure to let my colleague who self-identifies as one know. I’ve known plenty of black people who’ll call themselves the N-word. That doesn’t mean _I_ get to call them that. And I have a strong suspicion that you wouldn’t be OK with a white South African calling you the K-word. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2026, 7:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-discussion-thread-for-israel-gaza-west-bank-hijacks-tolerated/1031615/751 "2026-10-14T07:27:45Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > Wrong. The Romans specifically picked the name to mock the Jews and sever their connection to the land after the Bar Kochba rebellion. So Herodotus and Aristotle _didn’t_ call the region (their version of) Palestine? And thge Roman punitive renaming _wasn’t_ a callback to that name? > [@Smapti](#): > > And colonization, I’m told, is _bad_, yes? Yep > [@Smapti](#): > > And the origin of the Jewish people is in Eretz Yisrael. And the origins of the Ashkenazim are the Rhineland. > [@Smapti](#): > > I’ve known plenty of black people who’ll call themselves the N-word. That doesn’t mean _I_ get to call them that. Was it the “We” that confused you? I meant “We” as in “South Africans”, not “We” as in “me and my mates”. I don’t call _anyone_ Dutchman, any more than I personally call anyone a Boer. > [@Smapti](#): > > And I have a strong suspicion that you wouldn’t be OK with a white South African calling you the K-word. Well, I’d also be hilariously confused by their word choice, as I’m not Black. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2026, 7:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-discussion-thread-for-israel-gaza-west-bank-hijacks-tolerated/1031615/752 "2026-10-14T07:30:10Z")
> [@MrDibble](#): > > I’ll be sure to let my colleague who self-identifies as one know. Oh, well, I guess since I have a friend who self identifies with the N word, that’s not a slur either? Come on, we both know that’s not an argument. > [@MrDibble](#): > > > [@Babale](#): > > > > Afrikaners on the other hand are a distinct ethnic group that did indeed originate in Africa. > > Naah. You can make that case for Afrikaans-speaking Coloureds, but not Afrikaners. Yaaaah. Since you’re fond of quoting Wikipedia: > **[Afrikaners](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Afrikaners)** > > Afrikaners (.mw-parser-output .IPA-label-small{font-size:85%}.mw-parser-output .references .IPA-label-small,.mw-parser-output .infobox .IPA-label-small,.mw-parser-output .navbox .IPA-label-small{font-size:100%}Afrikaans: \[afriˈkɑːnərs\]) are a Southern African ethnic group descended from predominantly Dutch settlers who first arrived at the Cape of Good Hope in 1652. Until 1994, they dominated South Africa's politics as well as the country's commercial and agricultural sector. Afrikaans, a langu... > [@](#): > > Afrikaners (Afrikaans: [afriˈkɑːnərs]) are a Southern African ethnic group > [@MrDibble](#): > > Are you going to tell me when someone says they’re an Angelino, they’re making a statement about their ethnicity? No, that’s another great example! People from LA County who call themselves Angelinos are describing their region of residence, not their ethnicity. Just like all Maqdiso. > [@MrDibble](#): > > If they insistently identify themselves as being from there it’s certainly the case that they’re marking that as “distinct from the wider Levantine Arab identity?” Right, I agree. And that only started being the case in any widespread way as a reaction to Zionism and then moreso after the failure of Pan Arabism. > [@MrDibble](#): > > Nothing like that. I was literally asked what happened _when they were conquered_. The conquest part _was already part of the equation_, in a way the slavery part _is not_ in your poor analogy. Conquest doesn’t necessitate forced conversion or apartheid, which you brushed under the rug. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2026, 7:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-discussion-thread-for-israel-gaza-west-bank-hijacks-tolerated/1031615/753 "2026-10-14T07:30:19Z")
> [@MrDibble](#): > > Yep Then the Arab colonization of Israel was also bad, yes? > [@MrDibble](#): > > And the origins of the Ashkenazim are the Rhineland. _Which they fled to as refugees after living in Eretz Yisrael was no longer tenable._ Do you believe that people of Palestinian ancestry living in the diaspora have ceased to be of Palestinian origin? Are the residents of Ain al-Hilweh Lebanese now? ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2026, 7:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-discussion-thread-for-israel-gaza-west-bank-hijacks-tolerated/1031615/754 "2026-10-14T07:52:18Z")
> [@Babale](#): > > Oh, well, I guess since I have a friend who self identifies with the N word, that’s not a slur either? I’m sure it isn’t to him. But you try calling him that and let us know… > [@Babale](#): > > Afrikaners (Afrikaans: [afriˈkɑːnərs]) are a Southern African ethnic group you missed a bit… > descended from predominantly [Dutch](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dutch_people "Dutch people") [settlers](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Settler_colonialism "Settler colonialism") > [@Babale](#): > > No, that’s another great example! People from LA County who call themselves Angelinos are describing their region of residence, not their ethnicity. Just like all Maqdiso. And when that same Angelino says they’re “Korean, not Chinese”, that’s just describing their “region of origin”, I’m sure… > [@Babale](#): > > Right, I agree. So, you agree al-Maqdisi was saying he was Palestinian. > [@Babale](#): > > And that only started being the case in any widespread way Aah, I thought these goalposts weren’t tied down enough… > [@Babale](#): > > Conquest doesn’t necessitate forced conversion No doubt a lot was forced, and some wasn’t, just like in plenty of other conquests of the time. Not mentioning it is hardly “brushing it under the rug”. The salient point was that locals were converted to Islam and large-scale population replacement didn’t take place. Since _the origin of the Palestinians_ was the issue. How they were converted isn’t relevant to that. > [@Babale](#): > > or apartheid If they converted, as they clearly did, they wouldn’t be subject to dhimmitude, any way. So why would it come up? > [@Smapti](#): > > Then the Arab colonization of Israel was also bad, yes? Sure. All colonization is. What’s your point? > [@Smapti](#): > > Which they fled to as refugees after living in Eretz Yisrael was no longer tenable. Erm, nope. This is just the Israeli myth that the Diaspora was exclusively of people fleeing conquest. The Roman Empire had a large population of Jews that had moved way before the Second Temple ever fell. Italy had a substantial Jewish population (tens of thousands) before A.D. 70. > [@Smapti](#): > > Do you believe that people of Palestinian ancestry living in the diaspora have ceased to be of Palestinian origin? Is there a substantial population that’s half Palestinian-half Chinese, that only speaks a dialect of Cantonese? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-discussion-thread-for-israel-gaza-west-bank-hijacks-tolerated/1031615.md?page=36) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-discussion-thread-for-israel-gaza-west-bank-hijacks-tolerated/1031615.md?page=38)