# New FX Series: The Americans (Starts Jan 30th) **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [January 24, 2013, 2:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-fx-series-the-americans-starts-jan-30th/648172 "2013-01-24T02:09:33Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 11
**Author:** ![Tamerlane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tamerlane/32/7602_2.png) [@Tamerlane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tamerlane)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2013, 3:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-fx-series-the-americans-starts-jan-30th/648172/201 "2013-03-17T03:42:25Z")
> [@Irishman](#): > > Very odd string of circumstances. He beat her up to get photos and a hospital report, but then she spends the night in his bed rather than actually at the police and hospital. I can’t figure out how they story was pulled off and how it convinced the Americans. I’m presuming she went to the hospital - afterwards. No quick DNA trests in the 1980’s, so Philip having had sex with her would just further cement the rape story, since _that_ would have been detectable.. ---
**Author:** ![alphaboi867](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alphaboi867/32/3898_2.png) [@alphaboi867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alphaboi867)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2013, 3:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-fx-series-the-americans-starts-jan-30th/648172/202 "2013-03-17T03:53:39Z")
They didn’t have DNA tests _at all_ in '81. The most they could do with a semen sample was run a blood-type on it. ---
**Author:** ![Irishman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/b487fb/32.png) [@Irishman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Irishman)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2013, 4:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-fx-series-the-americans-starts-jan-30th/648172/203 "2013-03-18T16:13:28Z")
> [@What\_the](#): > > I didn’t understand the significance of the fake mugging in the park. It plays on his sympathy and helps get the girl to his hotel room. Push all the emotional buttons and set up her willingness to get with him. It’s part of the con. Tell him she wants him, get him alone and passed out. Then say she was forced. > [@](#): > > Was the priest character supposed to be based on a historical figure? I was trying to figure that out myself. The premise of the polish leader seemed a bit like [Lech Walesa](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lech_Wa%C5%82%C4%99sa), but Walesa wasn’t a priest, he was a labor union organizer. I don’t think it was a direct analog. > [@](#): > > As for the son… did she say he was back in the USSR rather than with her in Canada? Question: she came to the conference with the cover as a Canadian, but was she really living in Canada, or was that just her cover? She had that conversation with Phillip about Canada, but that could have been in cover. > [@Tamerlane](#): > > I’m presuming she went to the hospital - afterwards. No quick DNA trests in the 1980’s, so Philip having had sex with her would just further cement the rape story, since _that_ would have been detectable.. Except they didn’t seem to be setting up the sex as part of the story. I mean, they were sleeping in bed when the wife called, not buttoning her up to run off to the hospital etc. ---
**Author:** ![What\_the](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f4b2a3/32.png) [@What\_the](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_the)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2013, 5:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-fx-series-the-americans-starts-jan-30th/648172/204 "2013-03-18T17:09:02Z")
> [@Irishman](#): > > It plays on his sympathy and helps get the girl to his hotel room. Push all the emotional buttons and set up her willingness to get with him. It’s part of the con. Tell him she wants him, get him alone and passed out. Then say she was forced. … at the risk of drawing attention to them and all kinds of other unintended consequences. Are you sure there wasn’t something else involved? I thought maybe he had to slip something to her… instructions maybe?? ---
**Author:** ![Ibn\_Warraq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e19b73/32.png) [@Ibn\_Warraq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ibn_Warraq)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2013, 5:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-fx-series-the-americans-starts-jan-30th/648172/205 "2013-03-18T17:37:28Z")
I kind of like the idea that Philip and Irina inadvertently helped out the Solidarity Movement by the guy they discredited being replaced by a leader who was more effective, Lech Walesa. ---
**Author:** ![Human\_Action](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ac91a4/32.png) [@Human\_Action](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Human_Action)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2013, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-fx-series-the-americans-starts-jan-30th/648172/206 "2013-03-18T17:40:35Z")
Me too; I kept waiting for mention that a new chairman had been named: Lech Walesa. Oh well. ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2013, 8:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-fx-series-the-americans-starts-jan-30th/648172/207 "2013-03-18T20:42:35Z")
Are they on hiatus for spring break? ---
**Author:** ![Irishman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/b487fb/32.png) [@Irishman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Irishman)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2013, 8:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-fx-series-the-americans-starts-jan-30th/648172/208 "2013-03-18T20:56:36Z")
> [@What\_the](#): > > … at the risk of drawing attention to them and all kinds of other unintended consequences. > > Are you sure there wasn’t something else involved? I thought maybe he had to slip something to her… instructions maybe?? That doesn’t make any sense. Running spy ops inherently carries the risk of drawing attention to themselves, etc. They still run spy ops all the time. It is not the goal to avoid risk, it is the goal to minimize and control risk. The plan was to introduce her via the reporter, then have him bail on them, so they have a charming casual conversation. A casual walk through the park, some gentle flirtation, she gets him to talk his security into giving them some “personal space”. That creates the opening for Philip to “attack”. Philip tries a purse snatching, gets grabbed by the guy, relies on his training and ability to get away, sprint into the undercover ahead of the security detachment, then quickly change appearance. Thus he dropped the gray sweatsuit and is wearing black clothing of a different style. Then casually walks away like every other pedestrian in the area while security is befuddled, looking for the mugger running away, finding empty sweats, and no one running away. The attack helps by triggering the guy’s sympathy, she’s hurt, he takes her up to his room to make sure she’s okay, etc. They’re alone, she turns up the flirting and makes an overt pass. Then knocks him out. The thing is the overt pass helped her because if he accepted, it would help sell the realism of her staying over the night and things getting out of control. He turned her down, but still passed out, so it was still a workable story. Instead of killing him, they discredit him with the Americans and he steps out of the cause. > [@Ibn\_Warraq](#): > > I kind of like the idea that Philip and Irina inadvertently helped out the Solidarity Movement by the guy they discredited being replaced by a leader who was more effective, Lech Walesa. Well, it wasn’t directly the Solidarity Movement, this guy didn’t seem to be related to the labor movement. Rather, it was a different method of establishing a Polish “government in exile”. Solidarity was a labor movement to get unions that became a Polish independence organization. So it wasn’t so much this helped Walesa and Solidarity, but rather was a prior attempt at a public movement for Polish independence that failed. My other observation about the show is that Elizabeth was stupid to say what she did to her handler like that. It’s one thing to not feel you need to apologize, but saying you wished you had finished the job is sabotaging yourself. She still has to work with that lady, that lady still has the direct communication to headquarters and authority to monitor her performance and attitude, to judge whether she is still trustworthy. If she didn’t feel like apologizing, then don’t, or apologize that “our working relationship has been weakened and our mutual trust degraded” or some bullshit answer. But outright saying you wished you had killed her? Of course she took it as a direct threat. You don’t get to be an old Cold War spy by letting that go. It was one thing to go wild in the moment and have to be pulled off, quite another to tell her off now. I mean, unless she can request a new handler, which I don’t think she can. ---
**Author:** ![interface2x](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/c0e974/32.png) [@interface2x](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/interface2x)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2013, 11:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-fx-series-the-americans-starts-jan-30th/648172/209 "2013-03-18T23:17:30Z")
> [@Chefguy](#): > > Are they on hiatus for spring break? Not to my knowledge, my DVR says a new episode is on this week. ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2013, 12:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-fx-series-the-americans-starts-jan-30th/648172/210 "2013-03-19T00:21:32Z")
> [@interface2x](#): > > Not to my knowledge, my DVR says a new episode is on this week. But none next week. ---
**Author:** ![What\_the](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f4b2a3/32.png) [@What\_the](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_the)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2013, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-fx-series-the-americans-starts-jan-30th/648172/211 "2013-03-19T16:07:32Z")
> [@Irishman](#): > > The attack helps by triggering the guy’s sympathy, she’s hurt, he takes her up to his room to make sure she’s okay, etc. They’re alone, she turns up the flirting and makes an overt pass. Then knocks him out. > > The thing is the overt pass helped her because if he accepted, it would help sell the realism of her staying over the night and things getting out of control. He turned her down, but still passed out, so it was still a workable story. Yeah…guess that makes sense. Especially assuming they knew that he didn’t want to get into her pants and probably would have avoided being alone with her to avoid any temptation. ---
**Author:** ![gallows\_fodder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/8c91f0/32.png) [@gallows\_fodder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gallows_fodder)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2013, 5:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-fx-series-the-americans-starts-jan-30th/648172/212 "2013-03-19T17:37:07Z")
Just caught up with this series and I’m totally digging it. Even the music they choose is fantastic. This last episode was the only one I didn’t really care for. I thought the lying at the end was too soap-opera, and the woman who played Irina was too bland and had next to no chemistry with Matthew Rhys. He made it seem like Philip didn’t care all that much about her, either (beyond what the script dictated), hence the big “lie” at the end about Elizabeth being the only one he loves seemed like the show was doing some unnecessary shit-disturbing. We _know_ he loves her, Elizabeth knew he was going to sleep with Irina as part of the mission, Philip didn’t seem to rekindle any attachment to Irina during their time together (distrusting her about the reality of their son, etc.)…so, what’s the problem here besides contrived drama? This show has been better than that so far. Whatever. The rest of the series has been A+ material so far, so a B episode isn’t a problem. ---
**Author:** ![Tamerlane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tamerlane/32/7602_2.png) [@Tamerlane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tamerlane)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2013, 5:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-fx-series-the-americans-starts-jan-30th/648172/213 "2013-03-19T17:47:39Z")
> [@gallows\_fodder](#): > > , Elizabeth knew he was going to sleep with Irina as part of the mission, Actually she may not, nor do we know it was planned that they do so. I speculated above that it couldn’t hurt and _might_ be planned ( they certainly have been ordered to screw various people before ). But we can’t be sure if that is the case. Philip may have gone off the reservation on that one. ---
**Author:** ![gallows\_fodder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/8c91f0/32.png) [@gallows\_fodder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gallows_fodder)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2013, 5:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-fx-series-the-americans-starts-jan-30th/648172/214 "2013-03-19T17:51:57Z")
But how else was it supposed to look like Irina and Polish Dude had sex? And it seemed from the dialogue at the beginning that Elizabeth knew what was in the works, as she made a comment to him about it (which I’m blanking on now, but she gave him a vague warning about getting emotionally involved). Maybe I should watch this one again… ---
**Author:** ![alphaboi867](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alphaboi867/32/3898_2.png) [@alphaboi867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alphaboi867)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2013, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-fx-series-the-americans-starts-jan-30th/648172/215 "2013-03-19T17:53:14Z")
> [@Tamerlane](#): > > Actually she may not, nor do we know it was planned that they do so. I speculated above that it couldn’t hurt and _might_ be planned ( they certainly have been ordered to screw various people before ). But we can’t be sure if that is the case. Philip may have gone off the reservation on that one. If she actually went to the hospital and had a rape exam they’d need ensure it’d turn up evidence of recent sexual activity. As I pointed out there were no DNA tests in 1981 so all they’d need is a man with the same blood-type as Polish guy. ---
**Author:** ![TonySinclair](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/49beb7/32.png) [@TonySinclair](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TonySinclair)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2013, 6:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-fx-series-the-americans-starts-jan-30th/648172/216 "2013-03-19T18:59:21Z")
> [@alphaboi867](#): > > If she actually went to the hospital and had a rape exam they’d need ensure it’d turn up evidence of recent sexual activity. As I pointed out there were no DNA tests in 1981 so all they’d need is a man with the same blood-type as Polish guy. I still don’t get the timeline. She’s walking in the park with the priest; Phillip fake attacks them; the priest takes her to his room where she drugs him; she leaves the room with nothing but a skinned knee; she then goes to Phillip’s room, where he beats her up; then she spends the night with him (they were both apparently asleep when Elizabeth called); then she goes to the cops and hospital? The priest had at least two bodyguards when they were walking in the park. What happened to them? How did nobody see her leave the priest’s room without any facial damage? ---
**Author:** ![Irishman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/b487fb/32.png) [@Irishman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Irishman)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2013, 10:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-fx-series-the-americans-starts-jan-30th/648172/217 "2013-03-19T22:03:10Z")
I agree the timeline is funky. I agree the two bodygaurds are missing from the equation of how she sneaks out to get beat up. I don’t think sex was part of the equation or required. I think they wanted the bruises so they could get pictures and fake the report. But it doesn’t really make sense. Either they were faking everything - the report, the hospital, the police involvement - in which case make up would have worked sufficiently well. Or else she actually did file a police report and go to the hospital for exam, in which case the sex would be a useful addition for the rape charge, but then why were she and Philip sleeping in bed? I mean, he was lying on his side, rolled over to answer the phone, then she was on the other side under a pillow. That didn’t appear to be a post-coital cuddle prior to engaging the rest of the act. So what gives? ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2013, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-fx-series-the-americans-starts-jan-30th/648172/218 "2013-03-21T18:35:08Z")
Is Granny a CIA double agent? Becuase it seems she is doing everything possible to make her agents less effective. First test their loyalty is the most brutal and unecessary way possible. Then attack their marriage, you know the only real support that they have so far from home. “Arrangement?” For fucks sake if _I_ was KGB I would be trying my hardest to establish ties of affection…they have to rely on each other as it is. I wonder if they are going to split them up. Since, that would lead to great awkwardness as they still have to work together, but I think its the chemistry between the couple that makes this series work so well. The secondary plot re the scientists and the tertiary plot with the secretary. For the former while it was good entertainment and it was great to see a fuck up for once by the Jennings, I can’t see where they will go with that. The secretary and the hispanic FBI agent? No clue where that is leading. BYW who was the hooker with the doomed FBI agent? I thought originally that she was Russell but apparently not. ---
**Author:** ![Oslo\_Ostragoth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/a9a28c/32.png) [@Oslo\_Ostragoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oslo_Ostragoth)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2013, 7:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-fx-series-the-americans-starts-jan-30th/648172/219 "2013-03-21T19:57:12Z")
Did anyone understand the hotel room/shaped charge scene? Because I sure didn’t. ---
**Author:** ![alphaboi867](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alphaboi867/32/3898_2.png) [@alphaboi867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alphaboi867)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2013, 8:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-fx-series-the-americans-starts-jan-30th/648172/220 "2013-03-21T20:21:25Z")
Stan’s even stupider than Vasili. Nina is not falling in love with him; she’s using sex to manipulate him for her own protection. Just like she did with Vasili. :smack: Not that I feel any sympathy for him. I like how she pointed the difference between handling spies and monitoring criminals. I don’t think Claudia is a double agent, but I do wonder if she’s going to sabotage the Jennings so she has an excuse to eliminate them. She knows she fucked up with the “loyalty test” and wants to cover her ass now. I wonder, do the Jennings even have a way of contacting someone higher up in the chain of command than her? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-fx-series-the-americans-starts-jan-30th/648172.md?page=10) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-fx-series-the-americans-starts-jan-30th/648172.md?page=12)