I think that cults and cult-like religions all do that.
Mormons target immigrants but here in America and also in Europe. In secular Western Europe, most of the baptisms are immigrants. Very little retention rate, however.
There are a few Spanish speaking missions in the States and many other missions where there is a significant number of missionaries studying Spanish.
Even in countries which have few immigrants, such as Japan, they also target immigrants and immigrant workers.
There are plenty of things wrong with the religion, but no they don’t intentionally go after poor innocent immigrants. As a worldwide organization they do have literature in hundreds of languages and as part of trying to reach people of all nations they do preach to immigrants in their own languages when possible, but not out of some conspiratorial cult mentality. JW’s target everyone.
There’s also no specific hour requirement as mentioned above, though they do encourage people to push for more time in the ministry (there’s a difference between the two). I do have issues with the push, but I have lots of issues with them despite being one, and inactive one at that. Like I said, there are plenty of issues with the organization (like any organization) and the people that comprise it (like pretty much any mass of humanity), so there’s no need to make stuff up. It seems to me that the people deep in it are blind to any wrongs in the organization, and the people that are out of it are blind by hatred of the organization. The truth, in all things, usually lies somewhere in the middle (though the JW’s do lay claim to having “The Truth”, which is absurd).
Is it not true that one of the ways a JW publisher is considered “inactive” is that they have not turned in a field service time card for several months?
Perhaps you have had a different experience, but many former JWs have said that they were pressured to put down a certain number of hours to remain in good standing. Many JWs end up lying on their time cards just to keep elders off their case.
I AM inactive but nobody has come to revoke my JW card. It is just a term for one that hasn’t been active in reporting time for six months. Nobody ever hunted us down as evil inactive people. Now, one gripe I have is that for a religion that claims to have love as its identifying mark I do have qualms with the notion that I can literally disappear and nobody would call to see if I’m still alive, but that’s another issue.
Sure, there are some people that have had more pressure. That’s the problem you get when you try to label any group based on the experiences of some. Like I said, the truth is usually in the middle.
I didn’t mean to give the impression that one would be persecuted or disfellowshipped for going inactive, but yes in many cases inactive people are “encouraged” to come back and get back to work in one way or another.
The definition of “love” that JWs use doesn’t make a lot of sense to me. If you really love someone, by my definition, then you would not stop talking to that person just because they no longer believe in the Governing Body and no longer want to be a JW.
Within their logic, that is a loving action, because the end (manipulating the person to coming back to the religion and thus assuring their salvation) justifies the means (cruelty and emotional blackmail).
I’m not in favour, obviously, but the human mind is an amazing thing, and I really think they convince themselves it’s done out of love.
Oh yes, the love is defintely conditional. Like Drake said above, the motive is good, though to be honest it isn’t all about them coming back when one is disfellowshipped. It is also about keeping the congregation morally clean, and I kind of see a point in that. Therein is where your JW card is revoked. However, I do have issues with it. Sometimes it seems very punitive, and while there should be no pleasure in meting put such discipline I’ve seen it. Maybe it is overzealous caring for the appearance of the organization, but I’ve seen it. Additionally, you chose to mention that it is administered because someone no longer agrees with the governing body, but it is more so because one is seen as no longer agreeing with God and their dedication to him.
I lost my brother to disfellowshipping. I didn’t speak to him for a decade. Then last year I was thinking about the whole concept and at a point it doesn’t make sense. If the person is only coming back due to family pressure and ostracism, then he doesn’t have a good reason. After all, it is SUPPOSED to be about the person’s relationship with God, not their family. Additionally, my brother was no longer pursuing the course that got him disfellowshipped. He is married and has a nice life, sans his family and former religion. He did turn his life around. He just no longer agreed with the religion, and I can’t hold that against him. I reached out to him, started a dialogue, and have even had him and his wife over for a weekend, as they live elsewhere. My wife and I hope to visit them this year. Anyway, my point is that again the truth lies in the middle, in my opinion. I do see a place for disfellowshipping as something that is done, but I also see it as cruel psychological warfare at times. As with most things in life, I no longer see such rigid rules and the tiny box that puts people (and God) in as healthy. I find that most things require some measure of individual attention and flexibility.
My family reacted badly to me reaching out to my brother. Then again, we still hang out, they just didn’t approve. Okay, that’s there choice and I made mine. It is sad, but there’s nothing I can do about it. As with all things in life, sometimes things work out and sometimes they don’t. I’m angry and have strong negative feelings about a lot of things, but that doesn’t mean that everything is bad. It just means I have to go on my journey my way.
You have no reasons to feel bad , JW are always trespassing on people property at all odd hours of the day and they do not like anyone being on their property.
I had some work done on my home and JW came over when the workers were here. I told the woman that she is trespassing and if she came here again I was going to call the cops . I told one of the men that I hope he did not mind me doing this. The guy said" No" Then he went on to say that he got lost once and pulled into JW driveway to call his friend and within second someone came up to his car and told him that “He was trespassing and if did not leave right away they were going to call the cops!” WTF! JW is always trespassing they would come right into our condo and knock on my door ! And JW will not let person use their driveway to made call in their own car. You’re damn right JW is unwanted intrusion and thy stopped coming to my home after I threaten to call the cops on them.
You should not lose sleep over not reading that trash.
purplehearingaid, I am insanely anti-JW, but you really shouldn’t judge an entire group by the actions of one individual that you only heard about second-hand.
JW has been to my home a number of times so I had plenty of encounters with them and that is enough to form my own opinion of them . The story the guy told did not made me feel the way I do . I can’t stand people trying to force their beliefs onto me. If JW was smart they would let people decide for their self if they wanted know about their belief instead of trying to ram it down people throats .
I did not like JW coming to my home at odd hours and leaving their crap at my door ! JW needs to learn that everyone does not have same beliefs and respect that. They do not respect that and this is why I can’ t stand JW!!
Yes, I have noticed that they often have one standard for themselves and another standard for “worldly people” (all of us who are non-JWs are considered “worldly” to them).
For example, did you know that the leaders of the JWs tell their followers not to even look at any information about JWs that comes from outside the organization? They label any information critical of JWs as “apostate”: Watchtower Quotes Regarding Apostates
How arrogant do you have to be to think that you have “The Truth” and go door to door telling people they should listen to your view, yet when someone approaches you with a different POV you label it as “apostate” and refuse to listen?
So? Print up some of the information and tart up the cover so it looks like an issue of The Watchtower.
That’s pretty much the definition of religion. I’m right and you’re wrong and you need to listen to me, but I will not listen to you.
This attitude always comes up in JW threads. Yes, there is a degree to which each religion claims a truth that others don’t have. However, JWs really are different than other religions when it comes to talking about that truth and considering other options. They are very, very quick to close down any avenue of communication that is not one they control in a way that is foreign to most Christian groups.
That may be true today - but Catholic priests trying to preach in Elizabethan England wound up with their head on a pole. So JWs are hardly the first to do this, or the worst.
Their refusal to truly understand other positions makes them less effective. A lady came to my door with a little kid. I said “good, let’s talk about evolution” and discovered she really could only parrot the official position, and had no answer to the illogicality of it. I was absolutely polite to her, but I hope the kid might have absorbed that her partner really didn’t know much.
OMG. The very the beginning has them droning slowly about how exciting the broadcast will be.
True, but I don’t just the people of 2015 by the standards of 1565. We should know better. We often behave as if we don’t, because people suck sometimes.
I think you are misunderstanding the Watchtower Society’s motives. They’re not really out to convert others—they want and need converts, but that’s not the primary purpose. The primary purpose is control over new and existing members, and the power and money those members push upwards in the JW hierarchy. Even there they are far less than 100% effective—lots of people leave, and many others are inactive. The proselytizing is what is most visible to outsiders, and their own rhetoric talks about the need to convert, so people naturally accept this uncritically. It’s all part of a larger strategy that has evolved to keep people highly invested in their JW identity and make it more difficult to leave, partly because everyone they know is similarly invested, partly because it’s very hard for anyone to admit that they’ve wasted 10+ hours / month of their life for years on end. Stop going to church and you’re just changing a habit; stop witnessing and you’re changing habits as well as giving up on a huge time investment, which is hard for people to do.
TL; DR: Witnessing is more to keep the old JWs in than to bring in new ones.
If you couldn’t tolerate their wooden droning long enough to find the “music video”, some zealous JW has now posted it on youtube:
Considering that JWs are extremely anti-gay, a lot of ex-JWs are finding it funny that the music is so “show tunes”-like.
I’d have resealed it, written DECEASED - RETURN TO SENDER on the outside, and let the USPS take it back to her. Then let her wonder when she sees you walking about all nice and healthy.
The last encounter I had with JW drones was about two years ago, and they haven’t been back since, I thought the setup and results were hilarious because they were totally unplanned, yet worked in my favor amazingly well.
My nephew was over for a visit, and we decided to go to the local trap shooting range to play a few rounds, we had just gotten our shotguns, range backpack and ammo, and we were heading out the door, we both had our H&R single-shot shotguns we were carrying them with the actions open, and unloaded.
At that point, a pair of JW’s walked onto the porch, just as we were opening the door, they saw two people with shotguns, one of them (me) with an angry expression on my face, as I recognized their literature, they stopped dead, I glared at them and simply said “go away, were busy”…
They turned and fled to their car, and practically burned rubber as they fled from our driveway…
My nephew and I looked at each other, and laughed uproariously.
They haven’t been back since