# New method of spam calls? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [July 8, 2020, 4:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-method-of-spam-calls/914750 "2020-07-08T16:35:53Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![am77494](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/d2c977/32.png) [@am77494](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/am77494)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2020, 4:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-method-of-spam-calls/914750/1 "2020-07-08T16:35:53Z")
So lately with increased frequency I get a call which goes through the spam filter. I don’t pickup calls from unknown numbers and let it go to voice mail. The real surprising part is that when I call these numbers back, a genuine person picks up the phone and says they never called my number. Is this a new thing now ? Does it mean that unknown to me, someone maybe using my number to call up random people ? Can someone call 911 using my number, unknown to me ? Thanks ---
**Author:** ![yearofglad](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/b782af/32.png) [@yearofglad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yearofglad)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2020, 4:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-method-of-spam-calls/914750/2 "2020-07-08T16:58:52Z")
It’s relatively easy to “spoof” phone numbers, i.e., to make it look like a call is coming from a number that it isn’t actually coming from. That’s what’s going on here. Spammers often spoof their number so it looks like it comes from a number from an area you might be familiar with so you think it might be someone you know or something important. Could a spammer spoof your number and call me, and I would see your number on my caller ID? I don’t see why not. Could they call 911? I mean, I suppose they could, but they’re spammers - I’m not sure why they would. ---
**Author:** ![hajario](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hajario/32/171_2.png) [@hajario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hajario)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2020, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-method-of-spam-calls/914750/3 "2020-07-08T17:00:09Z")
I agree that it’s a spoof and this is nothing new. It’s been going on for years. ---
**Author:** ![DesertDog](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/desertdog/32/11503_2.png) [@DesertDog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DesertDog)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2020, 5:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-method-of-spam-calls/914750/4 "2020-07-08T17:08:16Z")
I have seen quite often numbers spoofed as 480 [NNN]-[XXXX] where the Ns are my exchange and the Xs are just four numbers. I’m guessing the callers are hoping I’ll think, “Oh! That must be Aunt Betsy!” and pick up the call. Thing is, I know _nobody_ with my exchange. Back in the day all of us: me, **DesertRoomie** , my brother, my sister-in-law, _her_ sister, and my two nephews, had cell phone service through Verizon’s family plan because it made for cheap monthly charges back when all you had was phone and SMS. No two of the numbers among us had the same exchange. It was as if Verizon pulled them out of a random bag. ---
**Author:** ![anny\_m](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/96bed5/32.png) [@anny\_m](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/anny_m)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2020, 5:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-method-of-spam-calls/914750/5 "2020-07-08T17:14:12Z")
A while back, I’m thinking probably two years ago, I got a call from someone who told me, “Stop calling me!” When I said I had never called him, I got the inevitable, “You did too!” Someone must have spoofed my number I told him, and hung up. I don’t know if he continued to get calls from my number or not – I never heard from him again. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2020, 5:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-method-of-spam-calls/914750/6 "2020-07-08T17:19:50Z")
Why is spoofing legal? I realize that blocking your number can be valid in certain circumstances, but why is putting in a fake number and/or name even allowed? ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2020, 5:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-method-of-spam-calls/914750/7 "2020-07-08T17:41:35Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Why is spoofing legal? Who says it is? > [@Wikipedia](#): > > Under the Truth in Caller ID Act, FCC rules prohibit anyone from transmitting misleading or inaccurate caller ID information with the intent to defraud, cause harm or wrongly obtain anything of value. Anyone who is illegally spoofing can face penalties of up to $10,000 for each violation. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2020, 5:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-method-of-spam-calls/914750/8 "2020-07-08T17:43:43Z")
To say that there is a type of spoofing that is illegal implies that there is a type of spoofing that is legal. Also how hard would it be for the providers to stop it from happening? ---
**Author:** ![cmkeller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cmkeller/32/118_2.png) [@cmkeller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cmkeller)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2020, 6:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-method-of-spam-calls/914750/9 "2020-07-08T18:50:38Z")
Legal spoofing is when a company has individual, direct phone numbers for every employee in their office but when an employee calls out, they make it look like the call came from the company’s general number. ---
**Author:** ![lobotomyboy63](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobotomyboy63/32/2900_2.png) [@lobotomyboy63](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lobotomyboy63)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2020, 6:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-method-of-spam-calls/914750/10 "2020-07-08T18:55:43Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > To say that there is a type of spoofing that is illegal implies that there is a type of spoofing that is legal. > Also how hard would it be for the providers to stop it from happening? You mean like Google Voice? So you want to use your personal phone to make a business call but you don’t want that person to have your actual phone number. We had a thread related to this awhile back. [https://voice.google.com/about](https://voice.google.com/about) ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2020, 9:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-method-of-spam-calls/914750/11 "2020-07-08T21:00:49Z")
Here’s a bunch about how the carriers are starting to fight back. [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/STIR/SHAKEN](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/STIR/SHAKEN) Once again all of this is because the caller ID system was designed back in the days of Ma Bell when bad actors simply couldn’t get their mitts on the data at a low enough level. Now that every communication is just data and every device is just a computer, every computer is a potential haven for bad actors. ---
**Author:** ![Eyebrows\_0f\_Doom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eyebrows_0f_doom/32/3119_2.png) [@Eyebrows\_0f\_Doom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eyebrows_0f_Doom)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2020, 12:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-method-of-spam-calls/914750/12 "2020-07-09T00:01:40Z")
No, the **real** surprising part is why are you calling these numbers back? ---
**Author:** ![hajario](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hajario/32/171_2.png) [@hajario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hajario)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2020, 12:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-method-of-spam-calls/914750/13 "2020-07-09T00:09:10Z")
If they didn’t know it was a spoof, they would have thought it was a missed call. ---
**Author:** ![Eyebrows\_0f\_Doom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eyebrows_0f_doom/32/3119_2.png) [@Eyebrows\_0f\_Doom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eyebrows_0f_Doom)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2020, 12:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-method-of-spam-calls/914750/14 "2020-07-09T00:29:58Z")
A legit missed call should leave a message. In this day and age with so many spam/spoofed numbers, any missed call that does not leave a message of who they are gets ignored, because they are 99.99999999999% spam. ---
**Author:** ![am77494](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/d2c977/32.png) [@am77494](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/am77494)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2020, 12:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-method-of-spam-calls/914750/15 "2020-07-09T00:59:15Z")
> [@Eyebrows\_0f\_Doom](#): > > A legit missed call should leave a message. In this day and age with so many spam/spoofed numbers, any missed call that does not leave a message of who they are gets ignored Agreed. My real concern is that someone may impersonate me in so many nefarious ways : 1. Call my spouse or kid spoofing my number and say I have met an accident and he is using my phone. Give her instructions to come somewhere … 2. Call the bank, credit card companies, online shopping, etc etc where they recognize you by your phone number. 3. Harass someone or make inappropriate calls to kids spoofing my number … ---
**Author:** ![CookingWithGas](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cookingwithgas/32/485_2.png) [@CookingWithGas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CookingWithGas)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2020, 1:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-method-of-spam-calls/914750/16 "2020-07-09T01:24:55Z")
> [@am77494](#): > > Does it mean that unknown to me, someone maybe using my number to call up random people ? There are thousands of stories from people who get a call and Caller ID shows it is _their own phone number_. > [@lobotomyboy63](#): > > You mean like Google Voice? Google Voice is not spoofing. You make a VOIP call from the Google Voice app from your phone and the Caller ID shows your Google Voice number. I can also use my business phone app on my smartphone to make a VOIP call that looks like it is from my office. ---
**Author:** ![aruvqan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aruvqan/32/2891_2.png) [@aruvqan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aruvqan)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2020, 2:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-method-of-spam-calls/914750/17 "2020-07-09T02:38:04Z")
> [@DesertDog](#): > > Thing is, I know _nobody_ with my exchange. Back in the day all of us: me, **DesertRoomie** , my brother, my sister-in-law, _her_ sister, and my two nephews, had cell phone service through Verizon’s family plan because it made for cheap monthly charges back when all you had was phone and SMS. > > No two of the numbers among us had the same exchange. It was as if Verizon pulled them out of a random bag. mrAru worked for Verizon cucstomer service back in the day, and it really was randomized, he said you basically get random pull of a block of numbers. I know our 3 phones are all one exchange but that is very unusual. I also _never_ answer any phone from our exchange - so far I have never gotten a call that wasn’t spammers. I have the other 2 numbers on our account programmed into my phone so it IDs them anyways =) ---
**Author:** ![BwanaBob](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bwanabob/32/2985_2.png) [@BwanaBob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BwanaBob)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2020, 6:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-method-of-spam-calls/914750/18 "2020-07-09T06:47:45Z")
The real question is why is it even physically possible to spoof. There should be no access to those fields by the end user, or at minimum, access should involve an encryption where only Verizon/whoever has the key. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2020, 11:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-method-of-spam-calls/914750/19 "2020-07-09T11:30:57Z")
> [@am77494](#): > > > [@Eyebrows\_0f\_Doom](#): > > > > A legit missed call should leave a message. In this day and age with so many spam/spoofed numbers, any missed call that does not leave a message of who they are gets ignored > > Agreed. My real concern is that someone may impersonate me in so many nefarious ways : > > 1. Call my spouse or kid spoofing my number and say I have met an accident and he is using my phone. Give her instructions to come somewhere … > 2. Call the bank, credit card companies, online shopping, etc etc where they recognize you by your phone number. > 3. Harass someone or make inappropriate calls to kids spoofing my number … Welcome to the 21st century. Every time you touch anything touched by a computer anywhere it may be completely fraudulent or even be a hostile government attacking you. Or using you to attack someone / something else. Everything you’re describing has been happening for the last decade or so. But very rarely compared to the gigantically greater volume of simple spam telemarketing calls. And there is exactly zero you can do to reduce or prevent any of it it. Except to warn your spouse and kids that caller ID, even _your_ caller ID, is merely a hint, not a fact. The fact this is still news to anyone in 2020 is very surprising to me. It’s definitely taking longer than we thought. Remember those Capital One ads a couple years ago with the horde of Visigoths / Vikings beseiging the suburban house & family? That is exactly what the whole e-world really is like. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2020, 11:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-method-of-spam-calls/914750/20 "2020-07-09T11:37:15Z")
> [@BwanaBob](#): > > The real question is why is it even physically possible to spoof. There should be no access to those fields by the end user, or at minimum, access should involve an encryption where only Verizon/whoever has the key. As described upthread and documented in the linked articles, caller ID was designed in the 1960 by Ma Bell when nobody else had access to any tech whatsoever. Since then, just like the internet, a system designed assuming 100% good guys was released into the wild with about 80% bad guys. We’ve been struggling to retrofit trust into the system ever since. The fact it’s a global system and certain authoritarian governments would LOVE to have every communication reliably signed so they could hound anyone they choose to target makes all this more complicated than it appears. The same anonymity that gives us 4chan trolls also gives us e.g.Uigher dissidents.