# New Orleans: Just how bad a disaster is this? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [August 31, 2005, 8:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-orleans-just-how-bad-a-disaster-is-this/319482 "2005-08-31T20:27:01Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 18\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2005, 6:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-orleans-just-how-bad-a-disaster-is-this/319482/101 "2005-09-02T18:18:04Z")
> [@xtisme](#): > > I was listening to the news somewhere today and they actually said this was a disaster of ‘biblical’ proportions…whatever the hell that means. Noah’s flood, destruction of Sodom, plagues of Egypt . . . that sort of thing. Do you think it’s hyperbole? ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2005, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-orleans-just-how-bad-a-disaster-is-this/319482/102 "2005-09-02T18:51:56Z")
BTW, public service announcement to all rooftop-stranded Orleanians: Watch out for Jasper Johns! 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2005, 6:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-orleans-just-how-bad-a-disaster-is-this/319482/103 "2005-09-02T18:54:59Z")
> [@Ponder Stibbons](#): > > Sorry, I meant the remaining 20% who stayed in the city. My bad. But don’t forget, the homeless/refugee population includes everybody whose home is now under water, whether they got out before the hurricane hit or not. ---
**Author:** ![Foaming\_Cleanser](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/f05b48/32.png) [@Foaming\_Cleanser](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Foaming_Cleanser)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2005, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-orleans-just-how-bad-a-disaster-is-this/319482/104 "2005-09-02T19:05:44Z")
Won’t the water run in and out of the city according to the tides? ---
**Author:** ![Ponder\_Stibbons](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ponder_stibbons/32/343_2.png) [@Ponder\_Stibbons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ponder_Stibbons)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2005, 7:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-orleans-just-how-bad-a-disaster-is-this/319482/105 "2005-09-02T19:10:14Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > But don’t forget, the homeless/refugee population includes everybody whose home is now under water, whether they got out before the hurricane hit or not. Well, I was only referring to the comment regarding how large the death toll is likely to be (tens of thousands vs hundreds of thousands). I’m assuming that among the 80% who got out very few died as a result of this storm and thus would not be included in this calculation. You’re quite right, though, that the refugee problem we are facing _is_ enormous, and now we _are_ facing numbers in the hundreds of thousands, perhaps even approaching a million people who are homeless. That’s a staggering number. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2005, 7:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-orleans-just-how-bad-a-disaster-is-this/319482/106 "2005-09-02T19:13:13Z")
> [@Foaming Cleanser](#): > > Won’t the water run in and out of the city according to the tides? I don’t think so. The water is coming in from Lake Pontchartrain and the Mississippi, not the Gulf of Mexico. No tides to speak of on the lake or river. ---
**Author:** ![Foaming\_Cleanser](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/f05b48/32.png) [@Foaming\_Cleanser](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Foaming_Cleanser)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2005, 7:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-orleans-just-how-bad-a-disaster-is-this/319482/107 "2005-09-02T19:16:46Z")
Thanks, BrainGlutton. I wondered about the tides because I know they have an effect on the Thames. ---
**Author:** ![lisacurl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/41988e/32.png) [@lisacurl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lisacurl)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2005, 7:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-orleans-just-how-bad-a-disaster-is-this/319482/108 "2005-09-02T19:21:55Z")
> [@Sunspace](#): > > Where did all those people who drove away from the city before the hurricane go? Just spread out among friends and relatives? Are there refugee camps for them as well? Three of them are in my house (my mom and sisters). My boss has ten people in her house (her ex-husband - the father of her son - and his relatives). Another coworker has three former coworkers of her fiance living with them in a small duplex. My immediate supervisor is going to have a friend’s parents staying with him. I predict that within the next few weeks, we’ll be seeing more and more folks show up at the shelters. People who are in the hotels are running out of money. ---
**Author:** ![Beware\_of\_Doug](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/278dde/32.png) [@Beware\_of\_Doug](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beware_of_Doug)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2005, 7:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-orleans-just-how-bad-a-disaster-is-this/319482/109 "2005-09-02T19:25:07Z")
> [@dalej42](#): > > Huh? They can reestablish contact with telephones and the internet. They’re not going to “freeze to death.” They’ll be living in the Midwest inside a house or apartment not in a Siberian labor camp. Psychological isolation? They’re still within the United States. Same money, same culture, same language. We’re not talking about adjusting from Pol Pot’s Cambodia to the United States. They still won’t be much more welcome in many communities – maybe less so – than the Cambodian boat people of the 70s & 80s. These folks are almost entirely from our “permanent” urban underclass – demoralized and passive for the most part, prone to crime and violence at worst, and every one of them deeply resentful. How many places are really prepared to deal with them? How many want them? ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2005, 8:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-orleans-just-how-bad-a-disaster-is-this/319482/110 "2005-09-02T20:08:33Z")
> [@Foaming Cleanser](#): > > Thanks, BrainGlutton. I wondered about the tides because I know they have an effect on the Thames. They do? Never heard that. What effect? ---
**Author:** ![Foaming\_Cleanser](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/f05b48/32.png) [@Foaming\_Cleanser](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Foaming_Cleanser)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2005, 8:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-orleans-just-how-bad-a-disaster-is-this/319482/111 "2005-09-02T20:22:30Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > They do? Never heard that. What effect? Here’s a [page](http://www.wpsa.co.uk/tide.html) that discusses them. > [@](#): > > Near to the new and full moons (about every two weeks) we have spring tides when there is a rise and fall between low tide and high tide of up to 8m (26’). Seven to eight days after spring tides we have neap tides where the tide is neither as low nor as high, then the difference between low water and high water is around 5m (16’). ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2005, 12:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-orleans-just-how-bad-a-disaster-is-this/319482/112 "2005-09-03T00:54:44Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > I don’t think so. The water is coming in from Lake Pontchartrain and the Mississippi, not the Gulf of Mexico. No tides to speak of on the lake or river. I thought Lake Pontchartrain was actually connected to the Gulf, and rises and falls with the tide. Does it? It’s a salt water lake. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2005, 6:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-orleans-just-how-bad-a-disaster-is-this/319482/113 "2005-09-03T06:16:04Z")
> [@Sam Stone](#): > > I thought Lake Pontchartrain was actually connected to the Gulf, and rises and falls with the tide. Does it? It’s a salt water lake. I dunno, maybe. This article – [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lake\_Pontchartrain](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lake_Pontchartrain) – says it’s a brackish-water lake and “To the east the Rigolets strait connects to Lake Borgne, which in turn connects to the Gulf of Mexico.” Nothing about tides. In any case, whatever the tidal action might be in the lake or the lower course of the Mississippi, I think it’s too much to expect the water in the streets of NO to “run . . . out with the tides.” ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2005, 2:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-orleans-just-how-bad-a-disaster-is-this/319482/114 "2005-09-03T14:47:14Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > > [@Johnny Angel](#): > > > > Damn. And here I was already thinking the song Do You Know What it Means to Miss New Orleans? would have a new poignance. > > For my part, I was flashing on “The Drain They Call the City of New Orleans” . . . Ottawa radio stations have pulled the Tragically Hip song, [New Orleans is Sinking](http://jam.canoe.ca/Music/Artists/T/Tragically_Hip/2005/08/31/1194947.html) from their playlists for the duration. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2005, 8:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-orleans-just-how-bad-a-disaster-is-this/319482/115 "2005-09-03T20:30:32Z")
[Answers.com](http://www.answers.com/topic/lake-pontchartrain) > [@](#): > > Tidal and brackish, the lake forms a popular resort and recreational region. The length and narrowness of the passage to the Gulf must dampen tidal variation considerably. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2005, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-orleans-just-how-bad-a-disaster-is-this/319482/116 "2005-09-03T20:38:02Z")
> [@Beware of Doug](#): > > They still won’t be much more welcome in many communities – maybe less so – than the Cambodian boat people of the 70s & 80s. These folks are almost entirely from our “permanent” urban underclass – demoralized and passive for the most part, prone to crime and violence at worst, and every one of them deeply resentful. How many places are really prepared to deal with them? How many want them? It’s only been 5 days, and we already have a new generation of Dust Bowl Okies, our own people, unlucky refugees from a natural disaster but considered inferior human beings for it all the same. Is that it? I sure as hell hope we’ve learned just a little bit since the last Depression. ---
**Author:** ![AFAIKnow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/a6a055/32.png) [@AFAIKnow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AFAIKnow)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2005, 9:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-orleans-just-how-bad-a-disaster-is-this/319482/117 "2005-09-03T21:08:42Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > It’s only been 5 days, and we already have a new generation of Dust Bowl Okies, our own people, unlucky refugees from a natural disaster but considered inferior human beings for it all the same. Is that it? I sure as hell hope we’ve learned just a little bit since the last Depression. Have you offered to take anyone into your own home? If you havn’t done so by now, I highly doubt you will once it is clear a good part of 1 million people will be displaced for months. Hopefully at that point the government will have temporary housing for them. As of now these people need to basically be supported for an indeterminate amount of time. That is alot to ask from anyone. Many are generously offering whatevr they can and sacrificing. So what have you learned from the last Depression? How many are moving into your house? ---
**Author:** ![Squink](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5e925/32.png) [@Squink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Squink)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2005, 9:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-orleans-just-how-bad-a-disaster-is-this/319482/118 "2005-09-03T21:41:18Z")
[Ripple effect on midwest farmers](http://www.stopsoybeanrust.com/viewStory.asp?StoryID=527): > [@](#): > > “Corn is the real story in terms of agricultural impact,” said Good. “Upwards of 35 million bushels of corn are exported from the United States each week, most going out of the Gulf. That trade has come to a screeching halt. And this will have reverberations all the way up the river system.” > > Because there is no place for the corn to go, farmers who are seeking cash bids for their corn up and down the rivers system that feeds the Port of New Orleans, find themselves with “just awful prices,” said Good. “Cash bids have just collapsed. Nobody wants to buy corn they can’t ship and sell.” > > Many Illinois corn producers are facing a double-whammy > > “The areas in our state that were hardest hit by the drought–from Peoria on north–are the same ones that rely heavily upon the Illinois and Mississippi rivers to sell their corn,” said Good. “Their corn was damaged by a drought and now their harvest faces low prices because the shipping system is disrupted.” [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/new-orleans-just-how-bad-a-disaster-is-this/319482.md?page=5)